Being married to a 12 year old.....

[Pinkpeter]

Regular but name changed.

This is my second marriage. First was short and I'll advised, no kids. His second marriage too. He has three kids from previous marriage and a relationship before marriage. We have two kids together, 8 and 5.
I am generally quite unhappy. I am very conscious that I don't want another failed marriage but conscious that we have done marriage guidance twice but we still keep on having issues.

His good points: he works hard at work, does overtime, very involved with his other kids and fought for all the contact he has, which is standard now, every other weekend and half the hols. Lots of issues there, but they would be deal able with if we got on better. Lots of the issues there were probably caused by our very argumentative marriage and how he treats me in front of the kids.
He takes the kids out, parks etc, he pays all the bills, apart from food and clothes, shoes, birthdays etc, I pay all those. He moans I don't pay enough but I earn less than a quarter than him.
He used to be funny, kind, loving and pull his weight and be clean.
Bad points: he often shouts at the kids in a very aggressive manner. He can't cope when they are running around just being kids, he has a hobby that dominates a lot of his time and keeps him glued to the PC. He is often unkind, shouty, and makes jokes at my expense . If I do this back, he can't deal with it but thinks as long as he finds something it is ok to hurt my feelings or take the piss out of me.
He has put on a lot of weight and often smells, so much the living room stinks. If I say nicely, please can you have a bath, he makes such a fuss and is offended. He belches constantly, big loud belching, I mean, several every minute. I have asked him to stop but he just ignores me. His default reply to anything I say or ask is in a nasty tone or sarcastic. He speaks to me like dirt a lot of the time, even first thing in the morning when I can't have done anything to upset him. If I do upset him, he can sulk for days and won't speak. Then when he is ready, he can't discuss anything and I am expected to just get on and forget about it and never discuss anything. A big bad point...he never accepts he has done anything wrong. He always has a reason, an excuse, but he never accepts responsibility for anything. The house often has a bad atmosphere when he is around. He shouts at the kids, is unnecessarily mean to them, will not implement any discipline techniques, just shouting. They are not bad kids at all, quite well behaved but naughty sometimes, like all kids.
This morning I couldn't understand why the milk had been decanted into a glass in the fridge. I am never allowed to sleep past 8am or he will come into my bedroom, (we sleep apart as he snores and twitches terribly, plus sometimes he smells) . I ask him why and he said I didn't need to know. Very hypocritical as I have to answer any question he asks me. I then find out he took the bottle to the bedroom so he could wee in at night! And when I ask why, he says so he doesn't wake up our son !!!
I am utterly disgusted with this. He goes to the loo often in the night and I have said he should go to the doctors but he refuses. I just can't believe how disgusting this is and how he thinks it is acceptable behaviour. I already have to deal with his 12 year old sense of humour, typical tits, arse, fanny jokes.
I don't know what to do or what I want to happen. As he never takes responsibility , he never admits anything is his fault. I don't want to break up our family , I want him to just grow up and act like a man. I don't want to be married to a 12 year old, as I tell him frequently. I want adult conversation, he seems incapable of it at home, but can at work. He just gets home, and turns into a 12 year old. He has a responsible job, think accountant etc.

any suggestions cos I don't want to break up our family.

[Namechanger2015]

Well aid saythatagain

Pink we are all here to support you when and if you feel ready to do the right thing, only you can know when this best is.

I know we are all anonymous voices online, but we are real people, I am anyway, don't know about the others. Many of us have lived through this as well, and I have come out of the other side.

There is a nicer, kinder world out there, waiting for you, when you are ready.

Wishing you lots of strength and luck. Please do keep posting. x

[sleeponeday]

OP, I would google Sunk Costs Fallacy - also known as "throwing good love after bad".

You're like a gambling addict. You can't walk away from him because to do so would be to admit to yourself that all the time and effort and all you have tolerated and put up with wasn't for anything. There will be no happy ending. But you see, you're wrong - the happy ending, sometimes, is to be free and able to move past a bad time, created by a bad relationship, caused by a bad partner.

And he is harming your children. Whichever way you slice it.

[sleeponeday]

Greed, though, that you need to be ready and able to make that break and it is hard. And that if you can't now, you may be able to later, and that it's okay to find this hard, and to need ongoing and continued support here.

[Momagain1]

I am another that escaped a wanker. It wont be easy but you can too.

[KatharineClifton]

Isn't he going to continue harming the DC when he gets shared custody and there is no barrier there to his harm?

[KatharineClifton]

And there are new rules wrt being self-employed and tax credits as a lone parent. Making it very difficult or impossible.

[HowLongIsTooLong]

Just to add, Pink, that I have been there too - waiting for change. Waited for years, discussed things with ex ad nauseum (like talking to a brick wall), suggested couple therapy, but he would not come. I finally gave up. But I don´t agree with everyone here that all this is going on because he does not want to change - like he is consciously or deliberately holding back the change you need. It may be he just can´t - he really can´t. And once you see that then perhaps it will be easier to decide to leave him. Thinking he can/may change can give you some scraps of hope, as well as wearing you out for nothing! Understanding that he just has not got it in him, and this is how your life is going to be if you stay, may help you make a clearer decision. You are nostalgic for an earlier time, well perhaps then both he and you were different people. Also, perhaps you had not got to know aspects of each other properly. Just take a cold look at where you are now and think about this being your life for the next 20 years. And whether you are willing to accept this. Good luck.

[Pinkpeter]

Howlingistoolong, thank you, that is something to think about. We did get married quickly, after less than a year, and I was just too desperate to have a husband I propably wasn't as fussy as I should have been and there were red flags all over the shop but I didn't want to see them.
I think he cannot change, and that is my real problem.

We are currently not speaking as we had a new dishwasher the other week. I had to read the instructions and figure out how to use it, he wants me to give him a demonstration as he cant be bothered to read them and is kicking off big time. I am being unhelpful I know, but have said if there were no instructions or if you actually needed help, i would help you. But because it is just because you cannot be arsed to read them, and are making such an argument out of me not helping him when all he has got to do is pick up a little book and read it, we are at stale mate. I have to pick up his slack cos he can't be arsed to do loads of things propably, I am just fed up of having to do more, cos he can't be bothered.

[DavidTennantsBeard]

This is my life too. I can't leave DH as one of our kids is seriously ill with mental health problems. I had a brief affair which made me realise life doesn't have to be like this. I feel imprisoned in this marriage

[FantasticButtocks]

That thing about the DCs loving him... It is because they love him that his behaviour towards them matters so much. Because they love their dad, they will accept all of this as normal. If he was just some bloke they didn't love, his comments and behaviour wouldn't have as much impact on their well being. It is worse that the dad they love treats them and their mum like this. He has the love of his precious children and he treats it with casual disregard, sometimes cruelty, total disrespect.

Can you believe that living with him like this is unhealthy and detrimental to your dcs welfare? That living with a mother at the end of her tether isn't the best? That you having to put so much energy into trying to 'fix' this, is energy you could be using to have a wonderful, productive, fun life with your beautiful children? Don't waste their childhood, because you will regret it so much.

Life is too short to spend it fannying about waiting for it to get better. If you want it to be better for you and your dcs, then you have to take charge and make it so.

He is dragging you all down.

[OneFlewOverTheDodosNest]

I'd like to further what FantasticButtocks said about your children.

You look at your family and think you cannot leave because your DC love your "D"H so much - they constantly want to please him and laugh along with his jokes etc.

I don't think it's because they love him more than they love you - I think it's because they fear him, because they know from experience that if they don't act like Dad expects then he will turn on them, and call them names and make them the butt of the joke. So they will go along with it so they keep the smiley happy Daddy rather than the mean scary Daddy.

What may happen, as they grow up, is that they realise that they can deflect scary Daddy on to you - and they may decide that it's better for everyone to laugh at Mummy and call Mummy stupid and make her the butt of the jokes than risk bringing out scary Daddy. Or they try to protect you and bring the wrath down on themselves even more. Do either of these options sound like a happy choice to you, OP?

[PoppyField]

Am going to see how he is in the next few days/weeks. Now I know people think it is bad and wouldn't put up with it. I need to see what I won't put up with...

You didn't have to wait very long OP for the dishwasher to rear its ugly head. This is a prime example of 'what I won't put up with'. The dynamic that he has built around it i.e. engineering a situation where you are blamed for his incompetence or downright laziness, which is a right royal headfuck. He is really messing with you. And that sounds quite deliberate to me. He is making it your problem that he is too lazy to learn how to operate the dishwasher. (And you know not to fall for the idea of 'teaching' him how to do it, as he will sabotage and then delight in undermining you some more). Presumably his cunning plan is that he will never 'learn' how to operate the dishwasher, or how to load it or unload it. Handy!

This may seem a small problem in the great scheme of things, but in fact it is a perfect example of his headfuckery. Petty, gratuitous, infuriating and blaming. And it makes your day-to-day life a misery.

So, you've realised he cannot or won't change. The only thing you can do is change what you do OP - so, what can you do? Time for a plan.

[Pinkpeter]

He says that it is deliberate unkindness on my part not to show him how to work it....

[Pinkpeter]

Which it is, of course. But it is just one more thing he can't be arsed to do. But then I get the blame cos he can't be arsed....?

[404NotFound]

Surely by that logic it's deliberate unkindness of him not to show you how to use it?

Nobody gets a free pass to check out of being an adult FFS. Obv in a normal relationship tasks can be divvied up according to who hates doing them the least, but there's an element of reciprocity about it. I hate ironing and hoovering with a vicious passion, so over the years those tasks have mainly devolved to dh. In return I get to do the stuff that involves PITA forms and paperwork, which I don't enjoy doing either, but I don't mind as much as he does.

But refusing point blank to do normal tasks of adulthood is not negotiation, it's blackmail by learned helplessness.

[Pinkpeter]

I just think it is deliberate provoking of an argument. All he has to do is what I did...read the instructions. If I felt more kindly towards him, I would show him. But surely a Normal person would accept if their wife said, the instructions are there, just next to it. Have a look. Then they would do that. Not have a bit row about it? I don't know...

[404NotFound]

IT's not just about the instructions though, is it? He's making you responsible for his ability or inability to work the dishwasher. And you are annoyed because you know that's what he's doing.

In that context of course it's not normal. In another relationship where one of the partners struggled with dyslexia, or was just liable to get unreasonably irritated by instruction manuals it might be perfectly fine for one person to work out how to use the thing and then show their partner.

But in that example it wouldn't be being used as part of a bigger power struggle, whereas in your relationship that does seem to be what's happening - he refuses to take on for normal tasks of adult living and tries to manipulate you into either doing it for him, or showing him how to do it.

If it wasn't the instruction manual it would be something else.

[Pinkpeter]

Yes, but why does he do it?

[rumbleinthrjungle]

Why waste energy on trying to untangle the crazy? He does it because he wants to do it. It meets his needs.

I'm in awe that you don't pee yourself laughing at him, that to me says you're extremely kind! Ffs, you have to demo the dishwasher to him because he can't be arsed to read the booklet? And now he's having a paddy because you saying get a grip is mean? Is that before or after you peel him a grape and wipe his nose?

Send him back to his mum with a note: returned to sender. Or failure to launch.

[404NotFound]

Why does he do it? Because he's pulling your strings. It's a power struggle, he's letting you know you can't make him do anything he doesn't want to do. Which is normal for a 3yo, for an adult notsomuch.

[Pinkpeter]

But what can I say to him when he does these things?

[FilbertSnood]

pink you sound like you are desperately looking for a fix for this

I really really hope you find the willpower to leave

[Bonkerz]

Please try and get him to see a GP

My husband was diagnosed with diabetes a few years ago and his behaviour can be very similar if his levels are not correct. He becomes a different person. Horrid and grumpy and snappy. He gains weight, can't sleep, snores and urinates frequently.

I'm not saying this is the cause of his behaviour but it could Be a factor along with depression.

[PoppyField]

But what can I say to him when he does these things?

Say "I am not carrying you anymore. You need to behave like an adult and take some responsibililty for yourself. Your behaviour towards me is foul and unacceptable. If it doesn't change then I don't see our relationship surviving."

Advice to you: really, truly, don't try to work out the 'why' he does this. I know it is incredibly hard to understand why he is being so utterly shitty to you. There is a holy grail quality to the question - ie surely if you could work out why then there will be some sort of answer for you, but it doesn't work like that. Because, hey - when you are supposed to be his life partner, the person he promised to love forever - the man you thought was kind and decent could not possibly treat you with this level of cruelty and disrespect, could he? It is desperate and you want to find the answers. Unfortunately there is not much more than what lovely, wise rumbleinthrjungle says "It meets his needs". That is all you need to know.

It is horrible, but it really is ultimatum time and you have to be able to follow through.

His whole manner and attitude to you is abusive. You find it hurtful, not because you are over-sensitive or stupid, but because it is hurtful. What he is doing is designed to damage you, make you more vulnerable, make you more dependant. It is cruelty. And he thinks he has got your arm up your back because you are ultra-determined to make it work as this is your second marriage. He knows exactly which buttons to push. He is counting on you NEVER bailing out of this marriage, he is certain that you would put up with pretty much anything rather than 'fail' at this. He knows you are determined to make this work. All your strength and determination is working against you at this point OP, because he knows where your values lie.

I am so sorry. Emotional abusive partner happened to me. The man who I thought would love me forever turned into an abuser. I was the strong, determined woman who was going to create a happy, secure family life for my children if it killed me, and it nearly did. This is what they know about you. This is what my XH knew about me and he never thought I would end it. Even when he left, he thought he was in control. He was gobsmacked when I filed divorce papers a week later. He was outraged, but most of all I think he was surprised and shocked because he didn't ever think I would biff the dream of family life. My children were 3 and 2 at the time and I felt like pulling my own heart out of my chest, but I didn't miss him ONE BIT.

[Atenco]

My husband was diagnosed with diabetes a few years ago and his behaviour can be very similar if his levels are not correct. He becomes a different person. Horrid and grumpy and snappy. He gains weight, can't sleep, snores and urinates frequently

I must admit I did think at the beginning with the urinating and overweight that he might be diabetic. I should have said.