to wonder why so many women put up with so much shit...

[BoozeyTuesday]

...from men, post threads crying about how awful they're treated, discount the very good advice they're given to leave the bastard, disagree he is a bastard, make excuses and blame themselves, and stay with th. cunt anyway. What's the point in posting in the first place if you're just going to ignore what everyone says?!

This probably isn't the forum for me to post in.

If you're looking for other posters to slate women who are in abusive relationships and need support rather than blame, then, no, it's probably not a great place for you, and thank goodness for that.

On the other hand, you could try answering some of the questions that other posters have asked you. Perhaps that would help you 'direct' your anger?

You should be angry at the people who are the abusers not the abused.
I think you are being goady and not very helpful.

many years ago I was an emotionally abused mess spending a couple months lurking on relationship threads gave me strength and made me realise I had to get away.
I even posted a thread that had lots of ltb but it still took almost a year before I did ltb.
People gain something from seeking advice and support even if they dont take immediate action they are taki g steps.

Because they aren't financial self-sufficient
Because they are being threatened and intimidated
Because they have low self esteem
Because they are scared to break up the family
Because their families or friends scare them into thinking they won't be ok on their own
Because for millenia women have been conditioned into thinking they have no intrinsic value other than that which is bestowed upon them by their partner

Just for starters....

Shall I go on?

Very easy to give someone advice when it doesn't impact on you at all. Rather different to take it when emotions are involved, your life probably turned upside down and in many cases of abusive relationships your self esteem is fucked.

I would hazard a guess that lots of good advice is taken on board and possibly it's acted on at a later date.

Yes it can be frustrating reading some of the threads when someone is being treated appallingly and stays in the relationship. But it's their life and their choice just like it's your choice to post a thread asking why some women put up with shit from men instead of why some men treat women like shit.

[Confused]

LTB is not a single act, it's a process. It takes much longer for some than for others. Everyone needs a starting point, and for many that starting point is gaining validation from others that this is actually what's happening, it's not all in your head like he says it is, actually it's him that is the problem.

Whinging on a forum can actually be pretty valuable.

When I read the thread title, I thought to myself 'Good question!' I've wondered the same thing myself many times.

Why do so many women put up with so much shit?

So I clicked on the thread enthusiastically, but unfortunately it was downhill from there and they are all right Boozey - your OP is indeed 'goady victim blaming' as one poster succinctly described it.

By all means ask the question but then why go on the attack? What exactly is the point of this thread other than a rant?

If you want to open up a debate as to why women put up with so much shit, that could be a very interesting discussion, but then going on to say 'what's the point in posting in the first place if you are going to ignore all the advice you are given' just shuts any discussion down immediately and comes across as goady and confrontational.

If you want a serious exchange of views as to why women put up with so much shit, you could have one. I can think of plenty of respondents on here who would ensure a lively and informed debate. And hopefully some of those women who are currently 'putting up with so much shit' as it were, might also join in and give their perspective as to why they currently do (put up with the shit) - logistical, emotional, family factors, financial factors, self esteem issues, and so on.

But going on the ranty attack in the way you have, ensures that those very women who could best answer your question, will avoid it like the plague.

I haven't seen your thread FreeSpirited but would like to wish you all the best.

I would like to think the OP would read your moving, well written post and accept she hasn't gone about asking her question in the right way.

Because they have their confidence knocked out of them very slowly. In the end they probably feel they deserve what they get as they have no self esteem left. They might not think they are worthy of happiness because the bastard has spent years making them feel that way, doing it so slowly at first they don't even realise what is happening.

They might be gaslighted, they might actually feel they are crazy and the problem is actually them. As the poster said so well above, it can leave you know knowing what is real anymore.

They are scared they might get beat up.

Lack of money, friends, outside support, child care etc.

Role models.. not understanding what a healthy relationship even is.

They might be scared they will get custody of the children.

That's a few reasons why my mum stayed as long as she did (except the custody one)

Please aim your anger at the people who deserve it. The abusers. The victims don't deserve it.

I too clicked on and thought the same as Fontella

I have read some threads and know some of the reasons why, but thought I'd learn more, if only to help a friend one day.

But the way you have worded your OP and seem to have no empathy for those who have/are going through something similar to what you have, is absolutely shitty.

I'm sure those going through dv reading your thread will be glad you got your life together, so how about being nice, showing some support and maybe helping somebody with kind words and advice.

Good response Fontella.

And I return the compliment FreeSpirited even though your well thought out, eloquent and emotive response to the OP's question, contradicts what I said about the very people who find themselves in the 'putting up with shit' category would avoid this thread because of its confrontational start.

You have proved me wrong. but I do think there are others who wouldn't venture into a thread like this, which is a shame, because it is is a very valid and pertinent question and one, I've certainly thought myself, reading some of the threads on here.

I wouldn't put up with that shit .. so why do some women put up with it?

Then I look back to where I was 10 years ago and the shit I did actually put up with was certainly on a par with (and in some cases worse) than the shit I read about on here.

I'm just 10 years further down the line is all. Older, wiser, and with the benefit of hindsight.

Because, OP, women live in a patriarchy which is stacked against them from the start, by definition. Thus, many women lack the tools (be these practical or emotional) to leave a bastard when they find one.
Rather than thinking "why aren't women doing x,y,z", perhaps rather think, "what do my sisters need to do to make themselves safe, and what can I do to equip them with the tools to enable this".
Your post isn't wrong in its essential uneasiness ("why are women having to live through this?"). But it's wrong in terms of whose door the blame is laid at. And you must know this,

"I haven't found any resources. I got pregnant by a violent abusive wanker and have raised my nine year old alone since birth. I cut off his dad eight years ago for being a cunt."

The OP may have anger issues because she has been a victim of abuse. Maybe she is struggling? I hope she comes back to talk to us.

My ex used to hold my 14 month old son up in his arms and say 'Look at her, your mother is mad, she's fucking mad.'

A baby. That's all my son was. He didn't have a clue what was going on ... but the fucker I had made a child with, was holding him up and going ... look at her, she's mad, she's nuts. etc. etc.

I fucking hated him with every single sinew, nerve, vein, skin, bone, of me. But my son was 6 years old when I finally escaped.

My question is why so many men treat their partners as badly as they possibly can!!

Why would they want a relationship that is based on fear, duty, manipulation. Yes, they enjoy the privileges of being an abuser, never having to do any housework or childcare and being the boss and making the decisions, having somebody to vent their petty frustrations on to, and I can understand that those are 'perks', but isn't it unfathomable, that so many men want a hostage not a partner. Lot love and respect but fear and 'respect'.

It scares me how common these men are.

I've talked with Freespirited, and I think she will recognise me now, but my x had another trick, he made me feel I owed it to him to give him another chance because he wasn't 'all bad'. he was actually but he argued that I wasn't perfect either, so therefore, the conclusion always came back to the same point, that I owed it to him to stay with him. That if he was miserable it was MY fault. it was always a court case and I could never win. He also had the closing argument.

Fontella, nightmare so glad that's behind you.

My relationship felt a lot like being on trial for 8 years.

My kids know what I'm like. Not because of anything I ever said but because of who I am and what I did.

I'm the woman who brought them up. Every single day through schools, college, holidays, hobbies ... since I left the fucker and they don't need me telling them that, because they lived it.

I've never, ever badmouthed him to them (luckily they inherited my brains because he was as thick as shit - not being spiteful, cruel or bitter, just honest) and son is at Uni, daughter about to go off and be cabin crew for a major airline (and that scares the shit out of me, but a whole other thread).

But the point I'm making is that I'm as cynical, tough, hard-headed and pragmatic as they come, but I was still ground down to nothing by a pathetic, thick, bigoted, misogynist, bullying arsehole of epic proportions and it still took me the best part of 5 years to escape.

If I'd had mumsnet back then and if I'd told my story, I know there would have been a universal barrage of LTB.

But would I have LTB? How easy or even possible would it have been to do that? Would I have made excuses, doubted myself .. you fucking bet I would. Would I have mitigated what he was doing to me? Without a doubt. Would people have got annoyed, angry and pissed off with me for not taking their advice to just up and LTB?

100% guaranteed!

Actually, I don't find your question difficult to answer.

They wave for help because they are drowning.

You point out the bridge.

So are they swimming?

No.

That's why. They are asking for help.

But help can't be imposed nor are words just enough. Just because the bridge is there, doesn't mean they know how to swim.

It takes an enormous amount of courage to leave. Because it's not just 'LTB'. They are in deep water, but the only way out is the bridge.

Are they swimming? No. Can they see the bridge? Yes.

They don't know how to swim to it.

That's why.

Swimming is a life skill. Some have it. Others never got taught it. Others learnt it later in life.

Glad you learnt to swim. I was a water babe from a young age. I know people who can't swim.

That's why it's not difficult for me to understand that I can point out a bridge.

And I can, best I can, teach people, how to swim.

But no one can learn much when they are drowning.

Fontella :(

I had a boyfriend once who was a total pain. I kept moaning to friends what to do. And of course the answer was always the same. But I always asked hoping to get a different answer. But in the end people usually do see the light.

i think it was my thread that pushed boozey over the edge!!

now i won't use my current situation here as some might go oh not another one. but i want to respond in hopefully a generic and simplified manner. I do think everyone before me has pointed it out so clearly already though.

I'll usethis example. much more simple than 'relationship' complexity. i remember reading a thread where someone came on and wanted to share their divine inspiration on how they lost weight and suddenly had seen the light on how they had had an addictive and bad diet prior to that. It sounded a little holier than thou and it knocked many noses out of joint. I suppose some felt jealous, talked down to or that it touched a nerve in that we all know how to eat well and exercise and live a healthy life it isn't rocket science. But unfortunately we all have different habits/bodies/addictions and lifestyles. I have struggled in the past after my child to regain my figure. I knew what i had to do. i had a busy career and life and made excuses. Hated that others had dicipline that i didn't. I knew what to do. stop eating crap and exercise. But i was always too tired or had an excuse. I had nobody else to blame. i could have read every diet book going but until i actually grabbed the bull by the horns and did something well i'd keep moaning and resent others who could do it.
In a relationship there are even more things to consider to get healthy again. some women just can't, financially or emotionally.
i tothe outside have a great figure now, own house, own career, balanced and healthy child. But i struggle at times in a relationship to know aibu or am i doing the right thing, is it that simple, will i regret.
So ease up on others on when they finally make the decision.
you mention you were in an abusive relationship yourself, you left, fair play to you, but i doubt it was an immediate decision. Try not to be so superior now looking at others cos nobody is perfect.