adult daughter of narcissistic mother - help establishing rules for measured contact please.

[djrmrcbhyvf]

We have little choice but to retain some contact as she lives next door - big mistake I realise now but at least I have finally realised that she is/was a narcissistic parent. She is a single parent so no father.

I would like some ideas of formulating boundaries/rules so she does not keep demanding attention , "popping over" the minute I have got back from work and also protecting the dc - they are age 12 & 13 so able to have a lot of input into the rules we finally agree; dd will not spend any time with he but ds let's her 'infantilise' him (again only just realised this is what she is doing, what was acceptable as an infant is no longer so for a teenager) so need to put a stop to that.

Experiences on dealing with narcissistic mother and of introducing clear boundaries would be much appreciated.

No keys for starters. If the door is solid, get a spyhole. If it's part glazed, fit a curtain.

Ration visiting time. 30 minutes max, no visits on consecutive days. The DC are never to let her in in your absence.

Health scares: the favourite is undefined chest pains, closely followed by cancer. If it's the first (which may be accompanied by histrionic and very careful falls), call an ambulance. Or good rib breaking CPR. Cancer: you want to see the diagnosis. A mate used to keep his on the fridge.

Read the Protection from Harassment Act and the CPS Legal Guidance for stalking and harassment. It may not come to it; conversely you might realise that she's actually committing the offence already.

Practice your "no".

Good luck and courage.

Wow! Excellent advice.

"I would like some ideas of formulating boundaries/rules so she does not keep demanding attention , "popping over" the minute I have got back from work and also protecting the dc - they are age 12 & 13"

It is not possible to have a relationship with a narcissist and you may well find that boundaries you care to set her will be completely ignored. Its also very hard to formulate boundaries anyway when you have yourself been trained by her your entire life to serve her so maintaining any boundary may become very challenging for you to actually keep up.

Honestly I would move and go no contact. Being next door to her is way too close (and perhaps was engineered by her as well). If moving is really not an option keep her at all costs away from your home; simple boundaries like no key for her would be a start. Do not let her in and instruct your children not to let nanny in either. I would also read up on CPS guidelines re harassment and do not hesitate to ever get the police involved.

Also do watch out for any previously unknown health crises from her to bring you back into line/control you.

Protect your DC by not letting your mother have any contact whatsoever with them, particularly your son as she has already started on him. Same goes for you, ultimately no contact may be the way to go here. Narcissists tend to either over value or under value the relationship with the grandchildren and can often favour one over the other. She could well make one of your children the golden child whilst the other remains the scapegoat. Do not let that happen!!!. She was and remains a poor parent to you and narcissists in particular make for being deplorably bad grandparent figures. You probably only allowed her to have a relationship with them in the first place out of some hope on your part that she would behave better this time around despite your own knowledge to the contrary.

I would also post on the "well we took you to Stately Homes" thread on these pages and read the daughters of narcissistic mothers website.

Listen to the advice above.

Move.

It really IS that simple. There ISNT an alternative.

How bad is she? Is she irritating and a bit over demanding, or a completely self-absorbed distructive narcissist? Does sound like the former rather than the latter, in which case do what Disgrace says - although moving house might be much easier!

Move house. You will never be able to relax until there's physical distance between you.

Move house. I'm not being flippant; trying to set boundaries for measured contact with a narcissist is like trying to allow an alcoholic to drink a measured amount.

She will not respect your boundaries. You can't change her; you can only change yourself.

So if you aren't going to move, you need to set rules for YOU. Don't bother making rules that need her cooperation. Decide how often you will open the door to her, and if you will open the door without her phoning to ask first.

I really think you need to move though.

I tried setting boundaries with my DM. It was like trying to put a fire out by waving at it.

Hmmm, been there and bought the t-shirt. We are now no contact after she slagged me, my DH and basically my life off to my brother. Apparently I am a thief, a liar, stupid, a lazy cow, a disappointment, a totally crap mother and Dh is a useless, grabby oik and I've had her entire life's savings. It was the culmination of a loooong period of shit from her. Had psychotherapy and CBT and the therapist said he felt she almost certainly suffered from some form of narcissistic personality disorder.
Mine followed me across the world and did one better than next door, she used health scares to manipulte me into living with her.
If yours is really a narc personality then really there is no managing her. You need to move and have very low or no contact.
If she's not too bad then you need boundaries, rationing time, no keys, be unavailable, don't share personal info with her and be on your toes for health sccares. But all that is really fucking tiring and draining.
Sympathies, it's shit having a parent like this, like they leech the life out of you.
xx

I tried setting boundaries with my DM. It was like trying to put a fire out by waving at it.

Brilliant analogy. Mine's reaction to boundaries is:
a) try the health scare
b) go pathetic and claim "depression"
c) go totally batshit nuclear (hers involved emigrating without a forwarding address this last time, a great relief)

Oh god yes, the health scare. It's more low-level with mine though. If I was upset about something she'd have flu. When I said my three-hour surgery had gone fine and she was the only person who hadn't asked if I was okay, she started telling me she had low blood pressure.

Also, enlisting siblings to act as flying monkeys.

...hers involved emigrating without a forwarding address this last time, ...

Result!

cozie apart from the odd tentacle of madness reaching out to me via one or two batshit crazy woe is me e mails it has been wonderfully peaceful.

Thanks all some great help here. Moving is really going to be a last resort - I am hoping boundaries may force her to move first.
We have had the health scares altho to be fair she did have a heart attack 15years ago and she has had breast cancer.
But the latest is balance problems with undiagnosable cause so she needs constant help.
Peppermint sounds just like my mother - whatever I may have she has something worse!
Good my dh is a "useless parasite"!
Absolutely right being next door was definitely engineered by her. She has always followed us but been a few minutes away but this time it kind of happened that she is next door.
My brother is basically no contact. He obviously saw the light about her long ago.
She is the worst kind - it is no coincidence that I have had 2 suicide attempts and now am a mental health inpatient since she moved in!
Dh is 'mister laid back' and is so used to her it's a bit like water off a ducks back and he really has no clue how I feel. When I said I wanted to put up a fence so she cannot see into our garden he doesn't want one as he wants the garden to 'look nice'!
Will draw up rules for us and see how it goes.
Thanks for all the advice it really does help to know I am not alone

it is no coincidence that I have had 2 suicide attempts and now am a mental health inpatient since she moved in

I'd say that LAST RESORT ship has firmly docked, wouldn't you?

She has driven you to suicide? enough already - MOVE!

You won't get anywhere with boundaries. please see this. Nothing you ever say/do/ask/implore/beg will EVER make a dent in what she WANTS to do TO YOU.

Your Mr Laid Back will be planning a funeral if he doesn't wake up and see how serious this situation is.

You NEED to change the situation. even then she won't go quietly, she will kick up a fuss and I'm concerned you may not have the brute mental strength needed to withstand the onslaught.

MOVE HOUSE ASAP please. EVen if you have to rent yours and rent somewhere else, DO IT!

She is the worst kind - it is no coincidence that I have had 2 suicide attempts and now am a mental health inpatient since she moved in!

Moving is really going to be a last resort

You are at last resort.

If it's been this bad, you need to get away. someone that has had this toxic an effect can never truly be ok for you. The damage that goes so deep that you want to die is deep indeed and the causes of it will always remain mentally dangerous ... Even if they apologised unreservedly and tried to make amends.

You need to move. Sorry. trying to pick up a useless husband will make it harder but between the two of them you are likely to go down if you don't.

You need to move house before Mr Laid Back is planning your funeral. The time for putting boundaries in place re her has long since past and also your mother would ignore those anyway.

It sounds as if your DH has mentally opted out of the whole thing - a sort of 'Not My Problem' attitude. Out of interest, does he happen to slope off somewhere if she comes round and thus leave everything to you?

Moving may seem too hard for you right now but I think you have to at least think seriously about it - as Meerka said, you are at last resort now - from the sound of your situation.

'She is the worst kind - it is no coincidence that I have had 2 suicide attempts and now am a mental health inpatient since she moved in! '

That is horrendous OP. It doesn't get much worse than that.

I really do not say this lightly, but your only option is to move house. I hate when people suggest that like its no big deal and an easy solution to everything but I honestly don't see what choice you have. Your health and sanity are at stake. It's unlikely she would respect any boundaries you put in place for her anyway.

Seriously - time to take control and prioritise yourself.

Thank you all. Will look on right move ...

Fate? Have just found the perfect property on Rightmove. Spooky or what.
Now all I have to do is persuade dh and sell ours ...

Gosh OP, I don't believe in fate but that is quite something! Get yourselves round there for a viewing asap and good luck!

djr if you have made two suicide attempts and been an in patient in a mental health unit, move with or without your deadweight of a husband.

I suspect in the future you're going to have to look at your marriage, but that's assuming you have a future. It's very good that you're trying to put boundaries in place not because they will work but because it shows you're still fighting to save yourself.

there's a helluva lot better life out there than being chained to an uncaring husband and driven into severe mental distress by a life-sapping mother.

er - i might have been a bit harsh. Sorry. But your situation kind of touched me.

I really hope you can break out of this awful situation and can move and ensure that your mother cannot chase you.

I think the "useless parasite" was what the narc mother had called the DH, not OP's opinion, surely? In the same way that my DM called my DH a number of things during narc rages but that certainly aren't true.

Agree

Move with or without the dh. He has to see this is going to kill you if you don't get out!