I want to set proper boundaries for the people in my life, tell me how!

[twoandahalftimesthree]

I have a history of EA from my older sister which has had a simple effect through all relationships throughout my life. Four years ago I finally realised what was going on and I have made great progress especially in my relationship with her, but also with dh.
However, I still really struggle in some areas, e.g. at work with colleagues, even with those that are much more junior than me. I know they're taking advantage of me, but I can't seem to say 'thats not acceptable' to them. I get very angry and frustrated with them and then with myself. It also happens in other parts of my life, i need a fix of assertiveness but I often have absolutely no idea how to deal with the situation, no idea what words to use... I need a coach!

Before you agree to do something pause. Think do I want to do this. Is this right for me. Practise saying: no that doesn't work me. Or that is not a priority for me right now. You are in charge of your actions .

If you feel the need, a first step towards what murder says is to have the stock answer 'I need to check on that' or 'let me give it some thought' - or "I'm not sure I can do that/whether that would work for me' when someone is asking you something you either don't want to do or aren't sure about. Then go back and just say - 'no' or 'I can't help this time' or 'it'snot possible' - no explanation required and try not to apologise about it! Then build up to saying no directly when you know they are putting you out in a way you will end up resenting. If you don't value your time and effort and demonstrate this, no one else will. The more you can do this the easier it will become and you will feel sooo much better for it!

If you always do what you've always done, you will always get what you've always got.

You can't change other's behaviour but you can change how you react to it.

great Oprah article

Similar situation; funnily enough I learned a lot from "How to talk so kids will listen" book.
I practiced that with DC and found myself using similar scripts with work colleagues and tricky sister.

I agree with murder to take a deep breath and pause when I start conversation with the difficult person.

And the last thing that I find useful (inside my own head only )is to picture high castle walls around me....so all of the barbs, sly remarks, the questions to hook me into an argument, all bounced off the walls....

I do sometimes manage to get in a 'let me get back to you' before I say yes, but then usually I just don't know what to do next. Then the ball is in my court and I have to admit that many times people just assume I've said yes (even though I haven't) and I feel even more cross with myself!
I think, 'that doesn't work for me' could be a much better phrase as it is basically a no- but easier to say and hear.
One of my big problems tends to be that when I do assert myself the people around me are unsettled by it and so they over react in a subconscious effort to get me to behave in my usual way. They usually get totally over emotional, turn on the tears or get angry, and then I feel powerless again.
I know it's up to me to change my behaviour and I have made a lot of changes, it's just that I feel I'm slipping back a bit now and need to get on track before it gets any worse.

They usually get totally over emotional, turn on the tears or get angry, and then I feel powerless again.

It's hard to start being assertive with people who have previously assumed you are a doormat.

Are you able to look into private counselling? Some therapists and counsellors offer sliding scale fees. You could look on it as an investment - working on your assertiveness now will reap rewards in terms of pay-rises and promotions later :)

Has your sister always been like this? Are your parents around? Any other siblings?

my sister trained me to think that ever asking something of somebody or not doing as I was asked was selfish (and this was the worst possible thing you could be). I know now that was just a ploy so she could be totally demanding of our parents attention and I would get none, but of course, it is very hard to shake off that conditioning that you have to do everything to make other people's lives nice and not demand anything yourself.
dh and I have just had a few days away and I've realised that I have not even been to one of the places or done one of the things I wanted to do. This is the norm for me though, not even realising until it's too late to assert myself.

Would it help to think about that fact that doing something for someone else and resenting it isn't being kind and generous at all - that you aren't really being the selfless, genuine person you surely are?

sleepwhenidie, I'm not sure if that would help- then I would just internally berate myself even more than I already do! The Oprah article is great but i'm not sure I understand this bit "What cured me was understanding the principle of intention. In his book The Seat of the Soul, Gary Zukav says, "Every action, thought and feeling is motivated by an intention, and that intention is a cause that exists as one with an effect. If we participate in the cause, it is not possible for us not to participate in the effect. In this most profound way, we are held responsible for our every action, thought and feeling, which is to say, for our every intention."
I guess I'm not cured cos I don't understand the principle of intention??

pocketsaviour, no other siblings, parents still around and I have a great relationship with them both. That is probably part of the issue, I have always had an awful lot in common with my parents and my sister just hasn't, so I guess I've become more and more of a 'threat' as we've got older.

I thought it might work as a kind of 'brake' before you agree to something an 'Am I being genuine here?' pause....but different things work for different people.

With the intention thing - in a similar way to the above, I understand it as 'what is my intention when I say yes?' Am I doing it because I genuinely want to help or make someone else feel good? If you are, then the feeling you experience afterwards mirrors that - it feels good to help others with an open heart. But if you are giving begrudgingly, then that leaves you with a bad taste in your mouth, a resentment - so you participate in the manner in which you give your time or effort and the thoughts behind it. Similarly, if your intention is to be true, first and foremost to yourself, when you say 'no' to people asking for something you don't want to give, your self esteem, your sense of self, will be strengthened because you didn't betray it. Does that make any sense?

And wrt to the shocked responses around you - they will get used to it faster than you think if you stay consistent .

That is really helpful, I think the question 'what is my intention when i say yes?' is a really useful one for me. I am sure my self esteem would be strengthened by saying no- I'll be delighted with myself when i can do it without stress.
I do have a big problem staying consistent, I am swayed by everybody's potential judgement of me, even people who really don't matter in my life, and find myself behaving in very different ways according to whose standards I am holding myself to- consistency lies in identifying and sticking to my own standards.

I am swayed by everybody's potential judgement of me

So do you think that people like and appreciate you more than others because you're a pushover?

Exactly right .

When you are feel you are being swayed, remember it is your fear that is pushing you to acquiesce. You need to 'feel the fear and do it anyway' - the first few times are the hardest. Ask yourself what your fear is trying to achieve, bearing in mind it is inside you and on your side - picture it as the little girl you, trying to keep you safe and loved because you are always so 'good' - think of the process as calming that little girl and showing her that it is in fact quite safe to say no sometimes. She will get quieter and quieter the more the sky doesn't fall in when you set boundaries .

Hang on, though - if you've been conditioned since the year dot in a particular way it's going to take a l-o-n-g time to unlearn it.

So give yourself a break! Therapists talk about 'turning around an ocean liner' - which takes a long time to turn, it isn't immediate.

i find the boundary model helpful of a house, with a fence around the outside, with a gate in the fence. No one comes through that gate without my permission. it is my property and my garden and my gate; i can let whomever i choose through the gate, i can bar whomever i choose from entering through the gate - it is entirely my choice and I am free to choose without justifying my choice.

Practise makes perfect op. you can't expect to negotiate this easily - it won't be easy but keep plugging away at it and give yourself permission to be damaged in this area, don't expect too much from yourself, it's going to take time xx

x post joy - my 'exactly right' was to your last sentence two

And turning on the tears/getting angry is just more manipulation. You will find that people run through the entire display to get what they want. Observe from a distance, knowing they're not going to get it.

A good book about boundaries is called, well, Boundaries by Dr Henry Cloud. The author is Christian but I don't think that intrudes too much and it is a very well regarded book in the therapeutic community.

I think if people know you say yes, they will ask, if theres a 50/50 chance they will offer a return favour ..if its a no, they wont ask.

Boundaries book

Don't know if I've linked well as this says 'miniature books' (?) but further down the page I have linked is the copy I have, the one with the illustration of a pencil drawing a line up the middle of the cover.

Btw I think enforcing boundaries is a lifetime's work when our boundaries were trashed, nonexistent, because of primary abuse. By that I mean eg that I have to keep on it, sometimes I realise I've slipped back, even though I'm long in the tooth with it, have been working on boundaries a long time - like you, trashed/nonexistent boundaries in childhood.

You may also find that as you flex your boundaries muscles you can over egg it, be quite tough, rigid, to begin with. No matter, it'll even out in the end - let yourself be rigid about it, knowing you're learning from scratch. Better theyre too tight than too loose, I say.

Agree with springdaffs.

When you start learning about boundaries, you'll be too tough sometimes...but that's OK and reasonable people will respect that.

Unreasonable people will shout and weep and sulk and try to "logic" you out of your position, whether your boundary setting is perfectly reasonable/too hard.

Stay firm.

It is far far easier to relax a boundary that you have set, after you've thought about it.....than it is to re-assert a boundary that has been breached.

If people shout or turn on tears at work, don't feel you need to fix it.

Just stand up, say 'I'll give you a few minutes to sort yourself out. Come and talk to me when you've calmed down.'

Then leave them to it.

If they push it, remind them they are in a professional situation.

What are they, toddlers? Nobody should behave like that at work.

We are trying to set boundaries with various family members and I am finding it useful to always, always discuss things with DH before agreeing to anything from certain people. If I feel panicked into agreeing to a non urgent request immediately that is a sign that they are pushing boundaries. So we use holding phrases as suggested above to make space for us to discuss.

Also when seeing someone who has a habit of pushing boundaries we discuss in advance how we intend the meeting to go and make a list if absolute non negotiables, e.g. 'they must leave by 6pm', 'we will not talk about this subject', then plan how we will say no if they push on those issues, and at what stage we will just leave if they keep pushing. Knowing that I have some non negotiables actually makes me feel more assertive generally, previously I felt that I was passive to their wants.