Can't even have a conversation!

[GoldNumbers]

I have been with my DP for 4 years. He works away my. Monday-Friday every week. He came home today and I asked how his week had gone he told me, the conversation lasted about 20 min. I don't really understand but I listen.

I then started talking about my day, it wasn't that interesting to be fair while I was talking he had his phone infront of his face but I thought he was listening, but then he put a video on and started watching that. I asked him to stop that and he did and put his phone down and I continued chatting. I look at him and he's not even looking at me his eyes are on the football on the TV. So I just stopped talking. He didn't even notice. . It's like this constantly! We barely see eachother yet he just couldn't give a shit.

Dear lord, PP's observations of women preferring to talk about their "interactions" and "relationships", whereas men prefer current events, politics etc ....god forbid it ever be witnessed, on whatever planet mini is from, a group of women dissecting cameron's latest debacle ??

You're not stupid. When you have children with someone there's always that nagging voice in your head saying 'we should really try to keep the family together'. If you split up it'll probably be tough in various ways. So you're constantly having to weigh up whether it's bad enough to call it a day or not. That's not stupidity, it's pretty natural.

Oh dear OP, no that's not normal. I'm so shocked that he went out drinking the on the same day you gave birth to his child
Was he like that with your first child too? Did he want children or do you think he went along with it because you wanted them? I just can't believe someone would father a child and be SO uninterested
Maybe I've been lucky but most of the men I know are not at all as Mini describes. Most of them are human beings with respect and love for their partners and children!

at minis post! Well how many decades could that set us back ?!

Gold, in an ideal world he would understand that relationships change due to babies and changing roles and opportunities. He should show an interest because he loves you. If he really understood and appreciated the work and effort you make with his children, and the effort you make for him, he would listen even if you discussed the plot to eastenders and coronation street twenty times back-to-back. But think about it...modern age, women earn, fast computers, social networking, never having to wait for anything, fast food, online porn, easy hook-ups...people are literally lazy, self-absorbed, wanting fast and lazy comfort, entertainment without effort, the list continues. That is the really real world, we all have the attention span of a nat, that is another reason why people don't listen. And it is also the reason why the advice is always to leave, find a better replacement. Its easier, people are expendable, we can trade them in when its tough, or boring or both.

But think about it...modern age, women earn, fast computers, social networking, never having to wait for anything, fast food, online porn, easy hook-ups...people are literally lazy, self-absorbed, wanting fast and lazy comfort, entertainment without effort, the list continues.

Why da fuck is "women earn" top of that negative list? Are you on glue?

The rubbish just keeps coming doesn't it?! The advice is not always to leave. I would advise someone having relationship problems to try talking about it and finding ways to improve things. But the OP has tried this and is being ignored. She said her partner doesn't care about her feelings. IMO that is an unsalvageable situation (sorry OP) and the best course of action for the sake of the OP's self respect and happiness is to leave the bastard.
People only post in relationships when there's a problem they can't solve. That's why they are often advised to end it. People in healthy relationships who can discuss and work through issues with their partners don't post on MN relatinship boards do they?!

No, women earn, I am making the point that many men expect that women earn, that is all. I don't think that women should be respected just for what they earn, but many men now expect that we do everything, literally everything. We are respected for our jobs. First question when someone meets new person "What do you do?" they are not asking for a bloody list of household chores yo did that day!

FFS PP. Even if you read back at this thread you'll find the first thing I suggested was to have an honest 'more in sorrow than in anger' conversation rather than 'LTB'. The OP appears to have had enough, however. Let's support her shall we?

This is the real world. And in the real world real women like the OP do not have to endure sharing a home with a man who can't be bothered to give them the time of day, let them down in a crisis, and have the attention span of a gnat (it has a 'g'). It's not that people are expendable, it's that no one should be expected to tolerate poor behaviour.

I know, it's bloody awful when I think about it he has shown how little respect he has for me. Yes he wanted children, our first happened on the first month of trying and he was so happy. Second I'd missed a few pills and knew there was a possibility but we wasn't trying. I sat down and discussed with him the possibility of an abortion but no he told me that I knew he always wanted another child, he did want another but he always said 'not yet'. but thinking about it it could be that I was ready to split with him why he said that. It wasn't just his desicion though I had an early scan as I had no clue about my cycles as I was still on the pill this was while I was still undecided as our relationship was breaking down but that relief when the sonogropher told me she could see a heartbeat I knew I was going to have her.

Yes he was like this with our first, he only really started engaging with our first once he got abit older about 2 years.

Yes minx I see the attention span point you are making and it's true. But if he really valued me and the kids his attention should be all on us. It isn't, it never has been. He would happily sit for hours watching the TV so he has enough attention span to watch the TV but not to listen to me/hold the baby for 20 minutes

"many men expect that women earn"

And many women expect that men earn... what's your point? Few of us are born independently wealthy. In the real world, we're mostly expected to earn a living.

I hope you're not saying that a young woman looking after two kids has nothing much interesting to say to a man so she shouldn't expect him to engage in conversation but should find other women to chit-chat about domestic drudgery with instead.....

Has he always been so detached, Gold, or was he more attentive before? I am wondering whether he is just emotionally detached and that's how he is and always will be, or whether there might be some explanation or trigger. Other than being utterly lazy, rude and irresponsible. I still can't get over wanting children and then completely ignoring them. What are his parents like? Does he have good relationships with his family? Maybe he had a weird upbringing. It's so strange.

I'm not playing Devil's advocate but just wondering, do you think he does nothing because you 'allow' him (albeit subconsciously) to do nothing?

What I mean is because he works away in the week, you have to rack on yourself, like a single mum and be responsible for everything pretty much. Then once he is back at weekends, you say you continue to do it anyway.....because you do.

What about seeing if he responds to you asking him to help you? Could he make dinner tomorrow night or hold the baby whilst you have a relaxing bath etc?

I was in a pretty much similar position to you a few yrs ago, where DH was working away on the week and then treating the house like a B & B at weekends......he never supported me in discipline the children because he felt guilty telling them off after not being there all week.

Is he happy at work? Is he depressed? Not really engaging with a new baby is sad but perhaps he feels left out or not capable caring for her needs?

I would chat to him as best as you can.....in small doses so he isn't overwhelmed and doesn't think you're nagging him. Put the onus on you....say you are finding it a bit tricky at the moment with the new baby etc and would love for him to help you out a bit. Acknowledge that he's tired after working away....make him feel special and needed and tell him you miss time together etc. I'm not saying beg him for affection but by you showing the positive behaviour may make him mirror it.

Anotheremma, he has always been like this really. I mean before kids we would chat a bit more, cu

Forgot to say.....many men would, if they could, sit and stare at tv all weekend.....
Also, you say he was detached from your first child as a baby too.....some men just aren't baby people but do seem to come into their own once they reach toddler-dom.

I know your LO is only 9 weeks but in a bit, when you can leave her for a couple of hours, book yourselves a nice meal out or movie etc....to just be Mr and Mrs instead of mummy and daddy.

No we are not all born independently wealthy. But most of us start out single earning a living, independent adults with interesting lives (interesting here is capable of earning, living independently) have interests, hobbies, friendship groups, plans, aspirations and dreams. We meet, we flirt, we laugh, we win people over with our charm and wit, and we have sex. Then family life becomes a reality. When men earn and have lives within the public domain and women find themselves relegated to just the home, a split takes place. Read Plato, read anything even! and the gap in everyday lived experience, realms of responsibility, interests and goals can seem like a vast chasm. His goal: get to work on time, talk to rob in accounts to claim back expenses, get tickets for Saturdays match, her goals: get breakfast down toddler before baby wakes up, get out of the house without having a nervous breakdown and take cat to vet. Unless all of these responsibilities and roles are shared it can leave a couple seemingly living in very different realities with not much empathy, understanding or respect between them and even less to talk about and no desire to engage.

The only other way in which it can work is if both people can make the leap of imagination and fully try to comprehend the others experiences, sacrifices, and feelings. More and more this doesn't happen because women are expected to work, but also to do everything else (because men have never comprehended how much work women do) and also because we live in a consumer society where we have no attention span and no sense of time/space. Everything and everyone is expendable and replaceable, or at least we can substitute with any number of modern distractions such as tv, media and porn.

I'm sorry OP, if talking doesn't work, its because he is losing respect. Can you gain it back? Maybe but only if you can get his attention. Up to you, but with two very young children it might be worth trying at least in the short term. Long term, well its not great and no I wouldn't put up with it. Instead of waiting to be noticed, leave the kids with him and make a plan to do something exciting without him. He might notice you are missing!

OMG please ignore Mini!!

If he's always been like that I'd say he's unlikely to change. If he was more involved and attentive before, I'd say it could be something else, like severe depression, or an affair, causing him to withdraw from you. But it sounds like he is just very closed emotionally. Maybe he's on the autistic spectrum or has a personality disorder or was just brought up that way.

If you could actually get him to talk to you (which might require unplugging the TV, taking away his phone, and leaving the kids with their grandparents!) then I would ask him some big questions. Are you happy? Do you love me? Do you love the children? Do you want to spend time with us? What is your idea of a happy family? And I would explain that him being so withdrawn is not normal and is making you very unhappy. But you've probably tried that already?

Sorry my phone is really really playing up I keep replying but it keeps deleting.

I have tried leaving him downstairs with the kids and having a bath but he comes and puts the eldest in and it's not really 'me time' I suggested booking a weekend away in May but he didn't acknowledge me.

I asked him all those questions last May and he told him how sorry he was, he made all these promises he told me how sorry he was. He cried and begged me to stay and he has not changed in the slightest.

Oh and btw he loves his job when he does communicate he will talk about his job. He really does like it it can't be that. Sorry im not typing all at once my phone keeps deleting it! So annoying.

Well in that case he can f* off. Sorry.

Looking after the kids so you can have a relaxing bath... And then PUTTING ONE OF THE KIDS IN THE BATH WITH YOU?!

Jesus, dad/partner of the year award, that one.

He is useless. Get rid. Sorry OP but I think you know this. You deserve better.

I know Another. I know what I have to do it makes me sad but the whole relationship has just gone to shit. I think writing it all out has really helped.

Thankyou all

So far these are the things we have learned he enjoys:

1. Working
2. Talking about work
3. Watching TV
4. Going out drinking

None of those include doing anything with you or your kids. Out of interest, when he's away at work during the week, does he contact you? Call, text, email? Or does he just ignore you all week and then turn up on a Friday night expecting meals to be served and washing to be done while he watches TV all weekend? Sorry OP. Getting angry on your behalf.

Actually while most of what Mini is saying makes me want to scream her last suggestion does hold some merit.
Maybe you should tell him you are going out and he is in charge of the DC for the day and just do it. Leave him a bag of changing things and some formula and let him see what your day is like. He won't have time to sit and stare at the TV then!
It will at least provoke him into a discussion about your life.