Definitely going to court, scared

[attheendofmyteatheragain]

Just before christmas, I had a thread on here about my nasty exp who was constantly telling me he would take me to court if i did not agree to x, y or z and would torment me with threats of cutting off child maintenance

anyway I got so many fantastic replies and a lot of really sound advice which gave me the courage to say to him, fine..take me to court (possibly one of the best feelings ever)

So there is now finally a court date next week, but I'm a little nervous as communication is absolutely not my strong point, and I definitely need a few pointers re what to leave out/convey when it is my chance to speak..

A bit of backstory.....exp ended our (albeit short) relationship when I was five months pregnant (by text) a few days before we were due to move in together and informed me that I would need to find alternative accomodation. Turns out he was frequently seeing his ex girlfriend who happened to be his next door neighbour which he had of course kept quiet about

he was pretty nasty about the whole thing and I was naturally in bits so we had very little contact until a few months later when we met up to discuss what was going to happen once the little one was born. He sat across from me and told me I was a parasite as he now had to pay child maintenance for many years he then went on to say that he WILL be having DS every single weekend and that if that doesn't happen he will take me to court to get 50/50 custody. I was 24years old at the time, naive and feeling very vulnerable. he was 33 and I suppose, desperately trying to scare me

I walked away from him in disbelief, then got a call five minutes later from him to say that if I dare go to csa for cm payments, he would quit his job, and make his (undeclared) rental properties work as his main income to ensure I never receive a single penny from him. he is quite the charmer

the next few months were pretty crap to say the least but at least I had learned I had an incredibly lucky escape

So DS was born and he took paternity leave and would turn up at my doorstep each day at 9am waiting to be let in and wouldn't leave til 7pm usually it was horrific as I couldn't stand the sight of him yet wasn't able to stand up to him. thank you for reading this far

I moved back to my hometown to be close to my family and friends which is a 45/50 minute drive away. then started back work when DS was 9months old. I was worried about money at that point so after a few months I decided to work at weekends as that was an option for me and I did'nt feel like paying large amounts of money for childcare was

This worked out very well for exp as my place of work at the time was very close to his home, so I would drop DS every fri and then collect him every Sunday at 5pm after work.

I hated the job I was in, the cost of travelling and the fact I never got any weekend time with DS so when a much better job came up locally, which was better paid etc I was delighted to get it, exp was not impressed however.

I then moved in with my partner and that week exp told me he would not pay any cm unless I continued to travel up weekly to collect DS, on top of that he would take me to court to get 50/50 so he wont have to pay cm ever again He didnt pay much anyway but not having it would cripple me unfortunately so I felt my hands were tied and although I hated myself for doing this I agreed. I often work a Sunday and travelling up to the city was tiring, expensive and after having worked midweek also was the absolute last thing I wanted to be doing, and felt I had no quality of life whatsoever

I tried to discuss with him a few times about me having DS the occasional weekend but was met with, 'fine, I'll have hom sun-fri then', I was that or 'I'll have him thu and fri in that case but I won't be travelling to take him to preschool, it's not school so he wont miss much and it's not important anyway

then christmas happened, we decided he would have DS next year for xmas eve and day, but as it got closer to christmas he changed his mind and tried to dictate that he was having him no matter what, and if I dont agree he'll take me to court Cue a mumsnet thread by myself and I was able to say NO! of course it was all bluff, and after christmas he never did try to take me to court but he would not agree to me having my own son on a weekend and I felt very strongly that I shouldn't have to do the travelling to collect so told him what i wanted, eow plus a night through the week and if he wasnt happy with that he could contact a solicitor. thanks again for getting this far and I can now get to the point.....

This is a guy who also told me he didnt want to pay cm until DS was 6months old as 'you're breastfeeding, he doesn't cost you anything' has dicated terms of contact and travel since I was pregnant! and now wants 50/50 custody or at the very least, every single weekend with DS. please tell me this wont go his way?

all the things he said to me which I mentioned upthread, most have to do with cm. as the court hearing is about contact, would I be stopped if I say this? he also has been clever enough to never have written it in an email, the only evidence I have is a text message from him on boxing day telling me he was unemployed so going to cms would be pointless, but this was not true, he was and is employed and is earning huge amounts of money (which I cant understand why he grudges paying cm)

he is very much a bully who needs absolute control at all times and this is unfortunately all just about exerting control over me rather than meeting DSs best interests. but I'm dreading court, he is verrry intelligent and good at communicating well. he will be a pro in that court room and I fear I will be emotional and say the wrong thing.

there is history of severe mental health conditions in his family, should I bring this up? who is likely to be asked what first? any help would be really appreciated

he told e he had hmo licences for all seven of his flats which I didn't believe so sobbed him in anyway

good for you ;) That'll learn him. Folk like that think they are above the law. About time he found out the hard way I reckon.

If you don't believe him about income report him to hmrc? At least make his life difficult, like he's making yours! What is he like with your child?

but can OP print her posts off and submit them? I hope so.

Don't give any indication whatsoever to you ex or to the court that you are discussing this on the Internet.

If it's possible to get included in any court order clear rules stating who is responsible for dropping off and collecting your DS at handovers and how/when this is to happen that would be helpful.

I informed hmrc as well as his council (apparently c.tax would be in his name on all properties) so I'm hoping they'll catch up with him

he's good with DS and sites on him, I'll give him that. DS I think has no idea of the friction between us, he is nearly four and hope it stays that way. he enjoys going to his dads the only thing is I don't think he disciplines him as much as he needs to

dotes* not sites

Not sure how old your dc is now, but the approach you need to take is that you are now sorting things out for the next few years at least, and making an arrangement that will be appropriate for your dc as he starts school.

The court won't be interested in the history of how awful your ex is or that he's only doing this to maintain control. Unless it's so bad that he's a danger to the child, it's just not seen as relevant. It won't be interested in child maintenance either - worst case scenario, you could be seen as being difficult about contact because you're bitter about money.

You have to be very pragmatic about it - what in your view is the best possible arrangement for your dc, and how can you persuade the court that this is the best outcome?

Presumably you don't want a 50:50 arrangement, so you'll need to base your argument on the fact that that won't be feasible for your dc once he is at school, given the distance. You should get some weekend time with your dc, so I think you've a good shot at getting every second weekend. However, you are also quite likely to be looking at a 50:50 division of holidays.

Don't go in thinking that the court will be working out who's right and who's wrong. It's just about getting a piece of paper which sets out a schedule that everyone can more or less live with.

Completely agree with bibliography, finances and contact are completely separate.Your solicitor or barrister will speak on your behalf, certainly in the initial hearing. Sometimes a solicitor may drop in, dad pays maintenance and the only dispute is contact or they could allude to a separate process for CM but the courts deal with contact only since that is the point of the hearing. It is relevant that with a low income you will be concerned about petrol costs so I think a judge maybe sympatic to that.I don't believe you have to fear court, judges are looking for the child's interests.

Has mediation been suggested, courts like to see that parties have made efforts to settle ahead of time.It's often a futile process but shows the parties were willing to try for a resolution.

When does your son start school as stability is needed and would your ex be able to see him mid week and get him to school? What's your thoughts on holidays? This tends to be shared 50/50, with alternative Xmas.

We went through court with dh's ex and it was the best decision as unreasonable people can't be reasoned with so a judge making an order is positive.It will saves the debate and conflict which will be an improvement.

I think you have shown to be willing with contact however school is a game changer as 50/50 won't really work due to the distance - which isn't in your son's best interests.

The courts view contact and maintenance as seperate issues, so you must to.

As others have said, the only contact you have with this man should be written and contact CSA about maintenance.

The courts aren't interested in 'finding fault' with either parent but will look favorably on the party who appears the more reasonable. Counter his excessive demands (EOW, alternate drop or voluntary contribution to petrol costs) and they will listen.

This man is a bully and as such, will always be on the lookout for ways to intimidate. It is therefore imperative that you have strong boundaries and defend them when he inevitably tries to circumnavigate them.

He changed lawyers! Ha, yes, he didn't hear what he wanted to! Tell the judge he turned up at 9am till 7pm everyday without your consent. That is not acceptable. Tell the judge he bullies you. Keep a journal of all contact. Has he got other kids?

this advice is all fantastic and will help me so much, feeling more clear about what to say/not say now

he has no other kids no

I think you could mention, if asked why you wish to change the w/e arrangement, that you were working every w/e, as you received no cm, but you have sought out a job that enables you to spend more than a couple of hours an evening with your child. so that you can have time with him, with extended family & will be able to get him to sport, birthday parties etc as he will be in school.
Also that if XP wants to see his son he will need to share collect/drop off, as you can no longer afford to be his taxi service. as your new place of work is no longer close to him.
this way the court will get a picture of how it is.

I would try to reiterate that prior arrangements have not so much been agreed, but forced upon you as your ex is a controlling bully and intimidated you.

I would also look at stability of the child as he approaches school age, make sure you have adequate support in place around that.

Good luck.

Let's hope his gf has a kid soon to distract him!!!! Your boy is 4? So he will be starting school September, obviously local to you right? He lives 50 miles away? How is that going to work?

My job entails being in family courts a lot. My advice is;

Above all else make sure that the judge/magistrates know that the only thing you are concerned about is the welfare of your child.

Print everything out you can.

Cost out all transport etc.

Make a list of all the points you want to raise.

Draft out a contact timetable that you feel will be beneficial to all of you. Include all holidays, birthdays ( yours, sons and arseholes),

Get pick up and drop off places and times agreed in detail.

Do not under any circumstances get involved in arguments over who said what etc.

Write a concise, bullet point timeline of events and his demands.

Let your solicitor do most of the talking. If you have to talk, look at the judge, ignore arsehole and take it slowly and breathe. You will be fine, they know you are nervous and this try to keep family hearings as non threatening as possible.

When everything is agreed, stick to it no matter what. Communicate via e mail only and keep it all. Keep a diary of any comments or deviations he makes from the order. You can they him back to court, if necessary, for an enforcement order.

Good luck. You will be fine.

Mrs knows what's what! Take her advice.

Follow MrsMyrtleMarple advice an you will be fine.

Hi, wow I could have wrote your OP! I also split from Childs dad whilst pregnant.
My ex also wanted 50/50.. Here is our arrangement now:
On a four weekly cycle
Father has child
Week one

Fri evening 5pm to Sat evening 5pm
Week two
Fri evening 5pm to Sat evening 5pm
Week three
Fri evening 5pm to Sun evening 5pm
Week four
Thurs evening 5pm to Fri evening 5pm

I argued this was fairest as we both work fulltime so weekday evenings are not classed as quality time. This way, we both get one full weekend per month and two full weekend days per month.

The judge ruled this was fair. I also suggest you insist on a residency order being out in place, as my sons father decided to keep him at Christmas, and even though we had a contact order, it wasn't enough, and we had to get an emergency residency order at a substantial emotional and financial cost!
My ex is now a shirker who works cash in hand to avoid cm, lovely fellow.

Hope it works out for you in the end, 8 years on we still have our moments!

Taking some of the previous posts, this means that if you're in court moaning just for the sake of it will have, at best, a neutral effect, but if you moan (ie dispassionately state facts) about how you've been messed around with the specific purpose of justifying a request, say a residency order or how pick ups/drops off are specified, then that will probably be listened to more favourably by the court.

Courts are now being held to account on how long private cases are taking from filing to resolution. They are trying to cut down drastically on the number of times couples come to court for a decision to be made. Some people cannot reach an agreement about anything and come to court every time. This is no longer acceptable. They will be looking for you to work with each other as sensible, responsible parents, to put your child's needs first.

When you get to court it is highly likely that you will all be given time to come to an agreement between yourselves, with your solicitors help. You really need to try to make this work and co operate as much as is practicable. They will not be happy if you don't. The emphasis will be about planning for the future, not raking over old arguments.

They may also ask you if you have been/ insist that you go to a mediation session. This is quickly becoming compulsory.

If arsehole wants to bully and throw his weight around in court, he will do himself no good whatsoever.

If in the future he keeps dragging you back to court to get variations on everything you can ask the court for a Section 19 order. This is very rarely used, but if it is agreed it can stop him constantly coming back to court. He will have to get the leave of the court if he wants to file something.

Hey, let's hope he does just that. OP, give him enough rope to hang himself. I'm sure judges have seen many arseholes in their time and will see right through him!!!!!

Do not submit copies of anything from here. Anything you want the judge to read your ex must see as well. I also think it is unfair on people who have given you advice for their comments to be submitted to a court without their consent, even though this is a public forum.

In my experience, your solicitor does not come to court with you. I have always has to hire a barrister, which is expensive but they have, without exception, been very worthwhile. They do all the negotiating and speaking on your behalf.

Good luck, I hope you get what is best for your little boy.

I'm afraid I'm in the wrong country (France) so the procedure wont be exactly the same.

You are in court only to discuss the issue, nothing else. I'm not sure what the issue is exactly - is it custody or payments (or something else).

Rule 1 is everyone involved will appreciate you not wasting their time.

Make a time line, of what happened when, that is easy to follow, esp for the judge and your solicitor.
Keep everything concise. Use their time wisely.
List of behaviours with examples.
List of your income and expenditure, time spent travelling, and other information that seems pertinent.

Make a list of what you want ideally, and what you are prepared to accept. You keep the second list, show it to no-one.

You can write a statement and read it. At the very least use a list with bullet points. My solicitor gave me a single sentence to say, which I wrote down and learnt (and ended up not using)! "I am not trying to prevent him having access, but I must protect my children".

One last point when I leave court there is no doubt in anyones mind that I am terrified of my ex-husband. My advice to you would be to look as young as possible - there is a significant age gap.

Of course now having read the other posts, I want to add -

Whatever is decided now is (probably) going to hold until the end of primary school, so have a think about what is ok now and is that still going to be ok when he is 10.

You may not always be single, so be careful about effing up your life to much. DP and I are in a very blended family, and the various custody arrangements are a bloody headache.

The first hearing in court is about seeing what the issues are - if you can reach an agreement, great, if you can't then the court will decide what evidence it needs to make a decision - does it need a report from Cafcass, does it need statements from either of you etc, etc. I don't think you will be asked to say much, the Judge certainly won't want to be hearing evidence at this stage.

The fact that his family have mental health issues is only relevant if you think HE would be a risk to your child. The domestic and international law is about promoting a child's relationship with both parents unless it is not safe for the child to do so.

there is clear research now that overnight contacts for pre-school children away from their primary carer is not necessarily in their best interests, so I think any bluster about 50/50 care is just that - bluster. This is not about an exercise in mathematical precision, its about what is best for the child.