Help please - boyfriend cheated, not sure what to do next (long, sorry)

[abbaroony]

Hi everyone, I'm a long time lurker, but very rarely post.

I'm after some advice... here's the story (I'll try not to leave out any details that might be relevant):

I broke up with my ex boyfriend in April last year, after 2 years of trying to make a long distance relationship (London - Lake District) work, I realised that actually he just wasn't into me that much and i spent a lot of the time feeling let down and rejected.

Not long after, I met my current boyfriend. Things moved pretty quickly, he made me so happy, seemed to make so much more effort than my ex, and we spent our time having loads of fun together. A couple of months in, he went on a lads holiday to Croatia, at the same time that I was going to a festival. It was at this point that we had 'the chat' and said that we definitely wouldn't get with anyone else while we were away, because that we wanted to become 'official'. All good, or so I thought.

After he got back it was my birthday and he'd planned an amazing day full of surprises and generally made me feel really loved and special. I should say that although this was lovely, it definitely wasn't out of character because he's always doing really nice, thoughtful things for me.

Fast forward to now. His dad died after a short illness on Friday last week, this comes after his mum dying 2 years ago, leaving him and his brother (both in their mid twenties) without any family - no extended family whatsoever. Obviously this has been a really bloody difficult time.

I went round last night to cook them both dinner and just hang out watching tv etc. He told me that his ex had sent him a message asking if he could try and describe what it was like to be in a relationship with someone with depression (she suffers quite badly, and I think it's one of the main reasons they broke up) because she's trying to understand what she can to to try and make a relationship work (not with him, just in general) he said he'd replied with a nice but hopefully helpful answer and that she'd replied to say thanks.

Now this is the bit I feel guilty about. When I got home I remembered that he was still logged onto facebook on my laptop, so decided to read the messages. I'm not exactly sure why decided to do this, I suppose I wanted to see if he'd told me everything about the conversation. And also probably because I'm just really nosy.

I discovered that he'd deleted the messages, which instantly made me on high alert. I should point out that up until now I've never had any reason not to trust him, but am fairly insecure so do often worry about other girls, even though I'm pretty sure that I don't actually need to. I clicked on the 'other messages' bit which is where messages from people you aren't friends with go. There was an unread message from a girl, which was sent while he was on holiday last year. She said that she was really happy that she'd remembered his full name and had looked him up on Facebook as soon as he'd got home. Then another message the next day asking whether he'd got home ok. And then a final message saying that she can't believe that he'd blocked her from adding him as a friend. I felt sick, my instant reaction was that something must have happened for her to have sent messages like that (and for him to have blocked her friendship request).

I then spent the next couple of hours texting him about it. He told me that he walked her home after a party because she was really drunk. They'd got talking and kissed. He swears that nothing more happened and I believe him.

What do I do now? My head is completely spinning. It's making me doubt everything.

He was really apologetic said that he knows he should have told me at the time, but that honestly it meant nothing and that he knew that I'd probably just break up with him straight away if he'd told me (he's right). He said he knows there's nothing he can say that will make it any better, but that he knows that her being drunk wasn't an excuse and that he really hopes we can get past this because I mean so much to him. He also said that he is going to make a real effort with me because whilst things have still been great with us, I think we're both guilty of not making the same effort as we used to, and he knows that that upsets me.

Please help me work out what to do next..

I just don't know if I can trust him. He promises that he's not been with anyone else while we've been together and I believe him. But how can he have done that to me? Surely if you were in love with your girlfriend you wouldn't want to kiss anyone else, no matter how drunk you are?

(Really sorry this is so long, if you got to the end, well done! I just wanted to try and give the full picture)

To the people saying that you think it may have been more than a kiss, I know that I will probably never know, however I am pretty confident believing his account of what happened - not sure why to be honest, maybe just instinct. Twinklestein I'm under no illusions that he was walking her home out of the goodness of his heart, don't worry!

I agree that there's something not quite right about the messages between him and his ex, I think pompodd may have hit the nail on the head. I do want to talk to him about this, but now definitely isn't the right time, so I'll let that one lie for now.

Just to be clear, he was definitely drunk too, but her more so as far as I can gather. And yes, she must have asked him for his name. He says that he couldn't remember hers.

Fontella I think your advise resonates with me most, I really do think he is a decent bloke, who has done a twattish thing. I know that some people believe that by definition this makes him a twat, but although I would never ever cheat on someone I might lose judgement and do something stupid that I truly regret and I suppose that I think that wouldn't make me stupid, just that I'd done a stupid thing. If that makes sense?

It's hard to know at what point it crosses the line though isn't it.

Twinklestein what do you mean by 'You don't need to be an arsehole to cheat'? That no matter whether he's an arsehole or not, he still cheated? Or that anyone can cheat and it doesn't mean that they're an arsehole?

OP, I am sorry that you are feeling bad. If you don't mind me asking, how old are you? It's just that you sound quite young??

As other posters have said, I think you should be supporting your BF right now. He's clearly having a horrendous time and will need buckets of love and care to get through! It made me smile that you have agreed that you're both not making as much effort as you used to. Of course you're bloody not - you've had agonisingly difficult stuff to deal with instead!

I think I've noticed something else: am I right in saying that he lost his mum something around 2 years ago, which was also around the same time that you got together? And shortly after the time of this kiss that has upset you? Because here's the thing: chronic illness and death are an awful thing for him to go through. Grieving is a very long and complicated process and can bring up all kinds of strange emotions, many of which can put a real strain on relationships. People can be very flighty and emotional and they can do stupid things without really intending to. A drunken kiss, for instance. I'm not saying that this makes it OK to behave this way, but it is a significant mitigating factor.

Even without that, though, I also think a drunken kiss with someone else at the very start of a relationship isn't a huge deal. After 5 years of marriage, it would be. But not right at the beginning, talk or no talk. I understand that you feel betrayed by it, and I agree with you that it shouldn't have happened, but I wouldn't break his balls over it because (as I'm sure you're aware) after a few weeks, the commitment isn't really 'there' in the same way as it is now. It grows with trust and time. I would point to the fact that he has blocked this woman and refused to have anything to do with her since as a positive in his favour.

Generally, I think you sound painfully insecure about other women. I am not saying this as a criticism - there aren't many women I know who weren't insecure in their early 20s, myself very much included! - but I do think it's something you should try to be aware of and keep in check. The reason I bring it up is that you mention your reaction to the messages with his ex, and I think it provides an important context. If he knows that you have a tendency towards jealousy and insecurity, then he's far more likely to delete even innocent messages as a way of 'protecting' you from hurt. You can't therefore conclude that their absence 'means' anything significant. My DH used to delete all text messages from his ex at the start of our relationship because she was a bit of a green-eyed monster and it took some time to convince him that I wasn't going to go ballistic if he had contact with any woman other than myself, provided it was just as friends and not anything more!

One final word of caution: there are a lot of women on this forum who have been treated very badly by men and who are therefore understandably and justifiably suspicious of everything. However, life is complicated, emotions are complicated, and it's not always black-and-white. Good luck.

Kaykay Thank goodness for some reason on here.

Now isn't the best time to broach this unfortunately. However, I agree with the starting to detach.

Just to clarify. He deleted the messages between him and his ex? Red flags all over the place here.

I hope you manage to resolve things, OP.

I'm a man and have no axe to grind here. But I call bullshit on him not being able to remember her name. This is someone (at best) he had a drunken snog with. She knew his full name (so reasonable to assume he knew hers as well). She then followed up via Facebook - so he would have seen her name then as well. This is someone that would have been uppermost in his mind because (again, at best) he snogged her when he was supposed to be exclusive with you and then lied to you about it (by omission).

He remembers her name, alright. I'm sure of that.

I also can't quite envisage how both of them, drunk, having already got as far as a snog, managed to restrain themselves from going further. So I'm suspicious about that too. She clearly wanted to follow up afterwards and the messages (again going from what you've said here) sound a bit more invested and involved than would have been appropriate following just a drunken snog - asking if he got home ok, her shock at being blocked as a Facebook friend.

I clearly don't know what really happened, and am speculating widly. But I'd just be cautious given what you've said.

OP I mean you can be charming and fun and still be unfaithful...

You've had 2 questionable incidents in less than 9 months.

However lovely he seems his veracity is in doubt.

On hearing a similar story from a friend several years ago, my DH responded "I see, you needed to make sure your penis protected her vagina from all those other penises that might take advantage of her being drunk and vulnerable. How kind of you. I can't believe has dumped you." Ha ha ha.

Relationships need trust. If you can trust him the relationship can be ok. If you can't then it can't. It doesn't really matter if your mistrust is valid or not. How you feel is how you feel.

I don't think you can automatically assume that he followed her back to sleep with her. There are decent men in the world, and they will protect women.

Before people accuse me of being hopelessly naive, I have several male friends who are honourable in this way. Indeed, a man I didn't know once walked me back when I was in a very drunken state as a student. He afterwards became a great longterm friend. I know he wasn't in it to exploit me because I afterwards found out that he's gay! He just did it out of the goodness of his heart to make sure I was safe, even though he didn't know me.

Not all men are horrible.

Also OP - you say "I believe him it was just a kiss" and "I believe that he walked her home with good intent", and that is totally your call and up to you.

However, you might want to reflect on the fact that when he got back from holiday you totally believed him to have been faithful to you, and totally believed that he wasn't keeping anything from you. Even when he was outright lying to your face.

It's just something to bear in mind.

shovetheholly

They got together last April, his mother died two years ago, this drunken incident was before his father died.

I can't see how blocking the woman on FB is in 'his favour' he obviously didn't tell her he is in a relationship. He behaved as badly to her as he did to the OP.

There are a lot of women on this forum who are happily married and never had bad experiences with men. They're not easy to hoodwink though. I am in that category.

So his mum died 2 years ago, and they got together just under 1 year ago, shortly after which he went to Croatia and kissed this girl.

Is it crazy to say that he'd still be grieving through this period when this happened, and thus more liable to doing something stupid?

(I sound like I'm condoning his actions - I'm not. I'm just saying that a drunken kiss at the very start of a new relationship is categorically not the same thing as a one-night stand or, god forbid, an affair in the middle of a committed marriage. The betrayal is worlds different in scale).

Hang on, Holly! I certainly agree that there are honourable men out there. I like to think I'm one of them! I walked lots of female friends home in my youth (in circumstances where one, both and neither of us were drunk!). And I did it with no ulterior motive at all other than to make sure they got home sfely.

But the point here is that he DIDN'T behave honourably!! He kissed this girl when he'd agreed a few days earlier with the OP that they were exclusive with each other. Surely you can see the difference?

I don't think infidelity has much to do with grieving tbh. A faithful person grieves faithfully...

Bloody hell - I often walk women home with absolutely no expectations or intentions. It's just how I was brought up. I also routinely delete emails, messages, texts etc as soon as I have read them (unless I need to keep) the same as I do with voice messages, post, newspapers etc. I must be weird or guilty of something...

I volunteer as a grief counsellor with a local hospice, and you would be very surprised what grief does to people. I'm not going to share stories even anonymously, but sexual feelings can be all over the place after losing someone (and this can lead to huge amounts of guilt).

Pompodd - I absolutely agree that what he did was dishonourable. I just don't think it was THAT awful. On my Dishonourable Scale of 1-10, it's probably a 3, where a fullblown emotional and sexual affair in a committed marriage would be a 9!

I know exactly what impact grief can have, and what excuses people make. People who are inherently faithful manage to keep it in their pants.

Give the guy a break, he's just lost his dad!! You should be giving him every bit of support you can right now, not snooping on him and trying to catch him out. Poor guy. I don't know by he doesn't dump you to be honest, what a horrible thing to do to someone in such pain.

So take a hypothetical case where a woman's husband has just passed. They have been together 40-odd years. She is beyond devastated. A male friend comes over to comfort her, and they end up sleeping together. She is even more devastated and can't understand why she did it, and her grief is compounded by the fact she feels she's been unfaithful to her partner.

In your mind, is she 'inherently unfaithful'?

McFox, eh, you on the same thread?

OP, you now have mistrust which is a shame, you believe him because you want to, doesn't mean he is telling you the full story.

I am kinda changing my mind here now, as has been said, grieving doesn't turn you into a cheat does it, he's got form already and it's not been very long..........just be careful, he's now knocked off that pedestal, regardless of his loss.

Shove - the woman has been unfaithful, if she wants comfort sex she could try her own husband, a 40 year relationship is not relevant to the thread. Can we keep this on topic.

Sex with dead people really isn't the done thing Twinkle.

Twinklestein - I suggest you reread what I wrote. The woman's husband is dead.

My point - which is germane to the thread - is that for whatever reason you are being a judgy-pants.

Chipping - I just spat out my tea laughing!

I think most of us can see his explanations as probably bullshit, both with regard to the holiday incident and his messages with his ex. I just think now, this week, isn't the time to be interrogating him, he'll have a funeral to organise.

KayKay had it right. Leave for now, but detach and sort it out later.

Hahaha! I got so bored of your posts shove I couldn't be bothered to read it properly.

The bloke's dead, his wife is not unfaithful, for the love of God stop going on about it.