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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

That gut feeling... do I have a stray dog, a careless DH or both?

77 replies

WhatTheEel · 12/01/2015 11:08

DH works every other Saturday from 9-12. He's been doing this for years and is always home by 1pm for brunch. Lately...the past 3-4 months, he's been staying on a Saturday until about 4-5pm (they shut at 12). He is alone apart from his secretary. He has a newish secretary who, by all accounts is sassy, competent, smart, young. DH hardly talks about her but when he does, he paints a colourful, exciting picture. He's described her as a real character, fun, charismatic. Recently they had their work do. They always bring spouses. This is the first time ever I have not gone because all of our kids had stomach flu and I was just exhausted so I stayed home. Normally we go together, have a great time and are home by 11. This year, he rolled in at 1am. He seemed to have the best time ever! I asked him about the chats he had with everyone, how they were all doing, etc. I used to work there for several years so I know the majority of staff not only as DH's spouse but as their former colleague. When I mentioned the newish secretary he said he didn't speak to her all night and that she went off clubbing. Though later he added that the staff love her and his manager in particular thinks so highly of this secretary, she'll go places. I've been around this earth a while and tend not to feel insecure, but suddenly I do. Especially since this Saturday when he was at work again until 5 'doing a massive clear out'. He stays until 5 most Saturdays now even though he shuts at 12.

I was suprised to hear that the newish secretary was with him until about 4pm. He wanted our son to go in and help him clear out the office once he was finished with work at 12. We agreed DS would go up to the office but hadn't agreed on a time and because work is a bit of a journey and DS would be travelling on his own (he is 13). DH would meet him at a certain time and place and they'd walk back to the office. That was the idea. Well, DH turned off his phone and PC at 12:30. He answered none of my calls or emails to arrange things. I then left to take our younger child to a party. DS sat at home, waiting to hear from dad (and playing xBox... I doubt he was too upset). DH rang at 4:30 saying he had been so busy with his clear out, he just switched his phone and PC off and hadn't gotten my emails or messages trying to arrange a time and meeting point. He said his secretary was there keeping a weather eye open to see if DS would arrive. They were expecting him, he had said. But we hadn't arranged a time. And DS doesn't quite know the way to his office on his own. He knows this. However, I didn't question DH. I rang the office number which had a recording saying the office was open but no one picked up.

We rarely call/text each other at the best of times and whenever I do, his phone is always off. On Mondays he finishes at 4pm but is home about 10pm lately. I haven't suspected a thing. He's a busy man trying to keep a small office running. But historically, he's never stayed on so late and doesn't seem to complain about an increase in workload. Another thing, staff doesn't get over time, so I was puzzled as to why the secretary stayed beyond 12 on a Saturday.

Here's the thing. We. Don't. Have. Sex. We just don't. We blame it on the kids. We blame it on ourselves. We have a laugh and get on well in a buddy sort of way. But our intimacy has tanked in the last 18 months.

This could just be paranoia talking. I hope so. But I wonder if I should get a tail on him. God I do sound weird now. But I feel that niggling feeling. WWYD? Thanks for reading.

OP posts:
TheReluctantCountess · 12/01/2015 11:57

I'd be worried too, but it could be nothing. I would have been tempted to turn up to drop Ds off at the weekend.
Could there be a legitimate reason why you pop in this Saturday?

penguinsaresmall · 12/01/2015 11:58

BTW what stuck out for me is what you said about him finding 'booking sex' laughable. Do you mean he basically turned you down? That's not good Sad

gottachangethename1 · 12/01/2015 12:13

I agree with the turning up unannounced. Go on the pretext of 'we haven't seen much of each other lately-can I help with anything?'.

Quitelikely · 12/01/2015 12:23

If be suspicious too. Young girls these days love their mobiles and communication. Can you check his phone?

Quitelikely · 12/01/2015 12:23

Or check the phone bill?

FelicityGubbins · 12/01/2015 12:26

If it were me I would go to the office today, and loudly and publicly complain to the staff about their slovenly ways, and how you dont appreciate how your husband has to stay late so often to clear up their mess/ finish their work, and you fully expect it to not ever happen again

WhatsGoingOnEh · 12/01/2015 12:33

I don't understand the thread title at all. ??

I'd go there on Saturday afternoon, bring lunch, offer to help.

WhatsGoingOnEh · 12/01/2015 12:34

(Whilst snooping, obviously.)

WhatTheEel · 12/01/2015 12:52

I must reply more soundly to such helpful posts. Thank you! My title... well, sorry you're right. It's a bit wobbly. I think I don't understand my title either. I guess I am wondering is he just careless- turning off all forms of communication, working late... or is he straying.

Thank you all... more insight: I have never met the secretary. I have checked the phone and email but he is open with both. We share our Outlook and our mails sync to one account. I don't have the passwords to gmail or any other accounts and they are not synced with outlook. We have our own server and the outlook emails come in on those. Nothing at all suspicious. Just work stuff. Same with his phone. Clean clean. He's an IT guy... he was a wiz before it became a thing to be an IT wiz, so I don't hold out much hope of finding out anything through his phone or our joint email. I think a Saturday pop in is the best option. Though I almost don't want to, silly me.

He is nice to me. Not a bad man. He's just not really present. He's not really interested in the kids or in me. He is very nice to all of us. But when he's home, he's not with us, if that makes sense. I haven't really suspected anything but have noticed he's working later and later and when he's here, he's sort of doing his own thing, which is fine. We're both a bit prone to doing our own thing. I just get involved with the kids.

You're all ever so helpful and patient.

OP posts:
JohnFarleysRuskin · 12/01/2015 12:54

So Monday is another day he finishes at 4 but doesn't get home til quite late?

Would you feel comfortable going to the office?

I don't believe he will be there.

mix56 · 12/01/2015 13:19

sorry, it sound like he has a liaison, if not with secretary, someone else.
I'd drop by... or just ask him whats going on ?

WhatTheEel · 12/01/2015 14:03

Thank you all. It is very unlikely he will come clean. I've asked in the past few months if there's something he needs to tell me/talk to me about based on the fact that we have nothing going on, initmacy wise. We both use the kids a lot as an excuse. He just says he's tired, stressed, busy, not in the place. These can be legit reasons. He's been very nice to me so it hasn't been too much of a red flag. Though lately he's gone from being very sullen (throughout November and December) to quite chipper again when he's home. He seems much more relaxed lately and I thought this is great but also notice the very long hours. Usually long work hours make a person more tired and pressured. Still, I've been so happy to see that he is happier.

What he is not is interested in our kids at all. He loves them, chats to them, hugs them, but spends no time with them, never attends anything to do with the schools, doesn't look at reports. He's just not interested. I just put this down to work related stress and being a bloke. But I see my friends' husbands who are all a bit more 'there' for their families.

I did wonder if maybe he is paying for 'intimacy'. He was married before and did pay a handful of times in his last marriage. It wasn't a habit but it happened several times. I never thought it would be an issue in our marriage. Perhaps that's cocky of me. :-( But it did cross my mind this weekend because I thought, not only was he not contactable on Saturday, this has become a regular occurance in a way is used not to be. I appreciate so much all of the advice. You are all great and I thank you.

OP posts:
penguinsaresmall · 12/01/2015 14:19

op that doesn't sound at all good Sad.

Not sure how to ask this without coming across in a way I don't mean to - but were you aware of him seeing prostitutes in his last marriage before you married him?

Kind of irrelevant now the horse has bolted I suppose but I would struggle to trust somebody who was happy to do that in the first place.

Drumdrum60 · 12/01/2015 14:20

Sounds like something's going on with working late and no contact. I wouldn't bring it up with him but be determined to find out. Can you check his bank accounts? Look for large withdrawals from ATMs anything over 50 really.

Drumdrum60 · 12/01/2015 14:22

How can you be sure it wasn't a habit ? Men who do this hardly tell the truth.

penguinsaresmall · 12/01/2015 14:22

Sorry I realise that sounded a bit blunt...

Drumdrum60 · 12/01/2015 14:24
Sad
WhatTheEel · 12/01/2015 14:26

Hi Penguin and thanks for your much appreciated posts. It's a good and valid question you've asked. He told me quite a ways into our relationship. Although wew weren't yet married, we were in that beautifully flawless and open-hearted place...engaged to be married, together for quite some time. It was something he felt sad and guilty about and sort of used it as a justifiable reason to end his marriage. It wasn't why the marriage ended but to sound cliché it was a symptom as opposed to a reason. I wholeheartedly accepted this and valued his honesty. But the years go by and marriage is an imperfect journey and I suppose here, in this moment, I feel insecure and the niggles come out to play. I just wonder could a man fall back into old habits if we're not in the greatest place?

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grumbleina · 12/01/2015 14:31

Sounds dodgy to me. It might not be, but it sounds it. Plus - the gut feeling. That's the biggest sign I think. YOU think it's dodgy.

When you checked the phone, did you check from messages hidden under different (usually male) names?

You mentioned the email accounts - am I right that there is an account that you have access to and then other accounts that you don't? There are ways to access these accounts, but I feel like it's maybe better to look for proof elsewhere at this point as it's a bit of a trial and if there IS nothing going on it's quite an invasion of privacy...

I'd maybe do a bit of spying. Is there a way you could check whether he's at work, or even what he's doing there, in person, without him noticing?

Otherwise yes an unannounced visit or two.

But, more importantly - are you happy with the relationship? With his lack of involvement? With how he behaves towards you?

cailindana · 12/01/2015 15:06

Am I right in thinking he justified paying for sex with the fact that his marriage was failing? And you accepted that? It sounds like the same thing I happening again - I have no intimacy so I can legitimately fuck around.

HootyMcTooty · 12/01/2015 15:06

Oh dear. I was sitting on the fence until I read that he'd cheated on his last wife with prostitutes.

Aside from the fact that your DH is ok with the concept of women's bodies being a commodity that can be bought and sold, he clearly has in the past had a flexible attitude regarding fidelity.

What do you actually enjoy about your relationship, your trust is ebbing away, he shows little interest in your children and rejects your sexual advances?

If you want proof I'd drop into the office mid afternoon on Saturday, when you're confident the rest of the staff will have left.

kaykayred · 12/01/2015 15:14

What a minute.

So he was happy to use prostitutes in his last marriage, but the idea of setting aside a time for sex with you, his wife, is somehow fucking ludicrous?

Would it help it seem less ludicrous if you offered to take money from him after the fact? Hmm

Others have said this, but you need to go into the office unannounced on one of the days that he is "working late". Can you get in without alerting him? It sounds a bit creepy, but look, that's life and pretty understandable considering the circumstances. You'll soon get a good idea as to whether:

a) He is actually doing any work
b) Whether he is actually there or not
c) If he is shagging someone.

If you go and he isn't there, then when he gets home simply ask "how was work? How come you are so late home...again?" If he says "oh really busy" then ask "busy doing what? Paperwork? Filing? Accounts? What exactly is so important that it keeps you there so late on a weekend"

Let himself dig a hole then announce

That's funny, since I went to visit you at work today and you weren't there. Stayed there for a number of hours actually waiting for you so I could offer to help with your....."busy work load". So where were you really?"

If he says "oh I went out for a coffee/a meeting" then ask him "oh yea? What time?" obviously don't tell him what time you were there. If he was out for coffee then he clearly wasn't that fucking busy.

If he refuses to give you a straight answer, or accuses you of being crazy or whatever, look him dead in the eye and say "Give me one good reason not to divorce you here and now, considering I clearly can't trust a word you say".

That will throw him.

WhatTheEel · 12/01/2015 15:19

He keeps putting it down to the kids and work. I am often tired so I've kind of rolled with it and hoped that one day we'll get back on track with our intimacy. He puts a lot of it on me being tired and busy with the kids. But by the time he's home at 9:30-10 and I've fixed his dinner I am a bit out of steam. He's not very present, so in a way I've become kind of used to being a bit of white noise. That sounds worse than it is. He's very nice. He's just not here, on so many levels. And when he is home, we really are like ships passing in the night, in a friendly way. He just falls asleep on the sofa. Sometimes, I'm relieved. I sound awful and I feel guilty saying that. But I feel he's so interestd in his own world, one I'm not a part of anymore.

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WhatTheEel · 12/01/2015 15:21

Thank you [kaykayred].

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WhatTheEel · 12/01/2015 15:21

Oops I meant to make your name bold.Thank you all, truly!

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