"But we took you to stately homes!!!" - Survivors of Dysfunctional Families

[DontstepontheMomeRaths]

It's December 2014, and the Stately Home is still open to visitors.

Forerunning threads:
December 2007
March 2008
August 2008
February 2009
May 2009
January 2010
April 2010
August 2010
March 2011
November 2011
January 2012
November 2012
January 2013
March 2013
August 2013
December 2013
February 2014
April 2014
July 2014
October 2014

Welcome to the Stately Homes Thread.

This is a long running thread which was originally started up by 'pages' see original thread here (December 2007)

So this thread originates from that thread and has become a safe haven for Adult children of abusive families.

One thing you will never hear on this thread is that your abuse or experience was not that bad. You will never have your feelings minimised the way they were when you were a child, or now that you are an adult. To coin the phrase of a much respected past poster Ally90;

'Nobody can judge how sad your childhood made you, even if you wrote a novel on it, only you know that. I can well imagine any of us saying some of the seemingly trivial things our parents/ siblings did to us to many of our real life acquaintances and them not understanding why we were upset/ angry/ hurt etc. And that is why this thread is here. It's a safe place to vent our true feelings, validate our childhood/ lifetime experiences of being hurt/ angry etc by our parents behaviour and to get support for dealing with family in the here and now.'

Most new posters generally start off their posts by saying; but it wasn't that bad for me or my experience wasn't as awful as x,y or z's.

Some on here have been emotionally abused and/ or physically abused. Some are not sure what category (there doesn't have to be any) they fall into.

NONE of that matters. What matters is how 'YOU' felt growing up, how 'YOU' feel now and a chance to talk about how and why those childhood experiences and/ or current parental contact, has left you feeling damaged, falling apart from the inside out and stumbling around trying to find your sense of self-worth.

You might also find the following links and information useful, if you have come this far and are still not sure whether you belong here or not.

'Toxic Parents' by Susan Forward.

I started with this book and found it really useful.

Here are some excerpts:

"Once you get going, most toxic parents will counterattack. After all, if they had the capacity to listen, to hear, to be reasonable, to respect your feelings, and to promote your independence, they wouldn't be toxic parents. They will probably perceive your words as treacherous personal assaults. They will tend to fall back on the same tactics and defences that they have always used, only more so.

Remember, the important thing is not their reaction but your response. If you can stand fast in the face of your parents' fury, accusations, threats and guilt-peddling, you will experience your finest hour.

Here are some typical parental reactions to confrontation:

"It never happened". Parents who have used denial to avoid their own feelings of inadequacy or anxiety, will undoubtedly use it during confrontation, to promote their version of reality. They'll insist that your allegations never happened, or that you're exaggerating. They won't remember, or they will accuse you of lying.

YOUR RESPONSE: Just because you don't remember, doesn't mean it didn't happen".

"It was your fault." Toxic parents are almost never willing to accept responsibility for their destructive behaviour. Instead, they will blame you. They will say that you were bad, or that you were difficult. They will claim that they did the best that they could but that you always created problems for them. They will say that you drove them crazy. They will offer as proof, the fact that everybody in the family knew what a problem you were. They will offer up a laundry list of your alleged offences against them.

YOUR RESPONSE: "You can keep trying to make this my fault, but I'm not going to accept the responsibility for what you did to me, when I was a child".

"I said I was sorry what more do you want?" Some parents may acknowledge a few of the things that you say but be unwilling to do anything about it.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate your apology, but that is just a beginning. If you're truly sorry, you'll work through this with me, to make a better relationship."

"We did the best we could." Some parents will remind you of how tough they had it while you were growing up and how hard they struggled. They will say such things as "You'll never understand what I was going through," or "I did the best I could". This particular style of response will often stir up a lot of sympathy and compassion for your parents. This is understandable, but it makes it difficult for you to remain focused on what you need to say in your confrontation. The temptation is for you once again to put their needs ahead of your own. It is important that you be able to acknowledge their difficulties, without invalidating your own.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I understand that you had a hard time, and I'm sure that you didn't hurt me on purpose, but I need you to understand that the way you dealt with your problems really did hurt me"

"Look what we did for you." Many parents will attempt to counter your assertions by recalling the wonderful times you had as a child and the loving moments you and they shared. By focusing on the good things, they can avoid looking at the darker side of their behaviour. Parents will typically remind you of gifts they gave you, places they took you, sacrifices they made for you, and thoughtful things they did. They will say things like, "this is the thanks we get" or "nothing was ever enough for you."

YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate those things very much, but they didn't make up for ...."

"How can you do this to me?" Some parents act like martyrs. They'll collapse into tears, wring their hands, and express shock and disbelief at your "cruelty". They will act as if your confrontation has victimized them. They will accuse you of hurting them, or disappointing them. They will complain that they don't need this, they have enough problems. They will tell you that they are not strong enough or healthy enough to take this, that the heartache will kill them. Some of their sadness will, of course, be genuine. It is sad for parents to face their own shortcomings, to realise that they have caused their children significant pain. But their sadness can also be manipulative and controlling. It is their way of using guilt to try to make you back down from the confrontation.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I'm sorry you're upset. I'm sorry you're hurt. But I'm not willing to give up on this. I've been hurting for a long time, too."

Helpful Websites

Alice Miller

Personality Disorders definition

More helpful links:

Daughters of narcissistic mothers
Out of the FOG
You carry the cure in your own heart
Help for adult children of child abuse
Pete Walker

Some books:

Homecoming
Will I ever be good enough?
If you had controlling parents
When you and your mother can't be friends
Children of the self-absorbed
Recovery of your inner child

This final quote is from smithfield posting as therealsmithfield:

"I'm sure the other posters will be along shortly to add anything they feel I have left out. I personally don't claim to be sorted but I will say my head has become a helluva lot straighter since I started posting here. You will receive a lot of wisdom but above all else the insights and advice given will 'always' be delivered with warmth and support."

Hi charlie

It's totally up to the individual to tell or not tell the person that you're going NC, and the reasons. For some it can feel empowering and like you're closing the book; for others (like you) it could potentially feel like you're losing power.

My own view is that if you don't feel any relationship could ever be salvaged, then there's no point telling someone you're going NC/LC. I chose to tell my mum the reasons I needed a break because I still hold out some hope that she may be able to change her behaviours. It doesn't sound like that could ever be the case with your father.

My previous therapist said that people who had difficult relationships with their parents were often really thrown by their deaths.

Nice sweeping statement there Dealing with a parent's death is always going to be difficult. I think if you are already facing the facts of your abusive childhood through therapy and self-work, then you're minimising that possibility.

If you want to simply go low profile and avoid him as much as possible, then I don't think that's a problem unless it feels like a problem to you. You might change your mind down the line, but if you feel right now that this is the best solution, then you do what you feel is best.

You might want to have a stock library of phrases to hand such as "Oh the kids are fine, thanks. Tell me what you've been up to?" If your dad is as ego-centric as most abusers are, he will leap on this opportunity to spout forth bollocks while you glaze over, smile and nod, and review the week's shopping list in your head.

I'd like to participate on this thread please. I posted on relationships yesterday. My post is here but essentially I think I am about to tell my parents of the sexual abuse I suffered as a child at the hands of a sibling and a cousin.

I know people are busy so not expecting you to read the whole thing, just if you have time and are able to. Thank you.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/2310077-Dont-think-I-can-do-this-anymore-Think-I-need-to-go-NC?msgid=52625670#52625670

Hello AbsolutelyKnackered and welcome

I have read through your thread on the board. I'm so sorry you've had to put up with so much crap and been given fuck-all support by your useless parents.

Something that really resonated with me was that you said that you were afraid that if you told your mum what had happened, she might have a heart attack. That is what my dad told me when he was sexually abusing me... that if I told mummy she would have a heart attack and die.

It was a very effective way of silencing me with fear, and I hope that you can look at the little girl inside you and tell her that she does not have to be silent, that the truth doesn't cause people to have heart attacks. The truth sets you free.

I notice that you said you're waiting to see your counsellor again. You might want to consider waiting to send any communications to your parents until after you have seen her, so you can talk through the possible outcomes and be prepared and supported.

You could send a very quick email that just says "I'm putting mine and my families needs first at the moment and I don't want to be in contact with you. Please respect my wishes and don't contact me. I will contact you when I'm ready." You could then send a longer email when you feel more able - or you could do nothing at all.

I sent my mum a very long email telling her why I was going NC "for a break" - I did this because I still hope that we can rebuild our relationship if she gets help from a counsellor and truly changes her ways of riding roughshod over my boundaries. I wanted her to understand fully how much she had hurt me and let me down. I do still hope that one day we can have a relationship again. I fear that she will probably let me down, and that won't happen. But at least I've tried.

It doesn't sound like you think that can ever happen with your parents. In that case, pouring out your anger to them might not really have a point. A more passionless and factual mail might be called for. Or, again, you could choose not to send anything, and let them eat silence.

Whatever you do, be sure it's the right thing for YOU and your little family. I'm so glad you have a supportive DH by the way, it's so important.

AbsolutelyKnackered welcome to Stately Homes. I read your other thread and the letter you are thinking of sending. I think it's a great letter, and I'm sure it will help just writing it, even if you never sent it (I'm not saying don't send it, btw).
I think you will need a lot of support if/when you send it, they may well go ballistic, call you a liar and so on. I think you need to plan out how you will deal with them if/when you send it. It can be an idea to send it and then batten down the hatches for a while: have a supportive DH or friend open e mails/answer phones, etc for a while. So you kind of close yourself off from them for a while until you feel you can deal with the fallout.
Sending the letter doesn't have to mean starting a conversation with them, you can send it and never ever communicate with them again, you can do what you want, you are the boss. But you need to work out what you want to do and how you'll handle it. Plan it.

Thank you for sharing a bit about your own story pocket. It sounds like you have some positive strategies in place. I like the idea of the photo by your bed especially.

Thank you too Goodto.

I appreciate you reading my other thread. Lots to think about but the main thing is that I feel in control, and I want to maintain that.

I started a thread in Relationships as im dealing with H now, solicitors appointment on Friday. I keep thinking why didn't I leave him for so so long, and of course it's because I didn't know better. I was brought up to be ideal for abusers. I hate that I couldn't shed my childhood and just be normal and not fuck up my life with H and let him start to fuck up DS life too.

I'm doing it to protect Ds, but all I really want is to crawl into a hole and never come out ever again.

What shall I do about my mothers crisis? Lend her money? I guess I have to. But I'll be taking it away from essentials here. But if she has to sell up now there'll be even more work and worry and awfulness for me too. So is it weak to pay? I can't cope with her crisis on top of mine. I really can't.

Misc what would happen if you didn't lend your M money? Why do you feel you have to. Especially after how badly she has let you down your whole life.

I can't bring myself to phone her back. But I think I have to screw my courage to the sticking post (vague Shakespeare? quote that keeps going through my brain) and do it tomorrow.

I'm scared this is the beginning of the end, and she'll be the thing that overwhelms me and all the fucked up mess of two generations will come crashing down on me like a tsunami.

I'm barely holding it together physically, mentally, or practically and financially myself and of I make it through in one piece it will be a fuxking miracle.

I'm barely clinging onto my job, and Im shit scared I need to go back and prove myself or risk losing it altogether. I don't have enough carers and I don't know how much longer I can last with the way things are, I'm recruiting but not got anyone likely to even interview yet, and it all drains energy and uses up the health I have, and I'm desperately trying to get more money from the council to pay for carers as there's a shortfall of at least 8-10K a year that my dad was going to do for me, and thats of my health stays the same - and it won't if I can't pace and manage everyday movements... And I was supposed to have an operation in jan and without it I am risking becoming very ill again but I haven't got anyone to take care of DS and will need time off work yet need to be paid, and I have to start divorce proceedings as leaving the situation as is, is not sustainable and is like another sword hanging over my head that could drop at any moment ... etc etc etc.

Tbh the divorce thing I would leave for a bit but the family friend who has helped me in the past and has offered to go meet social services to beg for money, which I am too scared to do so really need her good will and support. Well she is saying I have to make sorting out H situation a priority and I can't really say no, considering she's the only person who is helping me and I'm fucking desperate. It's kind of right and certainly a worry if H decides to get nasty again... But left to myself i would be putting the absolute certain to happen now emergencies first, rather than big risks but maybe won't happen tomorrow things...

I guess I'm on fire fighting mode rather than Fire proofing/ bridge building or whatever the phrase is! I think I'm confusing a bollox marketing phrase with the rhyme Londons burning! It's late and I'm a mess.

Oh bugger I just thought by the same reasoning, I've missed two things of the list - chasing psych help for me, and grief councelling for Ds. Bugger. That makes so many things... :(

So staving off Her descending upon my head even if it gives me enough time to get a few more bits of essential to life stuff under my belt... I guess priority list is

1. See solicitor & start ball rolling to protect me & DS from H
2. Do one Hosp appointment & one day case nasty test both rescheduled from jan to next week (& I'll get discharged unless I do them as I've rearranged them before)
3. Advertise, recruit & employ another carer and train them
4. Get payroll sorted for all carers & pay backlog in tax (I've fucked it up and it's a worry)
5. Beg council / social services for more money to survive
6. Keep job by attending & doing good work, & so get paid
7. Make plan for operation and post op.

Plus lots more that I don't know how to prioritise:

1. See if any psych help for me (but don't know how I'd physically be able to attend any appointments anyway...)
2. Find Ds grief councelling / general his life is fucking hard councelling (having a disabled mother, unstable life, and potentially will grow up to have the same condition that killed his aunt and grandpa, and disabled his mother)

And then actually the most urgent one: 10. Go back to opticians as I got new glasses (though couldn't afford it) as old glasses v v old and scratched/ misty and not my prescription... And the new glasses are giving me eye pain and migraines if I wear for more than 20 mins once a day... Obviously this really is NOT helping my current situation.

Oh god, how do I even prioritise all this stuff? Let alone do any if it. Even before my dad died I couldn't have done more than one of these a month, with my dad doing loads of helping :( If Ds had any other life to go to I wouldn't even be trying to carry on... Poor Ds :(

And by the way now I've got a little cross about all this awful stuff ... It's fucking un-fucking-fair. And this is really why deep down late at night, I think I'm cursed. It's too much for one person to deal with. Too much to happen to one single person. It's cruel and unfair And it's not NORMAL and it's not right this should be real. Life is not for living this way. I'm ashamed of how bad things are and I can't tell anyone what I'm facing everyday and I feel like it's my fault, that I've failed somehow. I feel like an outcast, that I'm in hell and it's so different from what other people live like, that hat have done something very very wrong to be cursed in this never ending hell. And I'm even a bit jealous of my sister, and my dad, cos they got to leave this hell and they left me alone, to face my worst fear - alone with my mother in hell.

misc, I'm so sorry things are shit, how are you feeling now? I noticed your posting time, did you manage to get any sleep?

My mother has announced that I will have 'to crawl over broken glass' to see her again, can't see it'll be worth that tbh
And that I'm bringing up 'rude children', my eldest frequently comes home with stickers for good manners but I guess that's by the by, what she means is that they don't ass-lick as much as she feels they should

Aright, bloody angry today. Why does it come in waves? I can feel so desperately sad and angry and nothing all in a day. Bloody Mother's Day advertised everywhere too, no doubt I'll be further bitched about for not supplying the requisite mountain of presents....

Sorry, DS1 decided to press send think he's hinting he wants lunch

Sorry I know I'm ranting on here, it's like brain diarrhoea, it's just I don't want to become my mother, sitting there telling my preschool child over and over again how wronged and hard done to I am (thanks for that mum!)
And DP doesn't really want to know anymore, he can't see why I just can't cut ties and walk away and be ok with it, he calls her 'poison', which I'd exactly right but I just don't think he gets it...

What kind of person says that to their child? What fucked up shit goes on in her brain? I wasn't a bad kid, never did drugs/stole the family jewellery/got passed on drunk/brought the police to the door etc...I just wasn't a surrogate husband for her after my dad left which is what she wanted me to be.
Although she'd have thrown me under the bus if a guy had have been on the scene - some guy shed spoken to a few times and made up a whole thing in her head with mentioned he was moving very North to some really remote island and she started researching houses and her entire life up there with him (he'd never asked, they weren't dating etc) even though I was pregnant with ds1 and had had it rammed down my throat growing up about having a grandchild...
Maybe I'm just being naïve because mine are little but I can't imagine saying those kind of things to my kids, 'crawl over broken glass' in her fucking dreams!

MiscellaneousAssortment "but screw thy courage to the sticking-place, and we'll not fail" - it is Shakespeare, and it's Lady Macbeth encouraging her husband to stab the king. Right in the sticking-place. Ouch.

And, yeah, Macbeth was bricking it at that point and needed encouragement. So, you know, listen to your inner Lady Macbeth. Just make sure she jumps off the battlements in Act III, you don't want her sort hanging around mucking up your life generally.

Hello all. I tarted a thread and was advised to pop over here. Terribly dysfunctional childhood...now I am living back at home at 37 and feel it all caving in around me all over again.

Dad: Aggressive, possible Aspergers, rude, unsymapthetic but deep down a good guy who does love us.

Mum: From a very dysfucntional childhood of her own. Extreme martyr complex, always angry, always badmouthing me, very unsupportive, critical, guilt trips, can't win, always walking on eggshells and she doesn't

Struggling as a single Mum after my ex left me and getting help, but help with very strict conditions on it.

For example: I am welcome to stay with her for a few months, but she will make almost every minute a waking misery from the minute I wake up to the minute I go to bed. Constant moods, constant passive aggression, me bending over backwards to make her happy.

For example: She will babysit once every two months if I am lucky, but she will ring around and complain to everyone about me, and she will not speak to me for days afterwards.

She wants to be the one going out, not me, how dare I suggest such a thing.

Feel like curling up and dying. I'm a capable adult, can't believe she can still make me feel this low.

So I saw PIL with our DC during their last visit, as DH gets really internally angry when he sees FIL, and he broods for a week or so afterwards. FIL is mostly superficially pleasant so I didn't mind this too much, and DH was 'busy'. However DH was still really affected by knowing about their visit, he has been emotional and irritable for several days after :( On reflection the visit wasn't good- when I am chatting with PIL I think everything is ok, but when I discuss afterwards with DH I see several selfish statements and evidence of his lack of empathy, for some reason when FIL says something outrageous I find myself nodding along! I am disappointed with myself as I had planned to be more robust with him this visit and point out some of his inaccurate beliefs, but I didn't.

I don't want to stay in this pattern where any contact with FIL upsets DH so much.

I had a read through PD descriptions, and I think he would fit best into the borderline category, although I don't know him well enough to be certain.

Misc You sound utterly and desperately depressed. I'm so sorry you're goin thru this. It does indeed sound totally overwhelming. I'm not a reg on here, so I don't know everyone's background ( and I'm not asking you to relay it all btw ) but my heart goes out to you cos you sound like you're really suffering.

I'm not sure what the medical condition is you said your sis and dad had that claimed their lives, and you say you suffer from it too? And your son is poorly? And your mother is a nasty piece of work. ( the polite version!)
Just who have you got to confide in and help you out at the moment? Who would you need to step in and support you/your son if you had to go in to hospital? You said you need an operation, right?

It just reads like you're drowning in quick sand and I wonder just who you have to rely upon now the shit has hit the fan? Sorry I don't have a magic answer just some poxy cyber-flowers

Notwanted I read your other thread. I find it amazing that you can get by at all given what you described! Again, no magic answers from me. Predictably I will say your mother is really imbalanced and toxic ( nothing you haven't heard on your thread already ) and I'm not about to do any amateur psychoanalysis. I just wanna be very over-simplistic and say that you need to move out, be totally independant of her ( it's your dependance that seems to be a catalyst in her screwed up behaviour, but that seems to be her true colours apparently ) and tell her in no uncertain terms what you think of her and how her behaviour is effecting you.

I realise this is stating the obvious and is not actually helpful, but I'm just giving my opinion, as an outsider going solely on the info you have provided. She sounds like a bloody awful bitch and I would go NC and personally wouldn't piss on her if she was on fire. But that's just me. No emotional involvement makes it easy to say these things right?

Everyone's an Agony Aunt!..........

Yes I am utterly miserable and on my knees.

There's too many things to deal with and all require better health than I have to be able to do properly.

The replies on here made me smile though

Ok, so I contacted a local charity that Ds teacher recommended. Big step for me. God I hope they will help.

I've got a very unpleasant medical test on Friday, preparations start tomorrow pm. I'm dreading it. And I have no one to tell in rl, no one to care or wish me luck.

Good luck Misc. You have so much on your plate - I hope you can get some help with the load.

Emotional day for me today. I woke up to texts from my son saying "Don't worry but I'm going to hospital, don't worry though, but I am going to hospital, can you ring me"

OH okay son I won't worry. LOL. Tried calling him and of course his mobile was off. He rang me back about half hour after I arrived at work. He had an allergic reaction to a banana very early morning, got stomach cramps and started getting red blotches and found it hard to breathe, he rang 111 and they sent an ambulance out and paramedics decided to bring him to A&E. He had been given a big dose of antihistamines and steroids and was doing okay. But then there was drama over getting him home as he had no cash or debit card on him or his house key! So I ended up having to ring a taxi and persuade them to work out the fare in advance and let me pay by paypal for him. (He lives 250 miles away so it's not like I could go and get him! and he has no other family in contact nearby.)

All this while trying to deal with normal work busy-ness. But we got it done and he was home by lunchtime and managed to get indoors!

And I kept thinking to myself "Don't tell mum about this", not really registering that we are now NC. Thinking how she would say he wasn't really allergic, he'd probably made it up; he'd been "highly strung" and imagined it all and got himself in a panic, thus wasting NHS resources; that only an idiot would have gone to hospital without their wallet and house key; and why should I be dealing with it, he's an adult now (he's 19) and I shouldn't be having to take time out of my day or pay for taxis for him.

It's just so ridiculous how much she hates him, just because she hated his dad. And because he's a boy. And because he doesn't conform to her middle-class expectations. And because I love him more than I love her.

Then I remembered we're NC, and I breathed a sigh of relief that I wouldn't have to either tell her and spend half an hour justifying his illness, or remember not to tell her. Feel so sad that I don't have a mum who would support me, and that my son doesn't have a grandma that gives a shit.

Then about an hour after he got home, I got a call from my hospital giving me the date for my surgery, which is going to be 11th April. I'm incredibly happy as I've been waiting for about 6 months, but again sad that I can't get any parental support. Even before we went NC I had decided not to tell her until after the op as she would have made it all about her feelings of panic and kept coming up with disaster scenarios and deliberately looking up stories about this op going wrong and emailing them to me

My work colleagues were all really supportive about my son and a few people know about the op and are cool with it, and I texted my sister about the op and she was like "yay! I'll drive you and pick you up!" It's just hard to realise how unsupportive your only parent is.

misc .... very good luck Friday. I hope the medical is endurable.

pocket such mixed feeligns about being NC isn't it. There's a lot of grieving to do because essentially it's being bereaved. mainly bereaved of the illusion of a loving mother or father. Being NC gives you clarity of vision, I think, to see exactly what this person is like, mental distance. But it also makes you face straight up that there is no parent in your life.

Very glad your son is alright! you must have been so worried. Glad your sister can help when your op comes aorund :)

Misc lots of good wishes for your Friday medical procedure.

I wondered aswell, how you were getting on with your list The first thing you had on there was protecting yourself from your FW H. You don't have to worry about finding yourself a solicitor, you can have a non-mol tomorrow if you need it? You only need to call 8044 999 NCDV or there's an 0800 number too. They can do emergency non-mol's and can do all the preparation for you they are the specialists. Please get support for your situation from WA too? You have so much to manage and can get help for it all. I hope that local charity will come through well for you.

I felt this way for a long time pocket the keep on realisation thing, also feeling very angry at them both for being such a pair of fucking wankers that meant I had to get on with living my life alone [from family] - it was at times upsetting, and at other times anger, and other times just a bloody nuisance that they were in my head, but it only lasts for a time. Great news both for you for your op /sisterly support, and for your son that that horrible scare turned out ok and is safely out of hospital.

Thanks for understanding ladies. It helps just to know someone "gets it" iykwim.

It's funny because I see people on Stately Homes sometimes talk about fathers day being difficult and they wish they had a loving dad in their life. And my dad has been out of my life for over 25 years and it's never bothered me for a single minute. The only thing I felt was relief. But mother's day is coming up and I know that's going to be difficult for me.

Maybe it's because I've never had personal experience of anybody being a good dad? None of my close friends at school had "normal" dads - their dads were either absent, violent alcoholics, or child molesters. And as I've got older, my partners' dads have been, in turn, a horrible bully; a weak enabler of a narc mother; died a long time ago but was a horrible violent bully; and died a long time ago although seemed to be an okay person.

Wow. That's so weird. It's like I've spent my whole life being drawn to other people with shit/abusive/missing dads. I've never thought about this before. It can't be a coincidence, surely?

There are loads of them about Pocket ! try not to bring their shit into your world. they just are, and not because of your past, never your responsibility. However, having the education around abusers and their tactics just heighten the radar and help us to flag up the warning signs before you're in too deep.

Have to clarify, none of those - friends or partners - were ever abusive to me, and we never really discussed our dads (except for my late H who was also a victim of child sexual abuse. We had a very strong trust bond as two survivors.)

(I was in a very abusive relationship age 19 or so with a guy who was EA and SA but I was able to leave with the help of friends after about 9 months.)

I should also say, this list makes it sound like I live(d) in a deprived area full of wife beating drunks and single mums. Anything but! I grew up in a very privileged area. I mean none of us had ponies, but most of the kids I hung out with, their parents owned their houses, two cars, etc. I suppose it just proves the old saying that you never know what's going on behind closed doors.

well, yes, Pocket it has to be a coincidence then doesn't it? What are you looking for? What do you think that connection is?

Maybe you and other non-abusive men with abusive fathers that you have been involved with have an empathy or pattern of behaving and so are drawn to each other? is that what you mean?

There is the fact that there are a hell of a lot of them about! There is always that?

and no, just because of that experience, it wouldn't make me place you in a 'deprived area full of wife beating drunks [and single mums!]' wow!

Big myth. As you know, having not come from that particular pigeonhole you describe.

We are talking about abusive parents here so i don't wnat to get off the rail, but for a moment, There are those so demeaned by their fathers that they never recover their self-image, or gain a healthy mindset about what women are for, take my ex. He was systematically picked apart by his father, totally emasculated and flawed. He lives now in a world where everything is everyone else's fault, and also picked up his father's lovely traits of taunting people, playing like cat and mouse games, wanting to screw with their minds and getting pleasure, but then cries that he's 'like his dad'. Umm, well yes, you are, and its more likely that a male will grow up this way, than the experience you recount. However, back on track.

I hope everyone else is doing ok?

Hi everyone.

I'm doing well, not been here in a little while. Enjoying NC. Probably finishing up therpay in a session or two. Now the reason for it has fucked off across the world and ignores me it's not so necessary. Been feeling really well, happy, settled lately. Work going well, been getting plenty of translation and some really interesting opportunities work-wise on the horizon. Feel in a way like I had to cut the toxicity (mother) to really blossom.
Thinking possibly of trying to buy a house!!! Been looking and there are a couple of things we could afford, but it's a bit scary. That "don't spend any money" thing of my toxic mother and my upbringing is so strong. But the wy it stands we could use part of the money we have, get a mortgage that would be no more than we pay in rent and still have about €20,000 so I think it's a no brainer, isn't it?
Bank claims they'd lend to us and have seen 2 houses below what the bank said would be our maximum. One is in perfect condition but has a shady patio, one is questionable (no photos) condition but nice little garden.