WWYD? LT(not so)B or stick it out?

[MissSusanStoHelit]

DP and I have been together for nearly four years, living together for a year and a half. We are happy - he makes me laugh, he is kind, gentle, generous, amazing with DD, his children are delightful, my cats love him, he cooks, washed up after himself, gives me a lie-in every weekend and then wakes me up with breakfast in bed - and I'm having the BEST sex of my life.

So what's the problem? What more could I ask for?

Here it is - he doesn't want to get married. He says he loves me every day, and wants us to be together until we're so old we're taking turns on the Zimmer frame - but he won't marry me. He can't say why - it's not that he doesn't see a future with me, or that he's keeping his options open - but there is "something" that he is waiting for before popping the question, and he's not sure what that is or when it'll happen.

There have been lots of excuses over the years - ranging from "I need to sell my property first so I have the £ to buy you a ring" to "I want to wait till we're next in (my home country) so I can ask your Dad and Granny in person" but each time it doesn't happen.

Marriage IS important to me. It's not just the financial security, or the shiny ring, the piece of paper - I WANT to be joined to him forever, and wake up next to him every day. It hurts so much that he doesn't want me this way... we have talked about it over the years, and I've been patient, thinking he needed more time - but last night he admitted that he's not sure if he'll ever be ready. And I don't think I can live with that.

DD would be beyond devastated if she never saw her "brother" and "sister" again - so do I stick it out for her sake, knowing that we'll never get married and make myself be happy with that?

Or do I throw away the best relationship I've ever had, with a man who makes me so happy, (apart from the marriage thing) and try find someone who WILL want me that way?

(Before anyone asks, I have proposed to him and he said no, so that's not an option.)

I feel so sad...

I'm the main factor in wanting the house - we have agreed that my grandmother can come live with us now that she's widowed and lonely, and we have no room as it is. So we've been looking for houses with granny annexes and found one that would be perfect. I don't think it's the granny idea that's putting him off, because it was his idea she move in with us rather than go into a care home at £££ a week!

When did you propose? How did he say no but keep the relationship going??

Terrifying, indeed - not just for me but for DD too... I would be taking her siblings away from her if he didn't change his mind, and I'm now too old to give her any More... Can I really do that to her for the sake of a piece pf paper?

Kick him out and move your granny in. Then you and your DD won't be lonely, you'll have more freedom to go out (she can babysit), and you won't miss him as much.

Your DD will get over it. I promise.

House buying legalities aside, i completely understand where you are coming from.

The superficial but very pleasant day to day stuff is fine but the big things are one sided.
You wanted another baby, he had a vasectomy. Thats it, no discussion about long term contraception and revisit the subject at a later date.
You want marriage he is waiting for something"special" what exactly? Him to feel as committed as you?
In the meantime he moves in with you, into a nice ready made home, rather shortly after splitting with his wife, so not too much stress for him there.

It would be a deal breaker for me. If it were me i would be taking some time to consider whether i was happy to proceed like that or if there was going to be too much resentment from me. If there were then i would finish it.

Your DD sees his kids what, every other weekend? A couple of weeks during the summer? you mean you'd NEVER finish this relationship ever because she'd be so devastated by the loss of his kids..? I think it's an excuse.

He has definitely talked about marriage before - he has told me on at least four occasions that he wants to marry me and spend the rest of his life with me. we've had long chats about how long the engagement would be (short!), the type of wedding we'd have, who we'd want there, we've even been browsing rings online so he could see what I like! It's definitely not a case of wishful thinking...

But you proposed and he said No.

He did - we'd been together for a year at that point, we were on holiday together, very romantic, snuggling in front of the Fire... It just sort of slipped out! He was shocked ( to be fair, he wasn't divorced yet) and said he thought it would be better to talk about it again once The decree came through. Then it became a case of "let's live together for a while, and see how it goes".

It sounds to me like you have a good relationship, while it's important to understand what he particularly objects to about marriage I think it's also important to understand what you particularly want about marriage.

I am married, got married before having children, but I would probably have been happy with properly sorted out legal affairs (wills, house deeds, insurance policies and pensions etc). I didn't change my name or have a big dress or bridesmaids etc. Marriage is just the easiest way to do the legal bit in one action if you haven't been married before, but with ex-partners and children with other people you should probably get a solicitor too anyway.
Many of my friends are not married, many are very against it, and of those who are a couple had a secret eloped wedding and you wouldn't know they'd married if you weren't one of their closest friends.

It sounds to me like you don't believe the relationship is the 'real deal' if you're not married... tbh I don't think it's fair to castigate him for not being able to answer why he doesn't want to unless you can really articulate why you do want to.

Have a read on here, maybe start a thread asking those who aren't married by choice why they don't want to be... many answers on this site will be feminist reasons that don't really apply to a man, but there will also be reasons that might help you understand him more.

Then it became a case of "let's live together for a while, and see how it goes".

Well, he's been "seeing how it goes" for 18 months. How much longer are you prepared to give him?

If I were you, I'd leave it till after New Year (just to make sure he's not actually planning some wonderful Christmas proposal), then finish things. Not just for your win pride, but because otherwise this will drag on for years with one excuse after another, and your in life won't move forwards.

*own pride

• own life

Where will you be over Christmas and New Year? The more I think about this, the more I feel he might be planning a proposal but doesn't want to ruin the surprise (or be made to feel like it's YOUR idea again).

I hope I'm right.

Cog has said what I believe could be your answer.

In fact if you're financially more stable than him then not being married and getting the legals wrapped up could protect what you have more than being married.

" it would be better to NOT be married if we're buying it together?? "

Anything you buy after getting married is automatically deemed a 'marital asset' unless you have things ring-fenced, documented and protected beforehand. I have a friend going through divorce at the moment who did just that when they married 6 years ago. She owned most of the house prior to marriage. Her STBXH can make a claim based on his contributions and the increase in the value of the property but her initial investment is protected.

If you are not married to someone and buy a property together then you should still have it documented what proportion each of you owns and what happens if either party wishes to sell up.

You would be insane to end this relationship over this issue to be honest. If you buy a house that is 80% yours you will be in a great position should the relationship end in the future and if he pays the mortgage you will be better off financially. Marriage is important to you but equally it doesn't seem to be to him. You have a home and a family together and you are not financially vulnerable so why rock the boat over something that will make no material difference to your lives?