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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

My boyfriend said I'm not very empathetic to his needs

191 replies

toomanybooksnotenoughspace · 01/12/2014 08:35

Me and my boyfriend went away for the weekend. On the journey back home yesterday (which was an approximately 2 and half hour drive which he did) he complained of being tired and bad back etc. We stopped off at a service station so that he could get 5 minutes kip because he felt he might fall asleep at the wheel if he didn't. I told him I would pop to the loo and did he want a coffee/sandwich etc. I went to the loo first, then went and got him a coffee. The lid was not put on properly and spilled hot coffee all over my hand so popped into the bathroom again to run cold water over it. Anyway when I got to the car he was really annoyed asking why I had taken so long so I explained that there had been a queue at Starbucks and also that I had spilled hot coffee all over my hand so wanted to run cold water over it. He then said that he didn't want it as it been into the ladies bathroom and therefore it was unhygienic. I told him that I had not been to the loo, only to wash my hand and it had only been near the sinks etc. He was going to throw it away but I told him no, I had just bought it for him so he should drink it- which he did. He didn't say thank you for the coffee and only asked if my hand was OK until later on.

Anyway we start our journey again and he complains of a bad back, to which I start rubbing his back and he asks for a massage when we get back. I say yes, I can give you a massage. He then has a go at me for not offering one first saying that he always offers to give me a massage and that he should not have to always ask for one. I tell him I was going to offer anyway but he got there first and he said he didn't believe me. He says this is further evidence of me not being very empathetic to his needs.

He had been in a grump earlier after we had had quite a long walk near where were staying. We had for most of the walk walked together, chatting etc but on the final leg to the car park we had to go up a narrow winding roadside which made it difficult to walk side by side. I ended up walking a bit in front of him and this upset him because it made it look like we might of had a falling out. He had a go at me because he had mentioned this before in previous walks and that I should remember this.

He had been unwell last week with a D & V virus. He said that I was uncaring towards him because I did not offer to come round to look after him, bring him food/medicines etc. I have a 3 yo DD who I look after full time on my own and it would be quite a slog for us to get to his from where we live. Also he described his illness to me and I thought I don't want to run the risk of either of us catching it so didn't offer. But I think I got the tone from him when I spoke to him when he was ill that it would be best for us not to come.

I know this is all quite petty but it is not out of character for my boyfriend of 8 months to be like this. It irks me because I don't like the accusation that I am unempathetic towards him as he often does things repeatedly that get on my nerves which I tell him all the time. He complains if I seemingly don't help him - but doesn't remember all the times I have done nice things for him like offering massages in the past if he's had a bad day, or helping him tidy the kitchen, cooking for him, looking after him after a recent operation etc.

He will often get annoyed if I haven't done something he needs help with. I told him that I am not a psychic and that sometimes he needs to ask, otherwise I won't know. Also usually when he does 'ask' if comes out all angry and hostile which makes me not really want to help. For example I didn't like the feeling of 'having' to give him a massage. I otherwise consider myself to be reasonably helpful in that I will help/offer to help if I can see something needs doing.

Sorry this is so long, its just its weighing on me and also would like some MN views on who is being unreasonable.

OP posts:
thalassa · 01/12/2014 12:30

Has no one else picked up on the "coffee has been in the ladies lavatory, and therefore must be contaminated"? This ALONE would be enough to tell me he is bonkers and odd and probably has issues, but the rest of your story just underlines it. It will not get better. You will be happier without this strange person in your life.

Thumbnutstwitchingonanopenfire · 01/12/2014 12:33

thalassa - I wouldn't take that at face value; to me that says "I am looking for a petty reason to make you feel bad for not coming back IMMEDIATELY with my coffee and now I am going to punish you by refusing to drink it for spurious reasons" with a background hope that the Op will go and get another one, thus demeaning herself to his whims even more. She didn't, and he let it go this time - but next time...

salonmeblowy · 01/12/2014 12:35

Sorry, have not read the whole thread, but since the sock-gate was mentioned I looked up your posting history.

This chap offers you and your DD a lift to nursery, confirms 20 mins before you have to leave that he will still do it, then changes his mind making you both late. You end up feeling guilty for feeling annoyed. Yet he thinks you are the one who should be more considerate?

He sounds awful and you definitely should LTB. Please listen to AF's advice, you deserve so much better.

CogitoErgoSometimes · 01/12/2014 12:36

The 'coffee in the lavatory' comment is not bonkers exactly. He needed a reason why the coffee was no longer acceptable and he couldn't claim it was cold or the wrong type. So he lighted on 'lavatory'... 'hygiene'... bingo! The SMALL negative is now the BIG STICK.

Petty....

LineRunner · 01/12/2014 12:39

A wise MNer once said that a good relationship is one that you don't keep starting threads on MN about.

DonkeysDontRideBicycles · 01/12/2014 12:44

Eight months with this person is long enough.
Give yourself an early Christmas present and end it now.

QueenofallIsee · 01/12/2014 12:50

OP, I advise that you end this relationship. 8mths in is honeymoon period, I genuinely don't think it should be hard work at that stage. I am also concerned about the "He had a go at me because he had mentioned this before in previous walks and that I should remember this" mentioned in your OP...I have been told this, and after a few times of me forgetting my "instructions", I was punished with a perfectly reasonable smack in the face - he gave me fair warning after all. I am not saying that your boyfriend is a domestic abuser of this type but hopefully you can see what I mean?

alicemalice · 01/12/2014 13:06

He sounds like a nightmare and only 8 months in.

magoria · 01/12/2014 13:21

He is priming you to keep you on tenterhooks running around for his every need in case he decides the relationship isn't working and leaves you.

It has already started however this will escalate to him being upset when you put your DC first over him. The D&V shows he will head this way.

As everyone else has said get out now with only 8 months wasted and don't believe him when he says he will change. So many examples already in such a short time scale!

CheersMedea · 01/12/2014 13:44

The walking ahead comment is the biggest red flag to me here.

The other stuff less so. Back pain can be excruciating and make the mildest people grumpy.

Just out of interest - why didn't you drive the second half of the journey or offer to? If that had been me, I would have either asked my partner to drive or hope they had offered.

I also wouldn't want to drink coffee that had been into a public bathroom but I hate the filthy of public bathrooms. Any surface will have all kinds of residual crap - literally - on it - urine, menstrual blood etc etc. I've seen people cleaning dog shit of their shoes in sinks and putting the shoes on the side. I personally wouldn't drink out of a cup that had been put down on the side of a sink in a public toilet - so I don't myself think that is such a big deal.

The walking ahead thing is just weird though and very controlling.

AMumInScotland · 01/12/2014 13:52

I hadn't realised you were the same poster with the boyfriend who messed her about over giving a lift. And apparently at least one other thread about him too?

I think you need to accept that this relationship is not going to get any better. You've said yourself that you lack self-esteem and struggle to know what's okay in relationships.

Your choices are pretty simple

1 - put up with being treated like shit - I really don't recommend this. You do realise this isn't right, deep down, or you wouldn't keep asking for advice, so you know he's not behaving like a decent person should.

2 - Become more assertive and tell him to shape up. If you were more self-confident then you could maybe make this work, but most people like him don't really change. And, you don't have the self confidence to stick to something like that.

3 - split up with him. It's only 8 months, and you don't have a shared house or children together, so it's just a question of saying "This isn't working for me" and sticking to it. And then - could you talk to someone about your self-esteem issues, about how things were in your childhood, about why you have such doubts about what's okay? Because I think you need to understand why you struggle, before you try to have relationships. Unfortunately arseholes have a magnet for women who lack self-confidence and you need to learn to recognise them, their behaviour and your reactions, to avoid this happening over again.

AnyFucker · 01/12/2014 13:55

OP are you that poster with 1) the socks 2) the dicking about with the lift ?

if so, you can keep posting as many isolated incidents hoping for a different response for as long as you like

but it sounds like you need to wake up and fast

jakesmith · 01/12/2014 13:57

"Any surface will have all kinds of residual crap - literally - on it - urine, menstrual blood etc etc"

Sorry but do you live in the UK!? I haven't seen much menstrual blood in the toilets at any of the services I've been in, but to be fair I am usually in the gents - very little semen, wee, poo etc knocking about there though.

Is it possible for germs to cross through the bottom of a coffee cup and into the drink? I didn't think it was.

This guy sounds like a child

BeCool · 01/12/2014 14:00

It's all been said up thread OP.

I just wanted to add you and your DD deserve so much better than this.

FriendlyLadybird · 01/12/2014 14:04

Sod his "needs", really.

I can understand his being grumpy if he's got backache. But everything else is just way too much. Next time he questions whether you're really meant for each other, you should just agree with him. You and your DD deserve better.

GoodKingQuintless · 01/12/2014 14:05

I would boot out any man moaning about "his needs" fgs.

TheBatteriesHaveRunOut · 01/12/2014 14:15

These random outbursts of his, where he latches onto something and has a go at you. That's him trying to keep you in line. It's controlling behaviour and no amount of fun times will make up for what someone like that can do to your self esteem.

I know this isn't an AIBU but if you were asking 'AIBU to ditch this loser?' I would say YANBU.

BeCool · 01/12/2014 14:21

He is testing how much shit you can/will put up with.

He is playing around the boundaries of "how far can I push this, how can I best getting her focusing everything around me, how badly does she want to be in a relationship even with a loser like me and how can I best manipulate her to get what I want? look at her dance! I'll try pulling a different string next week and see what happens then!

Tedious and pathetic at best.
Get rid.

AndTheBandPlayedOn · 01/12/2014 14:32

Venus: While someone less direct might say "It's a long time since breakfast, I'm a bit dry." This is passive aggressive manipulation if the speaker truly believes a beverage will appear as a result of this statement.

Toomanybooks, when you say he is full on with saying how he loves you and you are the one, etc... to me these are just words: lip service. What does he do to back this up with actions that demonstrates that he cares (and I do not mean having sex with you)? He has your head (and heart?) in a cloud of verbiage that may be sincere...But also may not be sincere. How can you tell if he is sincere? From what has been written here, everything is about him. Everything. Therefore I would not believe him to be sincere when he trots out the verbal platitudes as a very (emotionally) inexpensive pat on the head for you.

The other thing not mentioned as yet is this dynamic that seems to appear when you take the initiative to do something nice for him. He can not just accept that. He has a need to sabotage your effort and negate it by somehow finding fault. You initiated a back rub in the car...turned sour. You got him coffee...turned sour.
Why Does He Do That? (Read the book by that name by Lundy Bancroft) Others may have a more insightful answer, but I believe it is to keep you in your place, so to speak, so he can maintain his supposed superiority over you. You are not allowed to score any points.

So here is a dynamic, a game if you will (Games People Play is another good book): He says you are unempathetic (talk about Pot-Kettle-Black!!), This goads you into proving yourself by doing something nice for him (you know: that you care), so now he has opportunity to reassert his superiority by invalidating anything you have done. This strokes his ego. His ego is very very needy and you (and in time your DD) are the supply. As long as you are available to him, he will use you for his ego supply. That is your role in his relationship. Imho, with this bloke, you would have no other purpose (besides using you for sex of course).

Please understand that there are worse things than not being in a relationship with a man...And that would be being in a relationship with someone like this jerk. You are not alone, you have your DD. Celebrate your life with your daughter, protect her (and thus yourself) from this emotional abuser.

For Christmas! Seriously, it would be the one best gift you could give yourself and her. Do not be fooled by nice-nice gestures on Christmas/Valentine's/birthday...That is just checking a few boxes to keep you from "thinking too much" Wink

AndTheBandPlayedOn · 01/12/2014 16:07

On the scoring points...It just seemed to me that his campaign to invalidate you has reached such as level to seem almost competitive, or a conditioned/trained response to your activity. Scoring points really has no place in a healthy relationship (as well as the associated keeping score). When it come to that point, and you, (generally speaking you) notice it- even if you catch yourself doing it- then I think it is a red flag to an unhealthy dynamic of superior/subordinate.

Having a reflexive response to invalidate you is, seriously, emotional abuse. It is to make you invisible, toomanybooks. It is to keep you pressed down which will evolve into depression (whether caused directly by him, or caused by you: self-enduced depression to get along with him and keep the peace). It is not mentally or emotionally healthy for you to be around this person. Speaking from experience, also, it does take years to recover from this kind of abuse. I believe you have an operational understanding of this from your family of origin experience (with your parents as you grew up).

Please leave him. The simple "it is not working for me" is all you need to say as any thing else will be picked apart and invalidated. Please know however he invalidates your decision to break up, that is all on his side. You do not need his agreement to end the relationship. You do not need his permission, his blessing, or any kind of acknowledgement for that matter. Speak with your feet and go (block him etc). Good luck Flowers

hellsbellsmelons · 01/12/2014 16:30

It's like this after 8 month!???
Just imagine it getting worse and worse (because it will) and what it might be like in 8 years time!
No way - get out now.

I'm another recommending the Freedom Programme.
Contact Womens Aid and get on a course sharpish.
This guy is not OK!

DeMaz · 01/12/2014 17:13

Are you looking for some convincing OP?
Yes, he definitely has got the makings of an abusive pansy!!!

Run, run, run!!!!!

velourvoyageur · 01/12/2014 17:37

This is no good. It's extremely frustrating for you. You are constantly getting jumped on (& not even the good kind) for stuff that doesn't matter.

You don't sound unempathetic in the slightest quite the opposite.

Do you think he can change OP?

IrishNoodles · 01/12/2014 18:18

toomanybooksnotenoughspace - nothing tedious about your worries. I recognise the signs from a previous relationship my self with my wife from whom I am currently separated. Your boyfriend of 8 months is obviously all self consuming, bordering on needy and pathetic and I would suggest this is a short road or at the very least a warning sign to someone who is very controlling in relationships. Jeeze, after 8 months too, what will it be like after 8 years!!? I would consider yourself lucky as a smart woman to have seen these signs now; either he changes, or you leave, or.... you simply leave now. Tough I know, but you have one life and someone who makes mountains out of mole hills which he obviously does, is really not worth hanging around for. I am positive you can find someone much stronger, less needy, more respectful to you and above all, some one who is kind and caring to your needs too, in equal measure. Go girl, deep down, you know what you need to do!

Springheeled · 01/12/2014 18:57

OP have read your other threads. You sound lovely. But if you can find it in you, you should definitely laugh in his face and tell him it's over next time he tries to pull this shit on you- or even before!
You know he is going to find a way to ruin Xmas, don't you?
The walking thing struck a chord with me as I once had a partner who was angry with me for organising a cinema trip without his prior approval. He got very angry walking there, refused to speak to me and began to dawdle and loiter and look in shop windows etc so I just shrugged, and continued walking on at normal pace, just a bit slower for his benefit.. Every argument, for months afterwards he would bring up the time I 'stormed away' from him in the street, leaving him feeling 'like a dog' Hmm
They never get better.