Am I controlling? Bit long.

[Mynewname1]

Hi guys.....changed my name for this but I'm a regular so don't hate me!

Ok here's the story......

Split with my long term partner (5years) whome I have a 3 year old, we've been apart about 6months now. The split was pretty amicable and because at the end I was very unhappy I moved out (my house) in order to have some resolution in a reasonable amount of time, didn't want to have to live together for ages once we'd decided to slpit.

Untill now everything has been quite good between myself and my ex, as we are both in similar situations work work wise and little one is happy at nursery and being looked after by grandparents we have basically split parenting between us. I have my son 7nights out of 14, niether of us thought it necessary to give up work ect.

From a financial point of view, I have been paying for my son while he's with me and his mother has been doing the same while with her..Seems fair? I've had to rent a property, like I said she is living in my property (rent free) which I inherited many years ago (over10). I earn about 7 thousand a year more than she does.
Just to clarify, when we lived together there was no mortgage to pay, I paid all the bills. My ex often bought the shopping though it wasn't unheard of for me to pay for the shop. We split paying for holidays ect and always controlled our own money. I'm currently still paying all the bills on the property, which can't go on forever as I can't afford it.

So coming back to the present, over the last month or so my ex has been asking me what is happening with the house (fair enough). I've given it a lot of thought and have made the offer that she can live there untill my son is 18 (rent free), she would have to take the bills on.
The reason I made the offer was that I don't want to move back there as I don't want the memories (good and bad) and I know it could effect my son who has already had to deal with too much, by that I mean his parents not being together and having to get used to my new home.
My ex seemed very keen on the idea so I thought all was good, I told her that I would get a lease drawn up to make it official.

So I went to a solicitor and they advised me against such a long lease although I said it was what I wanted. They also posed the question of other people moving in ie; if my ex meets someone else. So basically I've had a clause put in the lease which prevents anyone else other than my ex and my son living in the property without my consent.

My ex had gone balistic about the clause and said I'm trying to control her future. This isn't the case and I genuinely wish her the best. I tried to explain that I woudn't object to someone moving in but before it happens we would need to re-evaluate the situation. I've said that she doen't have to take my offer and is welcome to move out once she sorts something out. I've never put a time line on that.

Basically my fear is that down the line my ex moves someone in and I end up subsidising another man. For instance a guy could move in with my ex and rent out his own property and make money out of living in my house. Just the fact that there is no rent means that someone who moves in would save alot of money.

I really don't know what to do, I thought things were going well but now my ex is threatening to quit work, move out and look after my son full time so I would only have him at weekends. And I'm being controlling!!

Any advice welcome.

Agree with her getting legal advice.

resolution.org.uk/

Can help her find a family lawyer who specialises on financial stuff seeing as this is your sticking point. Lawyers registered with them are meant to not be adversarial.

Look OP - I am going to be blunt.

You are begging to be taken for a ride here.

She has no claim on the property - my understanding is that inherited items stay with the person who inherited them - they are not considered marital assets.

I can understand you wanting to give your son a good life, but this goes far and beyond that. Your ex is saving a fucking FORTUNE on rent, living in a house that belongs to you, whilst she works full time, and you - for reasons I can't quite fathom - are subsidising her completely (even with bills for fucks sake) and paying your own rent separately.

In what world does your ex live in where she thinks it's not okay to expect someone to pay half for a house that they live in? Probably from a world where she is doing exactly that....

She needs to move out of the house. Sorry. I know you would prefer that isn't the case, but if she doesn't want to ask someone else to pay their dues when they live with her, then it's HER that needs to subsidise them, not you.

Why don't you tell her you think the situation at the moment is unresolvable, and you will give her one more year in the property and to find alternative accomodation. Only she and your son can live in the property, and if she wishes to live with someone else, then she can move out at any time before the 12 months.

After the 12 months, if she is still living alone, you will pay half her rent in the new accomodation (again with a pre amount agreed), until she co habits with someone else. At that point, you will stop contributing because it's for the inhabitants to pay rent. The new man wouldn't be lining your pockets, and if she didn't feel comfortable asking him to pay rent (ffs) then it would be her duty to subsidise her new partner.

And crack on with a divorce.

Then in one year, you buy the property you are in now, and rent it out as an investment (as you were planning to do before). The you move into your old house, have the rental income from the new house, and everything works out.

Your child isn't going to turn into some Charles Dicken's esque street child just because your ex has to pay (HALF!!!!) rent on a property.

As an added thought, I hope the clause specified that she could remain until your son's 18th as long as it remained his main residence - you might find he chooses to live with you full time yet she stays in your house! If your relationship continues to deteriorate this could get very messy.

I do think you've made a very generous offer, with a completely logical and sensible clause that she is daft to fight.
You're not being in the slightest bit controlling, just following the advice of your solicitor - being generous doesn't mean being stupid.

If the point was to not subsidize another man, rather than to sabotage her chances for a future relationship, perhaps you could charge rent
if that would make her happy and you could put it in a college fund for your son? Then, would it be ok with you if her future new man moved in? If not then perhaps also cover the angle that she could not take on boarders in the lease.

I do not think your stipulation is unreasonable. Your house- your rules. You might consider adding a clause or two in there regarding meth labs and hoarding as grounds for eviction. (There was nothing in your post, mynewname 1, that made me think of those things, but just thought I'd mention it.)

Just a bit of back ground, I inherited the house when I was a child. It was rented out until I moved in about 12 months before I met my ex then she moved in about a year later. So I don't really have any great attachment to the house.
I really don't have any desire to move back in there. Hence I thought it was a good plan to make my ex the offer. Trying to be a great Dad!

Well if you have your son half of the time your liability for maintenance would be greatly reduced as far as I'm aware.

You just say if another man moves in here I won't be subsidising that. End of story. You won't be able to reason with her because she thought she was getting a free ride and now she isn't and she doesn't like it. I mean you are having your son half of the time so it's not like you won't have your own living costs.

Can you go back to the drawing board and ask your lawyer what they would suggest?

kaykay is right, absolutely.
You say you're not a rich man, but maybe that's because while you are both earning similar amounts, you are paying full rent on one property and full bills on two properties, while she is paying...?
Don't be a mug.

I don't think you would have to pay maintenance of your share care 50/50 because you are both liable for child costs the same amount of time.

I don't think you are being controlling. Entirely reasonable. It is not her lifestyle you are subsidising by allowing her free rent it is your sons security. And it did also cross my mind that she was seeing someone else. It may not be at the moving in stage yet but it certainly sounds like there is something from her reaction.

You are being more than fair. I agree that she is likely to get less and less reasonable as time goes on; she sounds very angry and bitter.

Can you reverse the situation? Ask her what she would think if she had to subsidise your new (future, hypothetical) partner's lifestyle?

Tell her, very reasonably, that she is most welcome to move out and rent/buy somewhere with her own money if she is not happy with your suggestion.

You say you earn more money than her, could you offer to pay a bit of maintenance if she does this? I 100% do not think you need to if you have your son 50% of the time. But, you'd be saving on rent as you'd live back in your house, so you could offer a small amount simply to keep her sweet if you think you wouldn't miss it too much. She sounds like she'd probably take offence and say you're being patronising/ she doesn't need your help, but it might be worth it just to keep the peace. Of course, it could back fire. Give her an inch, and she might expect a mile. Hmm, maybe go back to your solicitor, or suggest mediation?

Good luck.

You are being too generous and can't believe that your ex doesn't see it that way. Having said that, if I were her, I wouldn't want to be beholden to my ex and would find my own property.

I wouldn't let her live there rent free. She can pay you rent or move out and then you can rent out the property.

If you have your child 50% of the time then I think you don't actually need to pay her anything.

But if you do give her the house rent free then I wouldn't make it a permanent arrangement. You need to have the freedom to do what you need with the house. You could lose your job and need the proceeds from the house sale to set up your own business. You could meet someone else and have more kids so need a bigger house so need funds from selling your house etc. 15 years is a long time, anything could happen.

How about you suggest (check with your lawyer) that is any other person (ie regardless of the relationship with your ex) moves in, then that person has to pay 50% of the current market rental of the property.

So, means she cannot lease out a room for her profit. She can easily have a new relationship - just that if that were the case the new partner is not rent free..

I really don't want to prevent her moving on and having another relationship, I just want to look after my asset. I'm going to suggest a differently worded clause which just spells out that full rent must be payed if anyone else moves in. Then we can sort out if I have to deduct anything for maintenance at the time.

We weren't married by the way.

Part of my feeling was that my grandparents that left me house would be very proud of what I was doing for my son. Might sould silly.

People are talking bollocks when they say she won't be as reasonable as she is now when she gets a new man. She isn't being reasonable now ffs!!

I would sell the house. She wants everything her own way doesn't she. Little princess needs to grow up. Making threats etc. Ask her why she thinks it is fair, for someone who is nothing to do with you or the baby, to live rent free and if she carries on SHE will be paying rent.

absolutely fair as fair can be.

if a woman privately renting invited a guy to live with her, he would have to share the living expenses. He would have to be prepared to share the living expenses. From day one. OR SHE WOULD COVER THEM. that would be her decision to do so, but in this case YOU would be the one covering HIS inability/unwillingness to pay.

You are subsidising her life for now for the sake of your son, and that is admirable.

Carry on as you are and state that this is not you being difficult, it is legally the best thing for all parties and will not impact on anything until such time as she wants to move on and cohabit with another man.

There is no reason on earth as to why you should pay for another man to live in your house.

I'd suggest that you hold firm, state that this is following extensive advice and that you are comfortable to make the offer for her to continue to live there as she is, but that if the situation changes, you have to have yourself covered for this. She should get legal advice. she doesn't have to accept this and on the face of it, this clause doesn't seem to be an unreasonable stipulation.

People are talking bollocks when they say she won't be as reasonable as she is now when she gets a new man. She isn't being reasonable now ffs!!

And she will be less reasonable when a new man comes along. Not sure what you're disagreeing with.

I think your grandparents would be telling you not to mug yourself!!

By the sounds of it, you are already a great dad. Subsidising your ex's life for no reason is not part of being a great dad. It's being taken for a sugar daddy.

I would speak to your lawyers and see what language THEY would advise.

What's to stop your ex having someone in the house 7 days a week, but keeping their own rental property? Or spending their time half in half out the house? That way she could say that legally, the person doesn't "live" there, but you'd still be the mug paying for them.

To be frank, how would you even know if there was someone else living there? Would you be relying on your ex's sense of integrity to tell you?

I'm going to speak to her tonight and try and explain things a little better and possibly suggest a different wording to the clause. I'll need to talk to the lawyer too. I'll also suggest she take legal advice too.

Like I say other than this hicup! things have been ok even before she knew anything about my offer. I've already told her she needs to take the bills on asap.

Yes KayKayblue, I was hoping that she would be honest and reasonable! I'm trying to be.

I don't see myself as being a mug for putting a roof over my sons head. But it would be if I were taken advantage of hence trying to mitigate against it.

Good on you for putting a roof over your son's head.
However, you are currently putting two roofs over his head.
It's not your responsibility to subsidise your ex.

in your op you say there was no mortgage to pay, I paid all the bills. My ex often bought the shopping though it wasn't unheard of for me to pay for the shop

you then say The reason I need to be able to stop someone else moving in and living there rent free is me trying not to be a mug.....I don't know anything about maintenance....

sorry to be harsh but you've been taken for a mug the whole time she was living with you! It's no wonder she's being unreasonable about the clause, she's used to having you pay her way in life and providing everything for her! Now she's got you believing that you will be harming your son if you refuse to be a mug any longer.

speak to your solicitor about maintenance and get clued up on that - you will need that advice if/when she decides 50/50 shared care is not working for her.

Charge her something for rent - otherwise you are enabling her to take you for a mug and she will because she's already shown you that she has no respect or consideration for your situation or your reasonable request. if nothing else charge her half your own rent like another poster above suggested. make sure your contract/lease is watertight and covers all angles, as has been suggested above her new partner could be living with her but on paper be registered as living elsewhere, you also need to look after your own future and have the freedom to sell/move in to the house as and when your circumstances change.

stand up for yourself. you sound like you are easily influenced by her and willing to do anything to appease her.

So you have an amicable split of your son's time 50/50 and she is threatening to quit work and stop you from your 50 in order to screw you of money. What a selfish person.

Get as much proof as you can of the 50/50 split! Try and get everything you say to her in writing/text/email from now on. A paper trail helps with the memory if she does try this and is better than a he said/she said.

As others suggest I think you need to go to a proper solicitor who deals in child residency (can't think of a better word sorry) and speak about your son's rights to continue with a working 50/50 if she tries to do this. How difficult it would be to enforce if she did this. Plus how much you would have to pay her.

She is bloody stupid. She is living rent free and only paying bills.

Not advocating this but you can always evict her, cut your hours to what you need to pay the bills and suggest that your son is better with you than her. Especially as she only wants him to screw you (and the tax payer if she is going to give up work) for ££.

Your heart definitely seems to be in the right place, but as others said, this is an incredibly bad idea.

You've split, therefore you should disentangle yourselves as much as possible. This house thing will carry on causing aggravation for years to come. If you are genuinely keen to look out for your son then help to ensure his parents stay as friendly as possible by getting rid of this ridiculous plan.

I think legally its a good idea to charge her something for rent - even if its only a nominal amount, so that there is a proper agreement in place, and it gives you some protection should you need to get her out. I think you also need to include periods of notice, again, for your own protection, because you just dont know what the future may bring. 12 month contracts are simple enough and give time for reassesment each yaer.
I think you are being much more than fair, I think she is the controlling/entitled one

I think life will be better for both of you if you detangle your finances/living situation, so that where she is living is her home - are you in a position where you could sell your house to her, if that's where she wants to carry on living?

You're not being controlling, but she's not wrong for wanting control over who she chooses to live with.

In terms of assisting your son, you could put cash into a Junior ISA for him/buy other property with a view to making money on a subsequent sale to use for his benefit etc. I suppose you could even give a sum of money to your son, that his mother can use as part of her deposit on a house, leading to the house your son and his mum live in being owned by both of them, with your son having an entitlement at 18 to the value [at which point his mum could buy him out and/or sell the house].