Is this therapist overstepping the mark?

[Roomaloo]

i wasn't really sure where to post this. My H is having psychodynamic therapy and has had about 4 sessions with a new therapist. He always tells me about the sessions after and some things have made me question her, but I'm not sure if that's just what they do?

General examples are she will pull faces to show shock/distaste etc at some things he tells her (usually about his mum) and has made comments along the lines of "Nooooo!" And "She really did that?!" I thought they were meant to stay impartial?

More specifically she said in her opinion there is nothing wrong with watching porn. And that maybe I'm controlling (when my husband said he does not find me controlling she then went on to say maybe he did subconciously!) I was fuming!

Is this kind of thing ok? It's very much more involved than the last lady he saw but that was a different type of therapy

It's hardly a quest. However, it's a fairly common tactic for someone to attribute words to another person if they think those words will have more weight, more authority or as a once-removed way of testing out a sensitive issue. 'It's not me who thinks you're a bit overbearing, you understand... it's my therapist'. In the context of an EA upbringing, it's also not unheard of for someone to go on to choose a partner with similar characteristics.

The OP does seem fairly insistent....

I'm a therapist too. I echo pretty much what llamasinpyjamas said. I don't think she has done anything wrong, or that should be reported. Therapists all have their own style. Some will offer more of their own opinions or feelings than others. Of course, if he doesn't like her style, then he can discuss it with her or stop going.

I don't think she has done anything wrong either, knowing several counsellors as friends and colleagues.

The point is how the DH interpreted the comments and if something was 'lost' between the actual conversation and his account of it to the DW.

I have a good friend who has been having counselling and she will sometimes tell me the counsellor said/ suggested this and that whereas I know it's unlikely (I know the counsellor professionally) and what in fact has probably happened is the counsellor has not contradicted my friend, may have nodded ( as if to imply empathy , rather than 'approval') and so on.

A 'Nooooooo' would be very different if it was 'No???' ( inviting further discussion by the client) rather than 'Noooooooooo!'

I do think that in counselling people sometimes hear what they want to and put their own slant on the counselllor's behaviour, in order to confirm their own feelings about something.

Many thanks to all those who took the question at face value without bizarrely trying to make assumptions about me, my husband or our relationship

Your replies were helpful

I think that Reporting a Professional on the basis of what someone else has said they said
(esp in terms of how they did or didn't emphasise a word such as: 'no')
would be quite wrong.

Remember, you only have your husband's take on this - you were not there. He cannot be completely impartial. Nor could the therapist (not totally, which is why they have Supervision), only a tape recorder would allow you to judge what was said, and in what tone, and even that does not catch body language / all context for example.

Person centered therapy is very much reflecting back to the client what they have said to allow them to re-experience it in a clarifying manner.
Other kinds of therapy can be more dynamic.
It is possible your H has moved from one kind of Counselling Dynamic to another (also one Counsellor to another!).

A counsellor should not impose her own opinions on your H but may well offer thoughts as part of the process of helping him understand his own reactions (or lack of) in the dynamic of his childhood which can influence his current life.

Why did he change from the last Counsellor?
You said you had experience of the last one?
Did you also have some couples counselling?
What is he hoping for from this new Counselling?

(I am not simply pro-Counsellors, btw, having experienced some shocking examples, but I don't think a formal complaint re this would be at all appropriate, with the info so far)

I like my current counsellor. She has facial expressions and her own opinions, and she asks challenging questions, particularly about things I don't want to talk about.

OP, I think you need to step back a bit. By all means let your husband talk over his therapy with you, but don't take it so personally. He has to try out new ideas if he's going to heal.

I'm a bit puzzled as to how a therapy session about EA gets into "it's ok to watch porn" unless she is suggesting his mother was controlling and you are too?

Is she reviewing his entire relationship with women - and how is porn relevant to an abusive parent?

I'm a tiny bit inclined to think the therapist is actually projecting onto your DH here. But more evidence needed.
If she starts asking him about whether he was breast fed he should definitely find another therapist.

if he has a negative attitude to women, formed by having a controlling mother and seeking to replicate that by choosing a controlling woman for a wife, he might find porn more acceptable because it gives him a sense of power and shows him women who are being controlled and used.

or, like a lot of men, he might just get off on it.

I think you are over reacting here OP.

The therapist is merely acknowledging what your husband is saying to her, not with a nod but with some verbal communication. You said you MiL has done some bad things so I don't know why you're surprised.

Similarly it is ok to watch porn (each to their own) I'm assuming your dh liked watching porn and stopped because of your relationship. He may well not have wanted to stop watching it but has obviously respected the relationship.

Miggsie, just because the underlying reason for attending therapy is the relationship with his mother doesn't mean that other topics don't come up. Infact it would be strange if they didn't. All current issues in his life; his relationships, how he deals with work, his marriage, beliefs about himself, issues about his sexuality would all be relevant. You can't work on an issue like an abusive relationship with a parent in isolation.

Another therapist here, integrative trained but with a relational psychodynamic/existential leaning.

I also agree with llamasinpyjamas, you have no grounds whatsoever to report this therapist. For what exactly? Not being anti-porn and making a few noises/facial expressions? The BACP would not give a toss and they can be pretty draconian believe me.

Many therapists will be trained in the same approaches but will still have their own individual styles. Also, pure psychodynamic therapists are less common these days. It's kind of seen as a bit old hat. What is more popular is Relational Psychodynamics, where the 'blank canvas' style has been replaced by an attempt to create a more authentic, warm, empathic relationship with the client. Sounds like this is what she is doing.

As for the porn thing, it would have been less professional for her to tell him that it wasn't ok to watch it, hardly showing unconditional positive regard is it?

Obviously if your dh feels uncomfortable with this therapist he should change, but I can't see any grounds for that here. You might want to do some thinking about whether she does in fact have grounds for suggesting you may be controlling.

Ultimately, if your DH doesn't feel her therapeutic style is helpful to him then he should change therapists. If he feels she is crossing a line then he should make a complaint. But you can't really make a judgement based on second hand information, and I don't think he should be telling you in so much detail what they talk about, it should be his private space to talk about anything without thinking "what is DW going to make of this later?"

It might be that your husband finds controlling relationships easier to handle and he might be more used to them. So he might be trying to interpret therapist's reactions in a way that would make them more prescriptive and therefore more acceptable to him.

I agree with llama

I work in the field and most often find person centred to be very unhelpful anyway, and often people need suggestions, discussions, debates and other ways of thinking. After all, that's the reason they are struggling, right? Cos they can't find the answers themselves.

I would say that though...

you weren't there so it is only his take on it.

I did go to some joint sessions when ex was v in bad state v angry - i had been advised to try and use the joint sessions to get a good separation tho with hindsight it wasnt appropriate..anyways... at one point he smashed his fist onto table. to emphasise his view point. therapist said "I can see you feel v strongly about that".

his take? he came to my house and smashed things up and said

"the therapist said it was ok for me to smash things"

point being - his take on what she said and how she looked, her expressions may be different from what you would have seen had you been there.

they are his sessions. you can ask how they went and say something non-committal to his interpretation; you could eg ask him what "controlling " means to him.... but it is early days...

you could ask whether she wants to see you too at some point either with or without him.

You see OP he could be interpreting her expressions of 'shock and distaste' at his descriptions on his mum in order to give validity to his own opinions( on his mum).

Expressions are very subjective- it could be 'mock' horror - to elicit more detail, or challenge his assumptions.

It's the same as when my friend tells me the counsellor agreed with her about her opinions on something bad her DH did. I doubt the counsellor 'agreed' at all, but she may have nodded vigorously, in 'keep on talking' mode or even muttered a resounding 'Hmmmm!'

As everyone keeps telling you, unless you were there, 2nd hand info is not accurate because body language is open to differing interpretations.

None of what you have said is worthy of reporting to the BACP but if your DH ( not you) doesn't like the counsellor then he can move on.

Why should a counsellor remain impartial? One I saw once was so on my side - she empathised, understood, agreed some things I thought were awful were indeed awful... I absolutely needed someone to 'back me up' in my own mind. She changed my life. Was brilliant.

Oh dear. That goes against all the training
They have to be impartial because you have to find your own answers. friends and family give opinions. Counsellors cannot tell you what to do because if it all goes wrong then you would blame them for following their advice.

Funny- But I would report someone like your counsellor but no the OP's!

It's not against my training. If someone was abused, emotionally or physically, I think it is perfectly ok to say to them, you were abused, what happened to you was very wrong. That is not the same as giving advice.

Would this be 'opinions'?

Client: I was raped when I was a child but no one seemed to care. Was it that bad? Should I be angry? I don't know... I feel I don't want to see xx again because of it. It wasn't taken seriously so maybe it wasn't that bad

Counsellor - yes, that was bad. I think it's normal and expected to be angry. And no, you never have to see that person again if that's what you want. That is fine. Is that what you want?

Xpost with Majestic. That was point, thank you

I'm sorry but what's the issue here? She showed she was listening by facial expressions, she showed her support for him by exclamation marks in her speech and she suggested he may have feelings which are subconcious. Good luck with reporting her, she's done nothing wrong poor woman. I should think rather you don't like her suggesting to your husband that his feelings about you might be something less than 100% pleasing and that you might be a tad controlling. But yes getting all the info out of him about his personal therapy is not at all controlling is it? Or is it?

I had an impartial therapist for three years and made virtually no progress. She just listened but as was so good at changing the subject that we never got down to it, iyswim.

A later more challenging therapist, and me being more self aware generally, did not remain 'impartial' but said things like 'Would you treat your children like that?' and 'That action of your father's reminds me of how you might treat a used tissue.'

And that validation is what helped me heal. She was absolutely professional and experienced but why not call a spade a spade and let people know that their parent's version of normal is damaging?

Sorry,I was so good at changing the subject.

Rape is against the law. yes that is where a counsellor can say it is bad because you were subjected to abuse and to a crime.

What a counsellor cannot say is 'yes I agree or suggest you leave your Dh because he makes a noise when he eats and it's unacceptable to do that when you find it annoying'.