Atmosphere with in laws- how to resolve

[mermaid101]

There are tensions between me and my in laws. There has been no falling out or anything. However, there appears to be mutual antipathy. I feel that over the years they have been quite dismissive/unkind to me. There are several instances I can think of, but it is more just their general attitude towards me.

I've been fairly philosophical about this, but my husband told me today how difficult he finds it. He says they feel I don't like them. This is true, but I feel like this because of how I think they have been with me.

I think I have been quite selfish and not given enough thought to how difficult this must be for my DH. I need to find a way to try to move this situation forward. But I just go d it so difficult to be anything more than polite with them.

In the interests of not drop feeding, we have a 3 year old and a new baby (9 weeks). Things are not going well. The baby is not sleeping well. We are exhausted and I think I might have mild post natal depression.

Indeed he should do this but inbuilt conditioning is in itself a powerful force. His actions currently are simply hurting his own self as well as his own family unit now. Many men who grow up with such difficult people as parents do find it very difficult if not nigh on impossible to go against such a lifetime of breaking free of such constraints. He on some level perhaps knows that their behaviour is not right but at the same time does not want to "upset" his parents by challenging their behaviour. He's still wanting their approval. I am also sure that he would very much like all this to just go away so he does not have to rock the boat and just carry on as he has always done.

They sound awful and your DH sounds a drip when it comes to them.

Hm, yes, it could be that he does know, depp down, that he's being useless but, as you say, Attila, feels quite helpless as he doesn't have any strategy for dealing with his parents. My ex was also pretty shit at that, it is not great.

Oh, you poor girl. I wish I were your MIL, I'd cherish and support you. As for your ILs, they obviously have a HUGE chip on their shoulders and their awful behaviour is an attempt to 'put you in your place'. I agree with others here - your DP must stand up to them and realise where his priorities lie. And if that means a massive row with them, so be it. YOU have to come first and if he can't see that, then he's a bloody fool. I am so SO irritated on your behalf.

ravenmum - the OP was in the hospital, and her DH was holding the baby, as they'd previously agreed because his parents both smoke and they didn't want their second hand smoke on their brand new baby. So neither he nor the OP were in a position to fetch another chair.

Hi Mermaid!
I remember you from another thread. Sorry you're having a hard time

No advice (am in similar situation and my relationship with DP is being seriously damaged by MIL) but I hope you get some decent sleep soon. Congrats on new baby BTW

Thumbwitch - yes, that scenario didn't even occur to me, as it seemed far too bizarre! Making a patient sit on a hospital floor? Unbelievable.

Thanks again everyone.
Just to clarify, the sitting on the floor incident happened in our house and not in a hospital.

I suppose both my DH and I were pretty shell shocked and a bit befuddled. It could have been dealt with better by him/us.

I did talk to him about this before I gave birth for the second time. He agreed that he should have stepped in when that happened.

We agreed a "strategy" which was why the next time I was on a seat and not insisting I was fine.

I suppose all of these situations, as isolated incidents, could be put down to misunderstandings, but all of these (and there are more!) suggest to me some pretty poor behaviour.

Old-I wish you were my mother in law! I don't have a great relationship with my own mother. I would have really welcomed a warm and positive relationship with my mil. My own father is dead. I would have loved a sort of dad type figure in my life.

Hi mermaid

I agree these people are being unfair to you and it's possible they feel threatened by your wealth, intelligence or background. That threat is manifesting itself in thinly veiled digs at you.

I have been in a situation not too dissimilar from yours and yes the pressure on my dh was awful because at first he didn't see it, that made me feel loopy and unsupported, then he did see it but felt unable to do anything about it and I totally understood why.

What I did at this point was to take the pressure off him by explaining that his family were nice people with a bit of dysfunction. I said that is ok in a family because there are lots of them around. I mean it's not his fault the way his family felt about me, or my fault either.

When they kept up their little game I would not lose it I would just shake my head in disappointment and say oh well sort of thing. Because me ranting and raving stressed him and me, sometimes for days.

Eventually they did something that made him snap and boy did he snap! The days after were very stressful but he felt relieved that he had told them we knew what they had been doing.

I basically accepted how they felt about me. And I knowingly accept it when in their company I am just myself and that's all I can be. I would never want my dh to sever ties with them as I couldn't bear to have it on my conscience plus they're his family.

I suppose I'm saying accept what you can't change. Any rudeness directed at you 'did you mean to sound so rude' or being more assertive if possible. You don't have to accept rudeness from them but stand up to it and I bet they will start to think twice next time.

Hope this makes sense!

You need to tell your DH that you didn't dislike your PILs until they started being rude to you and inconsiderate of your needs. Say that you will continue to be polite to them in order to keep the peace enough for you to be able to see each other but, if they want you to like them, they need to stop making PA comments, raising their eyes to the ceiling at you, and implying that you are lying when you say you are having difficulties with something. If he doesn't feel able to tell them this, you will quite understand but he must understand that you can offer only politeness in response to their current treatment of you and he should be grateful that you are willing to go that far.

FWIW I had PILs who felt exactly the same about me as yours do. In the end DH began to reduce contact with them and our DD1 (their 'favourite' grandchild) refused to see them at all for a while before they died. It was sad but it was mostly their loss.

That's interesting gold. Thanks for that. Could you tell me, did yourDH realise the situation, or did you need to point it out to him?

i agree with goldmandra. you ARE doing your best, and if his parents want things to improve they are going to have to make some effort too. why should it all be you?

Could you tell me, did yourDH realise the situation, or did you need to point it out to him?

The inverted snobbery was only one aspect of their awful behaviour and, thinking about it, he withdrew as much because of the put-downs aimed at him and our DD2 as the way they treated me.

For a while, I was the one encouraging him to arrange visits until I decided that I wasn't prepared to row with him to make them happen.

He didn't always recognise the subtleties of the PA comments for himself but I did usually point them out to him afterwards, mainly because I needed to vent at someone.

Ah sorry raven (and mermaid) - it really did look like that had happened in the hospital.

Thanks gold.

Could I ask you one more question please? How did you deal with the comments? Did you respond in anyway?
I'm hoping to find some inspiration as how to react/respond. I have to see them soon for a family event, so I'm trying to get geared up!

Maybe point out the overall lack of warmth. My DH missed a lot of the looks and snide comments but he did see and was upset by the lack of genuine care and consideration they showed towards me in various situations. It's not normal to minimize the pain resulting from a c-section for example. If you set him to comparing genuinely warm relationships with what you have with you IL he may see it in the end.

You sound very nice and thoughtful. I really mean that. It seems a bit like this barb about you being posh or spoilt or a princess has got under your skin. You don't sound even the tiniest bit spoilt or selfish to me, but even in your opening post that is how you describe yourself. Try not to take on board the things you are being told - it is totally reasonable to be treated with kindness and respect. You shouldn't have to "earn" kindness from your family.

Honestly, I would give up on trying to persuade them that you are not posh or spoilt or whatever. You aren't, and if they don't want to see that, it is up to them. I would try and breeze straight through their comments - e.g. when your FIL said "you look alright to me", you could say "well yes, I am really pleased with how I am doing, given that I just had major surgery. I think people forget sometimes quite how serious an operation a caesarean is" or something like that. In other words, see if you can put him back in his box without him seeing you are upset. Similarly, if he makes a comment about your neighbourhood, could you say something like, "it is odd to me when people say things like that. We find it very friendly here so I wonder what it is about them that made it hard for them to fit in." Or even "some people are weird, aren't they" (you can use that for a lot of barbed "examples").

Basically, try not to absorb nasty comments, bounce them back out again because they are designed to put you down.

However, I would also agree with pretty much everyone else that your DH needs to step up - it is easier for him to ask you to make sacrifices for the sake of this relationship because you are a nicer person than they are. That is absolutely not fair.

FWIW, I used to use those sorts of responses with my ex's parents and they worked really well. Or I would just tilt my head to one side and say "do you really think so? Hmmmm, interesting." or words to that effect and look a bit surprised and then change the subject. If they then pursue it, it makes them look argumentative but it makes it clear you think they are wrong. In fact, it makes it seem like you think they are so obviously wrong that it isn't worth you saying why.

How did you deal with the comments? Did you respond in anyway?

I often presented wide-eyed innocence and appear to mistake the malice behind their comments for misunderstandings. That spikes their guns a bit without risking open confrontation. I knew that once I started telling them what I thought I probably wouldn't stop.

If I'd been asked how I was then told I looked fine I probably would have smiled sweetly and then carefully explained in words of one syllable why someone could look fine but still have an infection on an operation site is the way one might do to a five year old.

I also did a lot of pretending not to hear and talking over the bitching, completely changing the subject. I used to prepare myself beforehand with a few things I could suddenly remember, e.g. "Oh, DH, have you told your Mum and Dad who we saw at the garden centre the other day?" It used to stop them in their tracks quite nicely.

I was able to do that because we didn't see them very often. If I'd had to spend more time with them, I probably would have called them on it, perhaps using the MN standard "Did you mean to be so rude?" or maybe "I'm sorry you don't believe me. Would you like a doctor's note?"

How did you deal with the comments? Did you respond in anyway?

Intense sarcasm would be good love; as KKBLue has detailed in her post

*"I know X who moved to that area and everyone was so posh and unfriendly that he came home within a year"
"Well of course. People in our area normally have their mouths so stuffed with caviar and macrons that it's difficult to make small talk" OR

"Maybe he just missed getting regular exercise from having to run away from the street thugs/muggers around here" (sweet smile)

"How are you doing?"
"Okay, but infected"
"Well you look fine to me"
"Thank you. That would be the maybelline." OR
"Thanks for your input - remind me, where did you do your medical degree again?" OR
"If you need "evidence" then I can show you the bruised, pus dripping wound if you like? No? Oh okay then".*

But I agree it is your husband that has the issue here; he needs to start standing up for you.

Ahhh - funkybold has put what I was going to if you wanted to go the sarcastic route! especially in terms of any commentary on your health.
"Oh I'm sorry, I didn't realise you'd qualified as a medical doctor, why did you give it up?" would also work.

But in general I would do the civil version - slight eyebrow raise, "really? How interesting that you think that" (also very PA but whatever), or total (deliberate) misunderstanding of their comments. In fact, if they are being subtly foul to you, bring it out into the open - say: "I'm sorry, I don't understand - are you suggesting that my doctor is lying? Why would he do that?"

If your DH is having trouble spotting their subtle digs, then bringing them to the fore like that would help him to see what they're up to!

Sarcasm is satisfying, but not likely to improve the atmosphere, is it - assuming that is what is wanted? And it basically involves making nasty comments of the type you don't like them making - comments that they can then repeat to their friends and family as an example of what a cow you are. I'm not sure I'd provide them with that weapon.

How about answering "You always say just what you think, don't you?" with a smile or teasing look of shock. Or just adopt the expression of a tired adult putting up with children jumping on her, say "Really?" then change the subject.

But really, it would be nice if you got a minute alone with your MIL and had a chance to talk to her more privately - maybe give her a couple of compliments to warm her up, then talk about the differences in your background and even ask her if she finds it hard to get on with you. Kill her with kindness and understanding.

Either that or just accept that neither of you like each other, put up with the thorny atmosphere from both sides and try to see as little of them as you can.

I do not think you will have much if any luck in trying to call truly toxic people (the worst of the worst) out when they’ve continuously insulted you. What they could well respond with is a snarky, “I’m sorry you took what I said so personally.” Much more effective has been ending conversations with sickening sweetness or just plain abruptness. The message is clear: There is no reward for subtle digs and no games will be played at your end.

Yes you're both right. [hangs head]

I have no skills in this area.

Whether or not sarcasm suits depends on whether mermaid a) really does want to improve the relationship and b) could care less about what they respond to her comments!