how do I get me head around my sister that doesnt care?

[ssd]

I'm the youngest by far in my family, also have another sibling in the middle

basically my older sister and I have opposite natures, I'm very sensitive and caring, she puts herself first.

my mum died and I'm still grieving, she moved on straight( she told me this) away, I had cared for mum, sister left it all to me

anyway, what I want to ask is how do I accept she is how she is? I know that sounds daft, I'm not a baby but I cant get my head round it.

I'm hurt/bewildered by it all, its been going on for years. But I'm fed up caring and want to get closure for how I feel about her, and stop looking for her to care about me...how do I do this? I cant tell her, would get too emotional, anyway she lives 100's of miles away.

is there anyone else out there who has got over this? maybe it makes it harder that I'm the youngest, I sort of grew up with her like another mum to me and I thought she might care for me a teeny bitas I got older, but no.

Acceptance is such a personal thing. In your case it sounds as though your relationship with your sister is a 'triumph of hope over experience'... expectations that are completely at odds with the reality. Sometimes distance helps. Sometimes it's a function of personal security i.e. genuinely not needing the other person to care or approve.

thanks for answering me cogito.

what you wrote makes sense.

there is physical distance between us, but mentally I'm still there, I dont know how to get to the "genuinely not needing the other person to care or approve" bit, and I really really want to not care anymore.

its so hard to get there.

when I feel like I genuinely dont care anymore, I'll speak to her about it. I dont want to do that just now as I'd only cry, and I feel she'd have the upper hand. I want the upper hand for once, meaning I want to be the one who doesnt need her, not the other way around.

Ssd...as you know I have the same issue with my sister.
She is abroad again and we are taking mum on holiday for a week on Friday.
I wish I had an answer for you.
Some people are just more selfish than others.
It also sounds like you had a much closer relationship with your mother than she did and even though you say it was her choice, perhaps some part of her was jealous of that?
X

hi badvoc , nice to "see" you!

I dont think she was jealous, she wouldnt feel that strongly either way, or even notice....

some people are just more selfish than others, you are so right

I think because she is so much older than me, I look to her to be like a second mum and shes the opposite

I think - with my sister - I need,to learn not to expect her to behave a certain way. She never has, so why would she start now?
I suppose I hoped that losing dad and mum being ill would focus her mind more, maybe?
I don't know.
All I know is that you have nothing to reproach yourself for. Not something your sister can say, sadly.

You say you think she's selfish, but could she just be shallow?

Some people just don't have emotional depth. If something doesn't directly affect or influence them, then they have very little emotion for it.

She lives far away, so your parents and you have little daily, weekly, monthly or ANY effect on her life. So there is just no emotion for anything that has no DIRECT relevance to her. So yes, selfish, but not because she doesn't WANT to care, but she just doesn't know how because of her narrow life.

Those with deeper emotions don't have to have constant interactions to have the feelings, they feel attachment to people, care for them, empathise with them, regardless of how often they see them - this sounds like you.

Pity her, those who are shallow don't feel the true happiness either. To feel the heights of emotion, you need to feel the depths as well.

maybe it would help to think about or even write down all the disappointments and let downs, and all the positive incidents. Put the list away for a week then then look at it dispassionately. Look at the picture of the person that's built up from it.

From what you say there are far more disappointments than positives. Maybe looking at this list will help you see the actual person that's there rather than the person that you'd like her to be.

Then give yourself time to be disappointed in her and to grieve for the second mother that you want her to be and that you thought she was, but isn't. With luck, that might make it easier to let go of the illusion and see her for the person she really is. Then you can decide if / how far / what way you want to be in touch

What was the relationship with your actual mother like btw?

I was very close to my mum, she died in her 80's and I cared for her for years. Not in a smothering way, just caring really. My sister never took her on and never asked me how I was.

I dont know, I just feel family is family and blood is thicker than water, but thats rubbish. I've had more kindness and empathy on mn than I've ever had from her. She is very shallow, dh says she lives in her own wonderful bubble and if you're not part of the bubble to her you dont exist, like me and mum.

I just find it so hard to get my head round as its the polar opposite from me.

Ever since I was young I thought she was adopted, even as a young kid I knew we were opposites. She seems to have no feelings for her blood family at all.

I actually have a fantasy, where the hospital phones me up and says sorry, we gave your mum the wrong baby, she isnt your sister at all, heres your sister...and a nice friendly woman appears and we hug each other!

that would make total sense to me.

Hi ssd

My brother and I are in a similar position to you and your sister (possible not quite as extreme though) only I am your sister and my brother is you.

It's not that I don't care about my brother, or that I'm 'selfish' or shallow, I just don't 'need' him in the way that he 'needs' me. I sometimes feel that his expectations of me are quite 'selfish'. Who's to say who is right?

I find the weight of his expectations of me quite hard to bear at times. We often fall out over it because I expect very little of him. He gets cross with me because I don't anticipate his 'needs'. If he expresses them, I try to accomodate them, but most of the time I'm somewhat by them. I tend to do the things he's asked because he's asked rather than because I understand them, or feel it's necessary. And then he gets cross with me about that!

But it's not that I don't care. I just don't need the same things from 'family' as he does.

We have a very small family. Actually, now it's just us and our children. It really upsets him. But it doesn't upset me. But I'm not shallow and i don't live in a bubble. It's not a fault in me. We're just different. I don't understand why he, as an adult, needs so much from me, to be honest.

I'm probably not helping. I suppose what I'm trying to say is that it doesn't mean she's a bad person, but if she really doesn't feel what you feel, then there probably isn't a lot you can do about it.

You've said a couple of times that you saw her as a second mother growing up. But she wasn't. She was your sister. Do you think that maybe your expectations of her are beyond 'normal' sister interactions/relationships?

I'm not sure people can say she'll never truly be happy though because she doesn't have the same needs as someone else. That's a bit odd.

The fact is that despite being related my sister and I are very different people.
Sad thing is if I worked with her i am pretty sure I would actively avoid her
:(
I have accepted that my sister and I will never be close.
It's sad, but I have other family. I have my Dh and dc.
I try to surround myself now with people who want to spend time with me rather than those who feel obliged to.

I probably come from a dysfunctional family and I have a younger sister who benefitted from having a much closer relationship with our mother than I ever had. It was my job to leave home, be successful and a credit to their parenting, and hers to stay close by and require help to make up for her 'lack of advantages' as seen and assessed by my mother (over-compensation?)

In theory, it would have fallen on my sister to care for her in her old age, although as it turned out, my mother had a very short illness and died and I had to go and help sort out things for the few days she was ill.

Since my mother had little part in my every day life, it was easy to move on. I would have liked to have felt a bit more sad about it, but she had not even visited me in the 3 years before she died - I did all the running and had had to step back. Everyone's relationship with their mother is unique, and mine was not the same as my sister's.

For my sister, she has lost much more. It completely messed up her child care arrangements and she now has DF to keep an eye on. She also has much fonder memories of our mother to look back on.

She has always been capable of looking after herself, and if she was looking for a 'second mother' I would tell her where to get off; I have children of my own. To be fair, she isn't, doesn't blame me for anything either and our relationship is the same as it ever was. I still care for her and love her, although we do not have an 'every day' relationship, and so does she.

ssd

I'm also youngest of three, the only girl with two older brothers. My relationship with my eldest brother (and his wife) is similar to that of you and your sister. I take on all of the 'family duty' - looking after my Mum (and Dad before he died), making sure my children and his have cousin relationships, making sure Mum is not alone for events like Christmas and Mothers Day (she is always with me, My brother never thinks to include her).

The difference between you and I though is that I have no problem or issue with this.

My brother was the one who has unresolved issues when Dad died. I didn't, because I know I was the dutiful daughter and gave back what was owed to Dad for being a brilliant parent. Ditto with my Mum, yet I have no doubt elder brother will have unresolved issues when she passes away.

My middle brother also has caring needs - it is me and Mum that meet those needs.

Again, I don't let this bother me. I'm no martyr but value the fact that I have a clear conscious because I am selfless with regards to my family, not selfish as he is. He will suffer for this in the future. I will not. Maybe his own children will be just as selfish when he is older. I know my children will look after me because I lead by example. His loss, not mine.

the second mother thing isnt really true..its hard to explain.

my mum was a great mum, I didnt need another mum. its just as my sister was so much older than me she did everything first, way ahead of me, and I sort of accepted she knew everything (and she thinks this too).I thought of her with respect and admiration until life started kicking in. now I know what shes like , but its hard to kick the thinking she knows everything, as I was brought up like that.

she has no regrets, nothing, I know this for a fact..she honestly believes she is right about everything...shes never been challenged.

I think you are going to have to find a way to step back from this and adjust your expectations.

You see her as selfish and she probably sees you as a bit needy. The truth is you are probably both a little bit right. You are both a product of your upbringings and your environment and that has shaped your expectations. But she is not wrong for not needing you as much as you need her.

What is interesting is that it seems to be the younger siblings that feel like this. My brother is the youngest and he's the 'needy' one.

"now I know what she's like" - ok she might well be a really selfish, nasty bitch, or she may just not be who or what you need her to be. Or, at least, she doesn't live up to the image you held of her. None of that is her 'fault'. It's just the way she is. And the view you had of her wasn't accurate. She hasn't let you down. She just isn't what you thought.

I don't know.
I'm the eldest.
But yes, the stepping back advice is good advice.
None of my family did anything for dad's funeral. Nothing. I did everything.
I had to.
Yes, it hurts. Yes, I don't understand how someone can love someone for 40 years and not have a single idea wrt to their funeral..but...there you go.
My brother didn't even feel the need to help choose the headstone or be at the interment of his ashes.
That's his choice.
Be at peace with your decisions and actions.
And try and accept your sister is happy, even if you cannot understand how.
X

I'd be surprised if she found me needy, I've never asked anything of her.

I'd just like her to care and show some interest in me and my family, like I did for her and her family whilst they were growing up

and I'd have loved her to care about mum..and theres so much more here I could write but its too upsetting.(.but mum knew, although she accepted it, I think..she never said much, only a few remarks which I understood immediately.)

but it just wasnt there.

it's hard op.

my sister is like you, and i am like your sister, to outside eyes.

from my pov, my mother has always been extremely needy and very concerned with things that are completely irrelevant to me. and baffled by the things that were important to me. to the point that she never, ever met my emotional needs.

i grew into a very independent person who looked after myself. i don't believe blood is thicker than water, since blood has never done much for me beyond what was legally required or what would keep the neighbours from looking down on my mother.

my sister otoh strives much, much more to meet my mother's needs, fit her expectations, etc. My dsis feels tremendous loyalty and guilt when it comes to family. she makes herself sick with worry, uses up her holidays keeping my mother company, etc. she sees it as her duty.

whereas i see it as, my family never really met my needs. i have always been alone in my family. i am not bonded to my mother, she spent her time bonding to my sister because she could always "get" more from my sis, she knew she was wasting her time, in a way, trying to "get" anything from me. i feel duty insofar as i would not allow my mother to live on the street. but i would never attempt to meet her emotional needs because i am not emotionally bonded to her.

i am not a shallow person at all. i just do not show my depth to my family because they don't understand it. i accept that and reserve the loyal, faithful, hard-working part of myself for my own nuclear family, who have proven their commitment to me in actions for many years.

not sure if that helps, but that's my perspective. i'm sorry about the loss of your mother and hope you find some peace in terms of how you view your sister.

thats good advice badvoc

I want to be at peace with it all, it gnaws away at me like toothache

I think what upsets me is that as shes a lot older, she had the best of my parents, when her kids were growing up she had mum and dad interested in them and loving them, and me loving them too and wanting to see them. In other words, family who cared. Now mine are growing up they have no grandparents and no one who thinks of them, no one they are important to, apart from me and dh of course. They have no extended family who cares, whereas she had. But she sees no reason to bother with me or my kids, whereas we were there for her. And it doesnt worry her, doesnt bother her in the slightest. I'd like her to ask my kids once, hows school?, hows life?, anything, but she never has...when her kids were growing up they were at the centre of our lives.To me thats what family should be about, caring for each other, not over the top stuff, just showing a bit of love.

That does sound hard and I can see your point of view.
But she obv doesn't care...or rather doesn't show her care in the way you feel she should and the way you would.
I know my siblings love me.
But I know that once mum is gone we will have a very superficial relationship.
Sad, but that's how it is.

The more you write the more I feel I would feel completely smothered if you were my sister. She will care about you, but she doesn't wish to be close in the way you would prefer her to be. You say she is much older. Growing up you may have looked up to her, but she probably felt quite removed from you.

People have different levels of need when it comes to family contact. I prefer minimal myself. Doesn't mean I don't love or care for them.

I think the issue is yours. You need to respect her space and stop accusing her of being unfeeling. That might be one reason she is so distant with you. She probably feels judged.

ssd You do sound a lot like my brother. Especially with all the family stuff. My children are older than his and I carry the weight of his expectation of family. Its exhausting. He romanticises 'family'.

I also think the issue is yours. It was your choice to make her children the centre of your lives when they were growing up. You can't expect the same of her.

My brother and I are quite close and we love each other. But he needs to 'see' that I love him and that needs to look like me making 'sacrifices' to show that he/his family is so important that I would sacrifice something in my life for them. I find that very hard work. And he complains that I don't phone him, yet doesn't phone me.

It's hard and I'm trying not to get annoyed but reading your posts is making me feel the same level of frustration I feel at my brother. So if I'm a little sharp or curt, I apologise. It's not directed at you

My sympathies are with you ssd.
I don't think you sound needy, just sensitive, and you feel you've done a lot of giving and haven't felt much reciprocation.

she honestly believes she is right about everything...shes never been challenged.
This does tend to suggest a certain arrogance, in my view.
She isn't right about everything, ssd...no-one is.

I have the feeling a lot of family energy and attention may have revolved around your sister. And she's taken it for granted as just the natural way of life, while offering very little in return? You said the care of your mum all fell to you. :( you must have felt somewhat lonely and let down during that time. Yes, she was at a distance, but that's no excuse to offer no support at all, not even a 'how's it going, what can I do' .

Your problem is, I think, that you have to face the person she is rather than the person you hoped she was, perhaps. Start to restructure some of the ideas you have about her which are perhaps left over from childhood (it's pretty usual for younger siblings to idolise the older, for example. Time to put that right!)

Are you close to your other sibling at all?

no, my other sibling lives even further away and has for over 40 years

its funny how posting here causes you to get different perspectives, but thats whats so good about it.

my sister would be amazed at how I feel, I've never told her or asked her for anything,I've just seen how things have turned out

restructuring is a good idea wyrdybird. its weird the things we carry on from our childhoods, isnt it?

Why can family push our buttons?
Because they installed them!
:)
You dont sound needy to me ssd.
Just grieving and confused (and I know all too well how that is:()