I don't think she loves me anymore...

[Bashfulbear]

Ladies, excuse me for imposing on your female's forum but I thought this may be a great place to come for some advice.
Yes, I am a man and very worried and upset about my marriage. I really need some help - can you lovely ladies provide some notions of wisdom please?
Scenario - been married for 15 yrs, 3 gorgeous children, nice house in expensive part if the country and relatively good job. All sounds good so far.
I love my wife and really fancy her all the time. But she has no connection with me it seems - she very rarely shows me any affection despite my attempts to say and do all the right things. I know if I talk to her about it will just get brushed under the carpet, especially as she hates confrontation and anything to do with relationships. I just feel like I can't win. I could go on and on but that'll do for now!
Any starting advice would be great.

Are you always under each others feet?

Do you go away without her sometimes and give her a chance to miss you?

When was the last time that you both had some proper time alone together?

When was the last time you both, on your own together, just buggered off away from the humdrum and routine of life for a weekend?

Do you help out around the house with her? or do you wait until you are asked?

Is there any family issues she is worried about? Does she have any time to herself to do a hobby? or just time to just sit a read or just be ?

Unfortunately there are a million and one reasons as to why this may be happening and unless she tells you, you are going to have a tough time trying to figure it out and we won't be able to help much.

I'm sorry to put the boot in when you're obviously distressed about this but perhaps you could drop the patronising term 'ladies'. I do wonder if it is very telling & if you really treat your wife as an equal because that could be a large part of the problem, as well as everything smilesandpiles asked.

But you haven't actually asked her?

Go somewhere, just the two, of you and talk

Your attempts to do the right thing might not be right at all. Don't patronise or tell her what is right about your marriage; ask her (and listen)

How on earth is the word "ladies" patronising?

Smiles - I don't get that either. But I've seen it on several threads where men have used that term and someone pounces on them within the first few postings having a go at them for daring to use that word.

Which is a) unhelpful; b) makes MN look like a nest of vipers just ready to pounce on any man who dares enter the hallowed portals.

Lemon - (sour lemon, presumably) have you launched a campaign to stop Ken Bruce on Radio 2 from saying "Good evening ladies and gentlemen" at the beginning of Friday Night is Music Night? Or any compere in any variety show or concert in any venue in the land from using the term "ladies and gentlemen"? No? Thought not.

Not sour at all but in my experience men who use the term ladies do so as a verbal ruffling of hair or a little pat on the bottom. It's hardly an equal salutation.

"ladies" - might be an interesting other thread. Basic feminist understanding of language might help understand why some women object. But happy not to be derailed ...
But op - my sense from your thread is that you offer a 'nice house in an expensive area' and hVe a well paid job... Good for you - but - is that what attracted your partner to you? There is a a sense in your post that materialism is the overriding sense of what you think you offer - that and getting everything 'right'. Might be worth refusing to tread on eggshells maybe.

And I don't understand the comment that your wife hates everything to do with relationships--- what does this mean? Can you say more?

Does she work/have separate interests/friends (in which case she "does" relationships!) What was it like when you got together? What do you think she found attractive about you? Money/material wealth/security? (Reflecting what maybe you think you had to offer)

What are you without all that facade? Other posters might be more helpful but It's what came to mind when I read your post.

I don't find it patronising at all.

The post about it just makes me roll my eyes and nutter ffs.

Why do people always have to pick at other posters.

ANYWAY....

Never mind LemonDough, what else can you lot think that may put you off your DH and his affections...

I'm assuming that the OP is clean, isn't a monkey man or has hair growing out of his ears long enough to plait or any other "quirks"..

Thinking back to my relationship with ex, he would complain about something similar..I was just shattered..too tried to even think about it, let alone actually doing it.

Have had the, 'I love you so much but I feel like we're disconnected and can't work out why and it's worrying me' conversation.

Time to have that chat where you redecorate your undying love and ask what tweets you can make to make things even better, the best that they can be.

OP you need to read the book "men are from mars and women are from Venus" I don't agree with a lot of the book but my DH made me read it and it helped us both understand the fundamental differences between how men and women communicate and how needs differ. If you have the right woman material things won't make her happy. Try initiating affection, cleaning the house, cooking, invite her for dinner and tell her she looks beautiful before she leaves the house.... Little things and persist for a while. There is a difference between one off attempts which women are aware of and cynical of

"I know if I talk to her about it will just get brushed under the carpet, especially as she hates confrontation and anything to do with relationships"

Might help to define 'rarely shows me any affection'. Do you mean sex or are you talking about more basic stuff like cuddles or hand-holding? Are you openly hostile to each other?

I'm sorry this is happening to you and it must have taken guts to ask for help.

(It's a shame your posting style has been criticized and that you've been inundated with loads of suggestions about what you might be doing wrong - that's one of the perils of being a male on mumsnet I'm afraid.)

You say she has no connection to you - how long has this been going on for? I assume things were once fine and happy between you, so what's changed?

Since your wife is unhappy about communicating face to face, would you be able to write/email her with what you've said here and then go on from there?

If she really won't communicate what's going on with her, I can see only two options really: you put up with it or you make plans to leave.

lemondough you really need to get a grip..

OP make sure you're pulling your weight and being loving and appreciative but don't be a pushover either. Have your own life too..

One more thing from me before I go..

Don't assume she doesn't love you. You don't know that for certain but you are feeling (I would imagine) a little rejected. Just because she isn't reacting in the way she used to or in the way you wanted doesn't mean that she doesn't love you.

After kids, as wonderful as they may be, I (not sure about others) pretty much lost myself. I was a mother and a wife and that was it. THAT grinds you down after a while and you loose the spark for everything. Try to encourage her to do something for herself and only herself, not for the house or you or the kids. Has she given up something she used to do since having the kids? Something that she misses?

Lemondough makes a good point. In a forum setting we only have one way of judging a post and that's the language used. English is a very nuanced language and the choice of words plus the style and tone adopted can provide quite a revealing subtext. So using the term 'ladies' and following up with a 'females forum'.... really does suggest someone who regards women as 'other. We could also deduce something from the attributes of his marriage as he sees them.... ie. nice/expensive house, three children and a wife he fancies. In a nutshell the OP is telling us that he's a reasonably high earner, fertile and that his wife isn't ugly. Someone else might sum up their marriage in a different way that would reveal something else about them.

So yes, Lemondough makes a good point and it's not 'vipers' leaping on men unfairly. It's called reading the subtext.

I disagree.

I think its really tough to post on here for advice, especially for men who don't know the forum well. I know even in my first few posts, I got the tone wrong. I've seen plenty of women do it too - "Hello Mummies/hello mums" that kind of thing. Ad I don't think it's cool to pick them up on it in relationship section.

I also think the way he described his relationship was sweet: The background is, no real money worries, no real parenting problems. He is telling us that these aren't issues - and he realises they are for many people.

Just wondering if you are hoping for connection with DW through sex and she needs to have a connection first in other ways, through more communication and shared interests, humour, respect, any of those things ....

I think that can be quite a common male/female dynamic which might be worth exploring?

Firstly, thank you to the amazing response. Never expected such a quick and frank set of replies! Secondly, to those who find the term/salutation "ladies" offensive, then I apologise - no intention of upsetting people ever intended.
I will come back to this later - have to get to the office! Thanks again for your thoughts /comments.

lol housework mentioned in post 1 - got to be a record even for mn.

OP this IS mn - as a man you will always always be in the wrong no matter what you do, bad place to ask for advice if you are a man!

No sex - you've not done enough housework
bought her flowers - your a condescending sexist b'stard
use the term 'ladies' - it's the verbal equivalent of a patronising pat on the bum.
Try to talk to her - it's her right to remain silent
Try to cuddle her - it's her right to reject a cuddle
Try to be intimate - god forbid man you are a sex pest!
Do all the housework, cooking, childcare - you are a wet new man
Go out with your friends - you don't put family first
don't go out with your friends - you rely on her too much socially

get my drift?

As for your wife, sit her down and make her face the fact that something is off balance with your relationship and she needs to listen and take it seriously/act on it if you are to have a future.
The house, the kids, the lifestyle - you need to be higher on her list of priorities than you currently are.

"as a man you will always always be in the wrong no matter what you do"

Utter rubbish

I wonder why some posters use someone else's thread to criticise other MN posters

It seems a shitty thing to do, not least because this bloke is looking for advice and all he gets from some quarters is "MN is shit 'cos of X Y Z"

AF while I get your sentiment, this man (he might not like the word bloke ) comes on here for advice and the second reply he gets has a go at him for daring to use the word ladies

I wasn't talking about early responses, NotNew

i do think it's very interesting how you describe your marriage/life.

if i described my marriage/life, i would say things like, we get on well, are a team, laugh together, love to lounge around together, have a lovely DS.

however you focus on material things first. then mention your children, and that your wife is attractive to you.

your wife, it seems to me on first glance, is a mystery to you.

was there ever a time you felt you knew her well?

what is her greatest passion?
what is her favourite place to go, and why?
if you and the children were not in her life, what would she be doing?

i get the distinct impression that you don't know this woman at all, and probably never have. that may be because she wanted a husband from whom she could remain distant, because she has deep-seated emotional problems. OR, it could be that YOU wanted someone distant, because you didn't want to put in any emotional work, and would rather just be taken care of by a wife. Or a combination of those.

have you ever had counselling, individual counselling i mean? if not, why?