Will my husband ever want to have children?

[Shloka]

Hi,
I'm from India; I had an arranged marriage. I was 26, husband was 30. Now I'm 27+, husband is 31+.I knew that husband lived & worked in Singapore, but I didn't know he was so obsessed about staying on there.

Having children was really important to me, I had assumed that its important to my husband too as he comes from a very traditional & well off family & all his cousins have big kids already-he too seemed very traditional.He'd also mentioned a boy's name & a girl's name he'd thought of. After marriage he told me that he intends to go off to the USA for two years (one & a half years after our marriage) to do an MBA. He also wants me to stay on in Singapore with a job so he can come back & job hunt after his MBA on my Dependent Pass. He hadn't told me any of this before marriage, rather his family had told us that they'd cancelled the marriage alliance of a software engineer girl who wanted to go abroad for just one year for her job as (according to them) the purpose of marriage was to live together, now we learnt that my husband had always planned to do an MBA he was only waiting to become a Permanent Resident (he had applied twice before, this is another thing we hadn't known & been rejected twice before, this was his third application).His PR application was rejected the third time & now he's decided he wants me to be a placeholder for him in Singapore, while he goes off to the USA to study. People do take their spouses and even children along while they go somewhere to do their MBA, I'd read for instance, that over half of IMD Lausanne's class brought their partners along,and quite a few had children or were going to have children while studying, but husband and mother in law say its not possible to accompany him while he does his MBA. (although his family is quite wealthy, they can easily afford this, my husband claims that he doesn't take money from his family, but his dad paid the down payment for his condo in Singapore, that is a lot of money, twice as much as his MBA cost)

I know if I don't want to do this; if I decide to relocate to my hometown because I'm missing my family or I hate my job & want to quit or even if I lose my job, he & his mom will blame me, they'll say he'd definitely have found some job if not for me.

Regarding a child, he says that he actually doesn't want a child at all, because the sufferings he's gone through, he doesn't want his child to go through, & this is something about which he's had long discussions with his parents, because they obviously want a grandchild. He says he'd even asked them to find him a girl who doesn't want kids, but he might eventually have kids due to social pressure later because (in his words) I want & his parents want. His dad also desperately wants him to relocate to our hometown & takeover the family business, but he adamantly refuses to do this & when I was annoyed with this being a placeholder in Singapore while he does his MBA in USA thing, he'd sms'ed his dad that this was all a "conspiracy" to get him back to our hometown & he'll not stay with me anymore so I don't know if social pressure of his family means anything to him.

His mother had an ectopic pregnancy at 30 which damaged one of her tubes & a hysterectomy at 34, she supports her son in whatever he wants to do, she says that nowadays one can have kids even at 40, she also asked me to "inspire" her son to do this MBA from USA & insisted I remain behind in Singapore with a job while he does this MBA.

People at his salary level do have kid/s in Singapore but he says he just can't afford a child & if he does do his MBA, he's going to be 33 when he starts his MBA & 35 when he completes his MBA, he also says he won't do consulting as there's "no life" but he wants some other job with a better work life balance, his friends are top i bankers & consultants who make 2.5x what he makes, in two years they'd have moved even further up in his i banking & consulting careers & he might just not land up the high paying, good work life balance job he's seeking & then his "sufferings" from life will only increase.

Do you think my husband will ever want kids?

I'm sorry but I can't offer much advice as this is very much a cultural issue, but I didn't want to read and run.

If i was you i would be angry that I'd been tricked into a relationship that wasn't right for me and angry that he wants to leave me for so long while he goes off and won't even leave me with kids.

Outside of your culture you would be encouraged to leave and find someone who wouldn't lie to you and who wouldn't be so selfish. Especially as if this is an arranged marriage it is probably not out of love. but I don't know if that is an option to you.

I don't know if he will agree to children but it sounds like only on his terms which I wouldn't put up with. If you were to wait til 40 then your chances of conceiving aren't high and may never happen, every year past 30 reduces your chances, particularly after 35. I also don't know if your culture would allow ivf? If not then you don't want to be waiting past 35 at all.

Many women do conceive naturally after 35! The average birth age in parts of London is 37. However, I don't think this is the real issue. How do we know in your 30s another thing will crop up?

I do think he/his family misrepresented his intentions at the point of marriage.
He sounds afraid of fatherhood - as you say, he seems torn between breaking from his parents and then obeying them. Although he resents their interference, as you mention with the condo, he'll run back when needed.

This is a difficult situation: it is one HE needs to resolve. Would he be open to counselling (possibly not, the Indian/Asian side of my family won't consider such things).

Sorry, no solutions only sympathy. And that they were not open when making the arrangements for the marriage (but then again, you can see why they didn't. Bit of a messed up situation there). :(

PS. Sometimes, from my parents experience, you have to ride the wrath of the mother in law to do what YOU think is right. My mum did and it was tough... But for the best.
TBH overprotective matriarch will always find something to say. If you need to go against her suggestions, do so.

I didn't mean that they don't- my mum had my brother at 38 completely naturally- but I wouldn't leave it that late unless I had a good reason to or hadn't found a suitable partner as I wouldn't want to risk being one of those who can't.

@Alita: Yes my culture would allow IVF but I don't see why I should wait for so many years, having married at 26, as there is really no big reason for waiting. And what is the guarantee he'll agree to an IVF? If he didn't agree after some years, I would need to find another man to remarry and have kids with, and that would be difficult post 35 (maybe even post 30).

I don't think he'd be open to counselling and even if he was my MIL will brainwash him.

His dad has a cousin, a very beautiful lady who married at 29 and her husband was obsessed about settling down in USA but didn't earn enough, they had a long distance marriage for 8 years and when he finally earned enough that his wife could join him and got his Green Card, she moved to USA. She's 40 now and no kids, she'll probably never have any now. My husband really praises this lady and her husband, as if their life is anything worth emulating.

Once I was reading an internet article on Mumpreneurs he asked me why I was reading that stuff as I'm never going to be a mom, because he doesn't want kids.

When I ask him why he didn't tell me before marriage that he planned to do this MBA, he tells me that I should have specifically asked him whether he wanted to do an MBA. People in India generally do their MBA in their early twenties, right after graduation, all his "friends" have done their MBA's in their early or mid twenties, I don't know a single Indian guy in an arranged marriage who took his wife to another country, made her a placeholder there and went off to another country to do his MBA. He also tells me that I should have told him before marriage that having kids was so important to me, well people do have kids within a few years of marriage in India, and there are very few people who don't want kids, they are honest about this before they get married.

One of his cousin's wives had Polycystic Ovaries, she'd married at twenty two and her husband was twenty five, just two years after their marriage, her MIL was frantic about why they didn't have kids yet, they found out she had PCOS and it took her two and a half more years till she had her child.My MIL knows all this, yet she mentioned this lady's story to my mom as an example of how people nowadays have children "many" years after marriage-although this lady certainly did not delay children by choice.

I think you have your answer, if you are going to choose to leave and remarry then you need to make that choice now before it becomes more difficult to find you a husband.
I don't think you will ever be happy with such a selfish person!

I agree with Alita.

I think it's disgraceful that he misled you like that, when discussing a marriage (whether a love match or arranged) "do I want to have kids?" and "am I planning an imminent lifestyle change e.g. returning to university?" are MASSIVELY important to clear up before the wedding!

just to note that my sister's husband did an MBA at Insead (sp?) in Fontainebleu, France with a small toddler in tow, and wife. Yes it was tiring to have a wife and child in tow, but there was never a question of going off without them or for that matter of not having children. My sister married at 26 and had kids at 29, MBA when my BIL was 30. He is now a very high ranking and extremely ambitious civil servant at 46 with 3 sons. However, there is no way my sister would ever have put up with him telling her she had to wait for their children. In fact many of her female friends who did wait, or married late have had no children. Looking back they were one of the first to "jump", and felt a bit young and foolish but it was worth it, not just for the health of their children but the fact that as younger parents they had the energy to cope.

In the end, money and success are to help build a FAMILY, and your husband is distorting everything, and being completely selfish. To claim that you are being unreasonable and selfish and not sensible is a travesty. It is a leap in the dark to have children, yes the planet is overpopulated, yes it is financial suicide, but people still do it, because it is the most natural impulse we have and that's what we work for. In fact that's why men are driven to be ambitious and successful because nature gave them the means to protect and support their young and successfully attract a mate with whom to reproduce!!! So there.

Agree - you have been misled :( Horribly so.
What do you want to do now, OP? I know that is a really simplistic question, but what's the first answer that comes to mind?

PS. another tack might be instead of confronting him and arguing with him, but to try and listen to some of the more deep seated fears he is exhibiting.
a)that he won't make a good Dad. Why not?Why cannot he protect his child from the "sufferings" he went through. Maybe together any child you have will be supported and loved enough for these sufferings to be avoided. You could reassure him that he is GOOD ENOUGH to protect any child.
b)try to avoid the deferral aspect, we will have kids when we have done x and y and z, waiting a bit longer wont matter. I had a lawyer friend who did this and her marriage ended in divorce at 36, no kids, and she has now adopted at 48 as a single mum. Looking back it was a massive red flag in their relationship that they thought it was important to prove themselves careerwise and be apart in pursuit of their careers. At the time she convinced herself it was perfectly sensible. IF HE WANTS THEM AT ALL, NOW IS AS GOOD A TIME AS ANY.
c) financial. Financially there is never any certainty with children.Anything could happen at any point in your life to make you less solvent. Children do not need as much as you think, and they give back far more than they cost.
d) your relationship. It needs to be based on recognition of each others most heartfelt desires and needs.I think if you support him by acknowledging some of his fears he might feel more like he wants to commit himself to sharing a family with you. If that doesn't happen, you have to leave.

maybe deep down he wants you to leave and save him the trouble, as he will cast you in the role of the one who is unreasonable. I wonder whether he just does not want to be married at all, and is trying run away by doing the MBA, pretending to do the "right thing". I think you have to say to him at some point, our marriage is more important to me than your financial success and being with you is more important too, whether or not we have children. Tackle the physical separation part, before you tackle the children issue(although it all adds in to not wanting to be connected to you)

Please don't be bullied. Please believe in yourself.

Actually it sounds like he is already inadvertently sharing with you something he has not shared with his parents (the sufferings I mean). It is this a cry to you to rescue him from them, and to assert yourself over them? There are two contradictions already, he comes from a well off family and yet says he cannot afford children atm, and that you say his bossy parents do want grandchildren. It sounds like maybe he feels everyone is making decisions for him, all he can do is defy everyone and run away.

You can be sympathetic but in the end you have to be the one who changes things if he doesn't.

He has told you that he doesn't want children, so I would believe what he was saying. You then have to decide if you want to wait to see if he changes his mind or leave now.

I'd be inclined to take the bull by its horns and either leave or tell him and his family that you want children by a certain time - eg a year, or you will leave.

Don't put your future in someone else's hands.

He doesn't just not want kids, he's dishonest and doesn't care about your wishes and feelings. If family pressure wasn't going to help you achieve a change, I'd consider whether leaving him might be an option.

Hello,

Thanks all for your input and advice to the OP. We've moved this thread to Relationships now as we felt it better suited that topic.

I think you should cut your losses and divorce the knob.

Where do YOU want to live OP?

I don't know how much influence or interference there will be in your marriage or what is considered normal.

Have you mentioned to his folks or got your parents to, how they have all misled you? And your family? Don't rely on what he says. You could tell them you are very upset at being separated as you had no idea, you want children and your dh doesn't. And what do they plan to do about it?

Isn't all this discussed before an arranged marriage? I'm sorry I don't know anything about it. And as for trying to tell you you must ask specific questions! That's silly and he knows it.

Where do you want to live, do you love your dh and want to be married to him and what is the fall out and your future if you bail?

Presumably your parents were involved in the arranging, what do they say about all this? I would hope that they are fuming that you have been misled in such a way.

I have to agree that if you wait around for "might" you will be throwing away the best years of your life. This man lied to you, wants to use you as a bookmark in his old life, refuses to talk to you and refuses to acknowledge your feelings.

I cant think of one single reason why you shouldnt, as erhic so eloquently put it, divorce the knob.

You've been misled, he and his family lied to you and your family to secure a union that would benefit them. He got married for his own convenience; to keep family happy, to conform to a cultural norm, to secure residency etc. I would be very wary of having a child with a selfish deceitful man, especially when he explicitly says he doesn't want children.

For an arranged marriage there seems to be a lot of assuming, its not a good idea to asume things even when you know the other person but totally crazy when you don't know them. Were there never any discussions about children, living arrangements?

He has finally made it very clear what he wants and you are clear on what you want, since you have so much outside input in your marriage I would get everyone round a large table and have a discussion that should have taken place before the marriage. Or alternatively, you could just leave because apart from cultural and social pressure what binds the two of you?

What do your parents say about the fact he has been thoroughly dishonest. Surely in an arranged marriage where the man has told his parents he doesn't want kids they should have advised your parents of that fact. did you ask about kids prior to marrying him? What was his pre marriage response? It seems he is blaming you re the MBA, which is ludicrous. Surely you are not expected to ask every conceivable question of him! Are you expecting to do a phd in Australia? China? Do you want to work in London? Surely in an arranged marriage you tell the other party your aspirations etc to see if you are suitable. Forgive me I only know a few people who have had arranged marriages. (one of whom divorced her husband and had him deported).

If you wanted to leave what impact would that have on your relationship with your family? Could you return to family, so he loses his place in singapore.

Are you happy? Can you live with not having children? What would happen if you left him due to him deceiving you?

What are these sufferings that he is claiming? In your later paragraph you say that his sufferings will increase if he hasnt made the same career progress as his friends.

I will be honest and say that it sounds like he wants the world on a plate. He wants you to give him residency in Singapore. He got his parents to put a down payment on a condo. He wants to do an MBA without the bother of having a wife and children. He wants to get the great career but he doesnt want to put the work in for it.

He is bone idle. He has been deceitful. He is a perpetual 'victim'. Nothing will ever be his fault. Everything will be because of mummy and daddy/life/his wife.

Is this someone you really want to have children with?

Regarding my family: They are very annoyed about the whole thing and this man and his family's lies. They will support me if I want a divorce.

Regarding husband's "sufferings" : Husband was a school topper, but gradually became average academically. His best buddy from school works for Mc Kinsey in Singapore, he's a Senior Manager on the way to become a partner. Husband and this buddy were equals in school, but husband's career didn't go according to plan. Husband's family has a lot more wealth than this friend's parents, husband is also far less hardworking than this friend who really slogs but he refuses to look at the positives his life has.

Regarding discussions having children: I had asked him before marriage, actually he'd mentioned a boy's name and a girl's name he'd thought of for his future children even without me asking him.I'd told him that I would like children soon and we'd agreed on two or three years after marriage.

Now he claims that he has no such plans now, like (in his words) none of his friends have although his friends are having children right, left and center now in Singapore.

Regarding an Arranged Marriage: Yes every possible question is not asked before marriage, but the other side is supposed to volunteer information on their own regarding important life plans and goals. The topic of MBA had come up a few times in our conversations before marriage, but he still hadn't mentioned his own plans.

Am I happy? No not in this situation. Where do I want to live? I like Singapore but see no reason to stay on as a placeholder there without a husband, in that situation I'd prefer moving back to India. Can I imagine a life without children? No, absolutely not. Especially as this is not due to some fertility problems the man I'm with is having( I would like to adopt in that scenario) but due to someone's deliberate choice which I should have been informed about.

You don't sound as if you like your husband much at all.

Is there anything you like about him? Is there anything you value in his personality, anything that makes a relationship with him worth sustaining?

If you were to wait to have children, but insist on accompanying him for his MBA because you wanted to be with him/be near him, because you are his wife and needed his companionship, is there any solution to that re: the condo/Singapore situation. Could you find a compromise there, and see whether you are better suited by spending more time with him. Maybe that is what he needs; to face up the reality of your life together, which could include you being with him whilst he does his MBA.

As your family will support you in divorce I would have that conversation between the families. Either he rethinks his marriage or get out sooner rather than later.

OP what are the positives in your relationship?