Stonewalling

[jamiemars]

I posted a thread about this yesterday, but it was long and boring.
I really need help with this. My husband and I have a fighting pattern that goes with this:

1. He neglects or criticizes me in a passive aggressive sort of way. Or he withholds affection for awhile.
2. I pursue him and ask him what it's about.
3. He might express his displeasure with me, and then clam up. I prod him for more.
4. He starts to not answer me, or pretend to drift off to sleep. Or put a pillow over his head. He sits like a stone wall, not responding.
5. I get so aggravated he is not willing to resolve the conflict that I start yelling. I yell at him repeatedly.
6. He cuts off all communication. This last round was the worst of our marriage. He hasn't called for two days (he works away from home on the weekdays).
7. He claims he loves me and wants to stay married, and is pissed off I keep bringing up that he wants to leave. But I just don't get why he would stay with someone he is so miserable with and not want to sleep with or be affectionate toward. My weight gain in the past few years is a real thorn in his side.
8. He is coming home tonight (supposedly - haven't heard from him). I am sick of being the one to approach him or try to reconcile things. I fear the weekend will come and go and our problems will just continue to fester. He is a very passive individual.

What should I do?

If he texts about the skating lesson don't reply If he asks why you didn't answer say..." Oh sorry, didn't have my phone on " ... say it in a calm, casual sort of voice. If he makes a nasty comment about this ... walk away, make no eye contact ... Even leave the room to do something else. If he turns up at skating just say hello then move away and talk to the other parents or just go to the loo... don't hurry back ! Distancing yourself from his unpleasantness ( even if you are crying inside) will give some of the power in the relationship back to you. This might sound a harsh and terrible thing to say but if you care less it hurts less.... learned from bitter experience !

Thank you, bearhug. Your analysis is curate. My husband even said he has no conflict, and I the only one with conflict. So essentially he is shirking all responsibility. He said if I want change in the relationship then be aggressive. This is coming from mouth of an extremely passive person.

Good points. I was independent before I met him and I do make more money than him, though not having his income would be a major blow. I would have to move or pay him for half the house. I guess it would be the loneliness. My parents I am not close to (mother is quite the narcissist) and I don't have any very close friends. I would feel foundationless ...alone in the world again. When I met him I lived in an apartment by myself (early twenties) and I was pretty lonely. I hated coming home to an empty house. I kept busy working seven days a week.

I would also just miss my husband. I would not want him to be with anyone else. It would pain me greatly. As much as I complain about him he does have good qualities. I would miss being part of his life.
Now I have a lump in my throat.
I don't know how people can get divorced and then be cordial to their ex's new woman. If my husband ever cheated on me or left me for another woman I would detest that woman so much I might run her over. Or him over. Is be like that Broderick woman.

Seriously,'I am not capable of inflicting physical harm. But I would certainly be completely enraged.
Thanks for continuing to write toe!!

Would you be lonely with children? Would you have free time (whilst kids with home) to pursue a hobby and meet new people? Do you have free time now? Could you get involved in a hobby, or community project, or even be a volunteer. Find out what you want from life, what you enjoy?

Life can be lonely when you share it with the wrong person.

Sorry I meant whilst kids are with him.

This is coming from mouth of an extremely passive person.

Sounds more like passive-aggressive to me, which is much more manipulative than passiveness. Relationships are the responsibility of both people involved, whether he likes it or not. He is choosing to respond by stonewalling you - but it is a choice, and he is responsible for that choice, and the things that happen as a result of it. You are responsible for the choices you make, not his. He could choose to start talking to you like an adult. You could choose to stop trying to make everything better when that isn't within your power.

Would you really miss the man who deals with things by just not engaging and talking to you at all? Or would you be missing the man you want him to be, but he isn't? If the latter is the case, then you've not got much to lose there.

You know you can earn money, because you're already doing that. You can counter loneliness by getting involved in things outside of the house - join an exercise class, or doing an evening class to learn something new and meet people.

Find out about your legal rights, and what would happen if you did divorce. This doesn't mean you have to do it, but it does mean you'll be fully informed in your decisions. You would also have the choice of telling him you've been finding out that information - it might cause him to realise you are not prepared to put up with his behaviour any more. (It could also cause him to say, "okay, that's it then.")

And there's no point worrying about how you would react to him having another woman - you've no idea how you would actually feel if it got to that point after you've left him - you could have moved on and be settled in a new relationship yourself by that time. In any case, you haven't left him so far, and there are plenty of other more immediate things you should be considering, rather than something that may never happen.

All true points. It is best to focus on the next hour ahead rather than the next year.
You're right I should positions self better do there is less fear whatever happens.
Do you think that many men divorce their wives because married a thin attractive woman and the wan has become overweight and dragged down look wise by stress and overworking and not taking care of herself anots? How important are looks and weight?
Thx

All true points. It is best to focus on the next hour ahead rather than the next year.
You're right I should position myself better do there is less fear whatever happens.
Do you think that many men divorce their wives because married a thin attractive woman and the woman has become overweight and dragged down look wise by stress and overworking and not taking care of herself anymore? How important are looks and weight?
Thx

I question the sense in wasting time trying to second guess the motivations of this abusive man. However would you divorce your partner because he put on weight and put the needs of his children before his looks? Do you know many people who would? I don't.

Are looks and weight important to you?

They are exactly at important as YOU want them to be.

I am within normal BMI, and do enjoy regular exercise if I have timebut have a face like the back of a bus. And don't give a shit about my appearance. I will dress up business smart under sufferance for an important meeting or interview but generally slob around in trakky bottoms, uggs and one of DH jumpers if I'm not at work.

Dh has a whinge every so often that I don't make an effort, to which I reply neither does he and if he wants to he is free to fuck off and find someone higher maintenance than me. If they will have him. That usually shuts him up for 6 months or so.

viv has a valid point! would you divorce someone who was too busy with kids and two jobs to keep a stepford perfect appearance and house? What would you think of someone who did that.

The advice given above is sound I think... Work on detaching yourself From needing him so much and I reckon things will fall into place for you.

Docdaneek, omg you are so funny. Thanks for the laugh. I need to haul myself up by my bootstraps or bra straps and not give a crap what anyone else thinks. Instead of cowering around like an idiot worrying about what this person or that person or what my husband thinks of me, well they can all kiss my ass. I interviewed for a job at my current place of employment this week. I was just in the elevator with the vp of our department who interviewed me and a guy I had walked down the hall with was laughing at something i said previously and he repeated it in front of he vp, something about my being on the iPhone all day. I could have died but I just laughed it off. God my life is truly in the shithole.

I think my husband could easily find someone else much better looking and younger than me. I used to be very attractive and thin but that was years ago and I've since morphed into an overweight harried woman that wears black pants and a cardigan every day. Slimming.
I don't know where to begin to fix my life, but I suppose I should just be grateful I am not in jail or have cancer. Tomorrow I plan to stay out of the house all day with my daughter. So if my husband does come home he can sit there on the couch and do laundry.
I doubt he will give a rats ass where I am. Though he might want to see his daughter.
It's funny, 14 years ago when he met this girl in one of his classes who he thought was pretty cute and adopted as a friend, I was at a very low weight, thin and fit. Did that stop him from having an emotional Affair? No. So screw him.
Thanks again for your note!!

Do you think that many men divorce their wives because married a thin attractive woman and the woman has become overweight

There are probably a few who do, but if that's why they want a divorce, I can't imagine they'd have been much cop as a husband, not supportive or caring or anything, and they wouldn't be much loss.

Bearhug,
That is a good point. Thank you. My husband says he has tried to accept me and has tried to rationalize being with me happily. But he just can't accept the way I am. He says I am not being a good role model for our kids if I am overweight. And I am not a good spouse. He works out regularly and is very health conscious. I have too much on mum plate to have energy for self upkeep and he says that is an excuse. He says if I don't pay attention to my health I will be a hindrance to everyone eventually.

I know I have been depressed and overworked
For years and it is tough to climb out of that.
I am a hard working person though that gets zero credit for it from him.
I fear he finds me hideous. I know he does. He hasn't initiates sex
In forever. It
Is a rare event. He is 37. He blames low
Libido. Yeah right.
It is strange to have been on two sides of the coin - I've experienced life as a very attractive woman and as a hideous lump. I am not exaggerating the contrast either.
The two experiences have stark contrasts and are quite scary.

I think that there's a confusion of two issues here. One, a healthy desire on your part to look more like the person you feel you are inside. Two, a knowledge that your husband doesn't find you attractive and is putting pressure on you to change.

Do you think there's a chance there could be another woman on the scene?

I have too much on mum plate to have energy for self upkeep and he says that is an excuse.

Does he support you at all? Does he take over some of what is on the mum plate to give you a break, so you have the energy to go to an exercise class or swimming or whatever? I know what I'd say to him if not. (Although even if he does, you might want to take a break by just reading a book or something.)

Vi, I don't think there is another woman unless he found her in the last two days. I know he looks at internet porn. I know he is adamant he made his marriage vows and is sticking to them. He says that when I accuse him of maybe wanting to be with other women. Maybe my own insecurity about this will drive him to actually do it. Gross.

Please stand up to him. He can't bully you if you don't let him. If you show self respect, he will respect you far more.

Make a list of all that you do each week.
Make a separate list of all the jobs you do at weekends.
Say that you too would like time off at weekends.
Divide the weekend jobs 50/50.
Point out, calmly, that while he works away during the week, you are doing 100% childcare etc while holding down two jobs, as a single parent and that is why you have let standards slip. Point out how easy it is to criticise what isn't done from the vantage point of living a single person's life during the week, and to vastly underestimate what does get done and the time it takes to do. Always easier to criticise than to act.
Then book yourself something you'd like to do - he can take DC skating while you go and do something for yourself.

You do sound worried about your weight gain. Do you want to do something about it, or do you only think you should for his sake? If you do for your own sake, then do. But it takes time. he'll have to be home while you go off to exercise classes. And if he ever belittles you again for doing something he wants you to do - such as deep cleaning room, challenge him on it. Don't be bullied.

I haven't read this all. I stopped when I read Cogito's post:

"Emotional abuse, psychological bullying, whatever you want to call it the classic 'method' of exerting control is

a) bring the subject down by nit-picking, criticising, setting impossible (and changing) targets, isolation (quit your job), name-calling, withdrawing affection, ridiculing ambition, sulking, alienating friends and family, monopolising time etc etc

b) Exploit the subject's insecurity, low self-esteem and lack of confidence making them eager to please, frightened to go it alone and therefore trapped

c) Augment with veiled threats... 'he took vows'... 'he made a decision'. Might also include ideas like 'it's my house/money', custody of the children.

He is loyal to someone he despises because he's put a lot of work into deliberately bringing you this low.... It's where he wants you He's a bully."

Because this was me and my NOW ex. I found that I got no credit for anything I did (from him OR his family) and this pattern has continued into the divorce, through the court hearings and is now there when he badmouths my parenting to everyone, attempt at residency of DC being the next step. I had a highly paid job in the City; I don't any more.

You will NEVER change this pattern. So, time to work out what you want next. You will have to fight for the change, so be very sure.

Tiredandsad, thank you for the warning ... It kind of frightens me. So sorry you had to go thru that!!

Cottonwool and bearhug. Thank you for helping me through this. Even though my problems don't sound as bad as a lot of people's, the pain seems awful.

I just remembered it is Easter this Sunday. We have breakfast reservations and have to go to his fathers this Sunday night.

Should be a FUN weekend. I wonder how that will all pan out. I guess he doesn't care about smoothing things over before the weekend.
Some days life is just so unpleasant. Thank god I found this site yesterday from a tip
From a friend. It is a lifesaver.

Wow, this brought me to tears, because you are describing a similar life to my own. The advice is so good but it doesn't make it any easier to consider the reality and implications of our situation. My partner of ten years stone walls me. We even sought counselling, but I have seen no change in him. His is a great Dad most of the time and I know my son, who is 7, would particularly be distraught if we were to split. I think my 9year old daughter would understand. The thought of wrenching my family apart appalls me, but I know that our relationship is so wrong and I don't want our children to think that this is the standard as far as loving relationships are concerned. I know they know something is wrong, as my son has already said that he doesn't want Us to split up, but then what child would want that? All I know is that children will adapt and that providing children with a happy home to live in must surely be a worthy aim?

Millie, sorry you are in a similar situation. It truly sucks. Sounds like you really want a divorce but are worried about the kids. Interesting that stonewalling is what is causing most of the grief ... Is that right?
Stonewalling his immature and selfish. My husband says that once an argument gets past a certain point there's no sense in him continuing because I just repeat myself and we get nothing accomplished.
Trying to get any affection out of my husband is like trying to suck water out of a rock. Sometimes he will hold my hand or snuggle up but only if he is in a good mood. Mostly he is stern and humorless. He gets in these strange moods where he is really uptight. He looks mean and mad. I am truly sick
Of him r

One last question ... So what should I do when and if he CEOs home tonight? Silent treatment? Mild disdain? Pursue a conversation? He most
Likely will not initiate any conversation with me unless it is a businesslike question. N should I just let this fester and for how long.

Typing on this tiny iphone keyboard is truly challenging!! Sorry for the typos!!

Generally speaking, be normal. Ignore any sulking, play-acting or attempts to goad you into a reaction. It's not letting things fester exactly, it's breaking the bullying behaviour pattern and achieving a little detachment. Take a mental step back, if you like, and observe rather than engage.