life is easier without DH's input...

[Nottonightdarling]

NC sorry (though to a previous NC NN, god knows what I used it for before but can prob take a lucky guess!)

DH have been together 9yrs, married 7, 2DC aged 5&2. Generally we rub along fine, we were actually going through a fairly easy and nice phase. We don't have sex as much as he'd like (I'd be happy to be celibate frankly) but have a compromise and it's about twice a week.

DH has been sick the last week, just a flu but it has laid him pretty low. I normally don't have much patience for man flu but actually this time he looked rough as anything so I've done all I can to allow him to just rest. He's camped out in the spare room to prevent either of us having disturbed nights from each other, but because of young DC I'm more or less leaving him to it. I'm making him smoothies and offering food, making it when he wants some, bring him his drugs etc but I'm focussing on doing everything else, keeping on top of house and home. I'm a SAHM so it's nothing new but initially did make me realise he does pick up a fair amount of slack - but now of course I am literally doing everything bar maybe the odd bedtime story.

The last few days it's dawned on me that my life has somehow become easier....the house has stayed relatively clean and tidy, all admin is being done on time, kids are fed and happy - they and I are actually getting on really well (youngest doesn't sleep well so my sleep deprivation does turn me into an intolerant snappy mum a lot). It's awful but it's been a lot easier without DH around (in his disgusting room which is floor to ceiling in snotty tissues and empty packets of food - it smells like something died in there). DH periodically shows his face to rub up against me and make it clear he's too sick for anything else but wants a rogering. And it just pisses me off.

I don't actually mind managing on my own - in fact it's dawned on me that it's all easier because I'm not relying on someone else, at all.

I'm not going to LTB, there's no point in breaking up a half decent marriage and upsetting DC over this, but I think I probably do need to say something, once he's well, don't I? At the moment I just don't see what value he's adding aside from the financial side. Jesus I feel like a bitch (should say I currently can't work, would bloody love to be working) because he does work etc etc but frankly I'm surprised at just how much easier this is without his input on any level.

bugger. How do you even start having this conversation - he's a defensive old bastard when he wants to be, I can't think of a way of not making it sound deeply personal.

In any case, I don't think the point is really a matter of sexual incompatibility. Rather it seems to be that his husband disgusts her and she finds herself relieved when he's out of the way.

The decent thing to do is divorce, in my view. For all parties involved (including the children).

I think you have been given an insight OP. Not into what life would be like without him (he's still there), but into what he does and doesn't do that bothers you.

Think about it and talk to him to make your relationship and the family better. Tell him he is messy and it makes your life harder. Explain it to him and ask him to curtail his mess.

HER husband, even

Oh please Distance if he's ill enough to take to his sick bed and opt out of family duties then he's too sick to partake mutual masturbation or shagging. If he is well enough to do either of those then he get his arse out if bed and pull his weight. He can have a wank first of course.

Of course jobs are easier when you're doing them all on your own! (said the introvert). Doesn't mean you love the person any less. Do you love them? I get the impression you haven't thought this through very much at all. Marriage is supposed to imply a successful partnership, certainly, but there are many different kinds of partnering styles and lots of different things to potentially partner about. In your case, in my own parents' experience and to an extent my own marriage, you don't enjoy doing the fire fighting, day to day, family madness as a double act. Fine. Plenty of successfully business men in the world with a wife at home loving the peace! Cool.

If things go no deeper than this, there isn't a problem and I would suggest you don't discuss it more than to tactfully say, 'I noticed the dishwasher worked better when I stacked everything this way and the kids were easier to get to bed without the hour of tickling and rough play beforehand. I wonder if we should save that for the weekend and would you see what you think about what I tried with the dishwasher?'. Perhaps also 'I was really surprised by how well I managed when you were laid low for those days and you know, I think I could quite happily manage if you were to take some time for yourself and wanted a bit more freedom to do (something he's always wanted to do).'

If you feel unattracted to your partner and you think it's him, not you, and you're struggling to see where the successful partnering is actually going on within your marriage, then yes, think deeper. But do so with two questions in mind: (a) Do I love him? (That will remind you of what's important and highlight issues that may still have significance but which will not be of vital importance. May also prevent you from inadvertently hurting your DP very deeply, as this is one of the questions he'll be wondering.) (b) What are the ways in which I really appreciate the contribution that DP makes to this life together/family/marriage/emotional life/parenting. If you were to say, 'When you were sick, I realised that life was much easier with you out of the scene and that seems like a very significant discovery though I haven't yet decided on an appropriate response', I would understand him saying, 'so that's what I boil down to...a wage and a bit of well meant contribution to family life that you'd prefer not to assed with. Thanks.' I'd be concerned that looking at the expression in his eyes as he said those words, you would suddenly realise all the ways you do need and love him, and be desperately sorry that these things didn't weigh with you earlier.

One thing you could do OP is to test it out. Pretend to yourself that you are the only 'doer' in the house and do what needs to be done without consulting or discussing it with him. If he doesn't then at least try to get involved in the household or with the children then you might as well be on your own anyway.

It's also not right that you don't want sex with him, you certainly shouldn't be having it out of a sense of duty.

At the moment I just don't see what value he's adding aside from the financial side

there's no point in breaking up a half decent marriage

Seems to me you just don't want him anymore...but you're willing to put up with him and 'compromise' regards to sex because he's paying for the lifestyle you want....

i think you should have some self respect and walk away from this marriage because it doesn't sound like you love him or have any sympathy/compassion for him at all.

I do think the sexual side of your marriage is sad for both of you and you should do something about it if you are going to stay together.

And I'm afraid I agree with DistanceCall, I thought us adults were supposed to look after sick people, not leave them lying in their litter.

Thanks everyone for responses. I'm on the app and want to reply properly when on the laptop and have all the answers in front of me but don't want you to think I was one of those OPs who'd post and run.

Will respond more fully but for now just want to reiterate that I don't want to walk away from my marriage, I absolutely agree that a few days with DH just sick is totally different to being a single parent, and, more than that, i do love him and want this to work.

It's absolutely an issue of communication and we're both bad at it - I hate confrontation, he is defensive and can never be wrong. I often think we should go to couples counselling to just help us communicate with each other better. There's been some great advice on here regarding that so Thankyou.

And just to reassure those of you who think I'm abusing him - I'm doing all night wakings and getting up before 5am with DC each morning and getting them out the house as early as poss so he can rest without the usual clamour, I'm making sure he is fed when he's hungry, is drinking enough, have picked up his prescriptions etc I don't think it's abusive to expect him to put the snotty tissues in the bin that I put next to the bed! He's not an invalid who needs his arse wiping and is generally a lazy and messy man, he's probably enjoying the fact that for once I'm not nagging him about it and can just shut the door and ignore his mess!

Oh and yes the sex thing IS an issue. It's not that he doesn't care if I enjoy sex and he does actually take care to make it enjoyable for me, it's just that my libido still hasn't recovered since the birth of DC2 but he also doesn't really do anything that makes me want to have sex. He knows this, I've explained that it's low on my priority list and I'm knackered and there are a million and one other things that need doing. It is definately something we avoid talking about. I need to prioritise it more, he needs to help make it possible for me to do that .

Brilliant post from wouldbemedic
I'm far more productive when my DH isn't here, and vice versa.
So presumably there's more than this, that the sexual incompatibility is eroding your self-esteem, or you haven't realised that single parenting is a whole lot different to pottering along sans DH for a week - financially, physically, emotionally, even soul-deep questions of certainty and loneliness.
I'd really encourage you into counselling, either way, to clarify your feelings and even just to work on the sex issue.

X post with you - apologies that I've said much of what you said yourself. Yes, definitely to the counselling - I was always frightened of confrontation, and I know now where it came from and can choose not to be like that any more. It damages me mostly to not address things when needed. Wishing you luck, and a baby that sleeps til something with a 6 at the beginning!

Ha yes x-post! But useful all the same.

If only DC2 was a baby - sadly it's been like this for 2.5yrs and is most likely as contributing factor to my low libido, both from a sleep deprivation POV and wanting 5mins bloody peace when someone isn't pawing me

So sorry to read this. Nobody should be having sex when they don't want to. A decent partner doesn't make you have sex when you don't want to.

Anyone saying OP is being abusive towards her DH is ridiculously and laughably off base. It's a cold people! It's not even a flu because I had an actual flu for the first time ever three years ago and thought I was going to die, that's how sick I was. Sex or any variant thereof? Absolutely unthinkable.The guy has a runny nose and a cough, and OP does nut need to be doing any more for him.

OP it is about the sex. You said you'd prefer be celibate.As someone said upthread, twice a week is a hell of a compromise and I think you need to knock that on the head for a start, because not only will it not bring back your mojo, it's likely to ultimately depress you.

My instinct is that yes, you could live just as good a life without him but I agree that you have to get those feelings out in the open. You don't have to live a life where you're forced into sex with someone you don't respect and even particularly like twice a week. You maintain that you love him but imo respect and liking are more the bread and butter of getting through the days, despite people's fascination with the whole elusive love concept.

Does he 'paw at you' when you are trying to sleep? From what you say none of this bodes well. Does he show you affection - is that partly what's putting you off?

It sounds as though a temporary measure might be for you to sleep separately for a while so you can recharge your batteries.

Just think about it. Would you want him to have sex with you twice a week, when you know he didn't really want to have sex? My guess is that you would say no.

There are things we really shouldn't compromise on. This is one of them.

Op I have had similar problems with my DH. I had zero interest in sex and resented his expectation of it. Affection only when he wanted sex. His expectations made me resentful. I told him repeatedly that I didn't like the lack of affection in every day life. It took a long time but he started being more affectionate with no expectations. As far as my libido was concerned, turned out to be low iron and borderline thyroid. If you love him possibly a trip to the GP is in order? While we were dealing with how I responded to him/he to me and then my lack of libido, he never , ever expected sex as a service. Which sounds odd as he put sex and affection in the same box. He accepted that there was a problem and we dealt with it. We didn't have sex for over 2 years. I hope what I have written is understandable, can't really think of how to express it.

""in his disgusting room which is floor to ceiling in snotty tissues and empty packets of food - it smells like something died in there"

Errr he is sick. Why aren't you at least making sure stale food is removed from the room? This is basic caring surely?

Oh balls, pressed too soon. I appreciate there are other problems and he being out of the way has meant you can run things more smoothly and to your liking. I feel like this when my DH is away. I discipline the kids the way I want, keep everything tidy the way I want etc etc. but there is so much more to our marriage than that.

I questioned the caring aspect because although he isn't at deaths door and does seem to pester you. At the most basic level, if I'm sick my DH looks after me.

She is looking after him, which you'll see if you read her posts. There is a bin in his room and if he chooses to dump his snotty tissues on the floor instead of the bin, that's his problem. She's not a slave. If he can't take care of basic hygiene, it's not her job. She does have DC after all, isn't it enough looking after the DC she has without him behaving like an extra one?

Also, clearly if he's able to rub himself against her, he's a pretty long way from being at death's door.

I agree that what stands out is are the problems around your sex life, and sexual feelings towards DH. You'd be glad to be celibate, but are DTD twice a week, as a compromise. And you mention his showing his face to rub up against you, which is clearly annoying you very much.

This kind of low grade aversion can happen when there is some background difficulty or resentment going on. Things you might not see as a real problem. And you mention that you and DC are getting along better without his input, that your DH is defensive and never wrong, that you're going through an easy phase (suggesting there are noticeably difficult phases). So something's up.

When he's well, it does seem that you need to have a talk.

I think there is a lot more resentment in this marriage than you've realised. In fact, I'd say you've got a fair amount of cognitive dissonance going on about what you feel and how you're rationalising it.

I also think that your marriage is probably relatively normal, your DH isn't abusive and this will probably be fixable if you are capable of starting an honest but respectful conversation about it and your DH is basically a decent, loving man who wants to make you happy by behaving fairly as well as have more regular sex.

I feel eternally grateful that I am no longer in any kind of relationship in which it is normal to feel like this. It may be a newsflash for some people, but even for SAHMs (who naturally do more than their DH/DPs), being in a relationship with someone who upholds the principle of fairness does actually make life easier for both people in the relationship. If one person is finding it easier without the other around, either the relationship isn't fair or there is a communication problem. Quite often it's a mix of both, but with no one actually intentionally taking advantage.

What normally happens is that things get out of sync after a baby arrives and ML means the mother is around more to do more in the house. No one questions it because it's all just taken as part of adapting to becoming parents. Mum in particular doesn't want to be seen as not coping so tries even harder to juggle everything and run a tight ship. Dad may have some qualms about this but is so knackered himself he thinks he'll do more tomorrow. But tomorrow he's knackered again and mum's already done half the stuff by the time he's back from work, and so... Before long, an unequal dynamic has been established with no one really being aware of it or how it happened and both parties have rationalised it as normal. Especially as lots of other couples do exactly the same.

Over time, mum starts feeling put upon and resentful, which leads to less interest in sex since 95% of wanting sex is psychological, not chemical. But she may also feel guilty about that, since she partly created the situation where it happened and if she's a SAHM worries about her lack of contribution to income. Instead, it's easier to push it down and ignore it.

It's hard to redress this, not least because no one likes admitting they're having an easy ride. Many DH's confronted this understandably get very defensive because they haven't actually done anything wrong or refused to help, they've just gone with the flow. It can be hard to get them to understand that they're not being accused of being unfair in the past but that now it's clearly the case that things are unbalanced, they would be unfair if they continue now their eyes have been opened. To that end, this book is really good at helping you articulate your feelings and address them in a non-confrontational way.

Good luck OP.

DH was ill for a good bit of last summer and I was on my own with a 3 year old and a 1.5 year old. I also found things easier without him - and he usually does at least half the housework and childcare!

I don't see it as an issue at all.

DH creates mess as much as the rest of us do, so obviously when he's not around there's less mess to be cleared away.

It's easier for me to manage a process like the washing when I don't find that DH has done something with it that I wasn't expecting; not that it's not constructive, it just doesn't always follow the timetable I had in my head.

When it's just me, I don't subconsciously write things off as DH's job. I know it's up to me, so I do it.

Collaborating is always going to be more complicated than doing something on your own. I really don't think you have a problem.

CrazyOldCatLady thanks - that's a reassuring post to read. I initially titled this post "is this normal" which might have led to a different response. I suppose mainly it's just that I feel I do so much (DH will do things when asked but doesn't take it upon himself to, or will say he'll take the lead on something and then doesn't)...I'm not a control freak, I'd bloody love to have less responsibility.

Dahlen great post too and some home truths in there - I'll look up the book. Open communication is definately an issue and I think we need help with that.

I would like to want to have sex again but I just don't care about it to be honest. When we DTD it's generally good and he is unselfish, but I have to watch myself going into it with a good mindset - which I'm not if he's spent all day making not so subtle hints that he wants a go! Our compromise came out of that - I explained it makes me not want to have sex when he makes it so blindingly obvious all day long that he wants it that night, it just annoys me and then it's not going be good - he said he felt rejected so we agreed to try out having a set 2nights a week when we know we'll be doing it - sounds unromantic but so far it's worked. He generally now doesn't do the dog on heat stuff and I know it's coming so can "prep" myself mentally - it's not as bad as that sounds, as I say, I want to be having sex still, I just forget a lot of the time that it's even a thing other people want to be doing! And I used to have a very high libido so can understand that he feels rejected now. Trouble is I had my period then he got sick so it's been a blissful few weeks of not at all and now he's feeling a bit better his penis is attempting to go off schedule

He is otherwise affectionate and daily tells me he loves me and that I'm beautiful and not always with the expectation of sex. Of course actions are louder than words and it does sometimes get to the point where I don't care how much he says he loves me, why can't he for once think about organising a date night for us or offering to sort out dinner this week or just tidying up after himself let alone anyone else?

FWIW I'm not leaving stale food in the room - he's eating it. He's leaving his dirty empty plates in there - he does leave the room fairly frequently so it's not outside his capabilities to bring his dirty plate into the kitchen! or the empty box of the DC's biscuits that he wolfed down in the middle of the night. Or their snack bar packets. Or a couple of apple cores.

I do think there is a lot of resentment on both sides but generally we ignore it because we rub along well together and neither of us like disturbing the peace - but that's not going to go down well over the next few decades, is it?

What do you hope to achieve by telling your DH that your life appears to be noticeably better without him around? To me it sounds like one of the ingredients for a divorce.