Does it matter to you how much your partner earns?

[brusslesprout]

Not wanting to start a debate or anything like that just a general musing really if this is a really important factor for everyone?

I wonder when looking at the bigger picture does it make the relationship better/easier?

My bf doesn't earn much which bothers me a little sometimes but on the same merit has no debts or bad spending habits as he's always had to be careful.

Growing up my Dad had quite a well paid job but isn't too good with money so still is in a lot of debt when he should be relaxing into retirement.

So yes does it matter in the grand scheme of things?

Puddles1234 I think it's sad that you have never worked at 26 - even the Duchess of Cambridge has experienced a working life. I don't have to work at all but I get a huge sense of satisfaction from it; I love to have my own money in my purse; I love the sense of purpose it gives me.

My DC are 19 and 15 now and I think it has been good for them that I have worked full time for the majority of their lives although I was a SAHM for 8 years when they were small. I look now at women my age (53) who haven't worked since their early 20s and if their world were to go "tits up" they are probably unemployable in spite of in some cases having had elite educations. I know whose shoes I would rather fill and I know who DH's clients would rather talk to at some glad handing event.

Also - if you have children are you going to have different expectations for your sons than for your daughters?

I didn't marry my DH for money; I married him for love and got lucky I suppose but after nearly 25 years to maintain our lifestyle (and it's comparatively modest) we need a certain amount of money coming in to do so and isn't small but at this stage it is getting less because the children are coming out of the indy education system.

Personally I don't think I will have different expectations for my DC, depending on sex. I wish that I had focused more on what I enjoyed at school/further ed and not been bullied by my parents into doing courses that they thought were 'better'. If I had had the foresight to see that your life needs to be based on something you enjoy for you to want to get up every day and slog it out, I wouldn't have been so quick to listen to the advice. I hope my DC feel they can just have some childhood to enjoy subjects and find an affinity with one, which we can then pursue for careers. Together. I honestly believe DC work better when they enjoy it and that is the main thing every parent wants; happy children. If that means they can earn huge amounts, fab, if it means they scrape by but enjoy work, that is also fine in my book.

But you see the dichotomy here Lion, right?

If women need/want to be financially supported by their partners, then their partners must earn enough.

And earning enough to do that for five, ten, fifteen years, even whilst their DC are in university as has been suggested, will greatly reduce the choice of jobs that do the trick.

So are we bringing up our boys to understand and accept what this means for them?

But again, this all comes from whatever financial set up you have. I know I will have money/steady income to leave DC when I die, so although that shouldn't be relied upon perhaps it means I don't feel the pressure of training them up for a high paid career? I don't know how I would feel if I were to somehow loose it all (thankfully not likely as it is mine completely) but I would like to think that my children's enjoyment of work would trump the cash. After all who wants to marry someone miserable as fook who hates what their life has become, but earns big bucks and never has time to do anything with them? Money does not make a happy person, which is what we all strive for in the end.

X posted
I think it is 50/50
Some women will always want a career and high salary - these women may object to having to loose their salary and depend on their partner. Some men like this.

Other women may always imagine their life being home based and reliant largely on their husband's income. Some men like this.

I have often wondered if this idea of keeping the woman and family is why men get higher salaries in so many spheres; the men at the top of the sphere see that a lot of men are still doing the 50's lifestyle of being the sole earner. I do wonder how this skews figures when we debate salaries and opportunities for women. Of course the other Q arising here is whether the men at the top want to keep it this way (a whole other tangent) and I am deviating from the thread hugely. Apologies!

make sure you have a 'plan B' because once they have their mid-life crisis & clear off with a twenty something who sees them as a meal ticket, you will need something to fall back on

I think this comment is quite ironic. Alternatively, the husband, after years of supporting a "cocklodger" may find somebody with a similar work ethic and interests who loves him for himself and not the lifestyle he can provide.

Lion I think it's your phrase "train them up" that makes me sad. We chose to educate our children to give them the widest choice available to them and close as few doors as possible. They will be very comfortable whatever they chose to do but I would hope they chose to maintain the capital they will have rather than spend it. Remember too they will get half each of what we have and if they have two or three dc each their will be further dilution. So, I hope they will both want to work and they will both have fulfilling careers. But they are free to chose them and even if one choses to follow DH's footsteps they won't have to do their first few years in a damp, cold shared flat.

I agree however it's entirely wrong to force one's dC into the inv banking, medicine, magic cirle sausage machine the way so many do.

Near yes when I said that I was thinking of how my parents saw me (think performing seal) and how I have seen many friends being pushed into certain careers by well meaning parents. In some cases they thrive and enjoy it, in others it takes years of doing work they hate for them to suddenly sit up and realise they are unhappy and feel they have to start again. It is all a learning process, but I'd rather try not to 'train up' my kids in this way. Education is of course very important, if you want a career or not.

Well that's very much my point Lion.

We can tell our boys that unpaid work is hugely valuable, that SAHMs never stop running around, that their DC will all be the better educated for it, or whatever...

But do we then go on to explain what that means for them? That they will have to make very particular choices in career, mostly driven by salary, that they will have to work long and hard, that they will always have to juggle their need to earn highly with the desire for family time?

I look at my 14 year old boy now, and am not sure I would want him to have that sort of responsibility!

I think we can educate them as to options, but in reality perhaps your son will like being the sole earner? Maybe it will be something he finds hugely gratifying. Or maybe he will really find women who earn and have high flighting careers hugely attractive? He may want to be a stay at home dad. There are options in between, but I think your son will figure that bit out on his own.

I have girlfriends like you, wordfactory, who are ambivalent about wanting high-earning careers for their sons. They seemingly cannot bear the idea of their sons having to work too hard.

I don't understand their mindset at all. Fortunately the DSSs have not been brought up to be anything but ambitious and are definitely up for the challenge.

Oh, Bonsoir.

I think its only a problem if both partners want different things. A friend of mine has her own business, I am not sure how financially successful but she seems super busy and absorbed with it. Her husband has a lowish paid job, maybe 18k. they are mid 40's. Every year she asks where i am going on holiday , i tell her and then she turns to her husband and says if you had a good job like Mr Creamy then we could go on a cruise or whatever it is. My husband and I would never say something like this to each other. I think that is more of a problem than me being a SAHM , my husband having a good job. we are both 100 % happy with this. i do all the money stuff, sorted our mortgage etc, get good deals on the utilities. we are both very apppreciative of what the other does. we have lots of policies etc if one of us was to die or get ill. i simply cant see whats wrong with that, my DH pays a massive amount of tax, we give to charity and are raising a happy family. yes i know these things can be done if i work but financially we dont need another 25k or whatever i would earn. sorry about the lack of capital letters, keyboard is playing up.

My younger self would have said no, but after a succession of cocklodgers yes it does matter.. he should at least be able to pay his own way.

Bonsoir I know it's tangential but I'll just hark back to my point one last time.

I think it's good for teenagers (and younger children) to have the self-esteem that derives from being given some responsibility in the home and contributing to family life (for example by doing their own laundry or taking a turn to cook a meal).

From what understand about brain science it also has a positive effect on learning to take a break and do something physical, so it's actually especially good for them (and anyone) when revising heavily, for example.

On top of that, you are creating young adults who may be able to get a top job in law or medicine but won't know their arse from their elbow when it comes to domestic life which will make them a PITA of a spouse.

On top of that, if you don't work in order to devote your life to being a full-time skivvy and mollycoddler for teenagers, you're showing them that that is what women are for. Whatever else you say, your actions show it and it sinks in deep. So your DC – male and female - will go on to take that attitude into adulthood, perpetuating inequality.

I know I've gone slightly off-topic but I think your attitude sums up a lot of what I worry about in regard to long-term SAHMing.

I say all this while taking on board that maybe kids need a parent around. But if at all possible both parents should work as flexibly as possible and both take their turn at that.

Because basically what your posts have said is "Be a SAHM, have better kids". In other words, if WOMEN (not parents) work they are failing their kids and should feel guilty.

We don't need my salary creamy (although it's closer to double that) but I like going to work. I love the feeling when I spend £80 on a bottle of perfume that I am entirely unaccountable. I love the purpose it gives me and I think it has been a huge benefit for the DC to have a working mother. They are more independent for it. I have met people beyond my circle and I know more about life beyond the ivory tower I could live in. If DH died tomorrow I woukd have a purpose and a life of my own to keep me going. Even though it isn't necessary I shall also have almost a full occupational pension when I retire - that's half my present income at least from 65 until I die (long lived family on my side). Far better to fund hair and make-up and holidays from that than from capital.

I totally know what you mean Creamy. I don't always have a lot of spare income but when I do I just love going shopping, for me, with my money, unaccountable to anyone. Both DP and I contribute to the joint pot and have our own private accounts. That is MY money and it's a great feeling. If we had decided I should stay off work F-T with preschoolers I could just about handle shared finances temporarily, though I wouldn't like it – technically I can see that that would legitimately be my money too, but it would never feel the same.

Bugger I meant Windmill not Creamy.

I underderstand all that NearTheWindmill and am pleased you are doing what you want with your life. I am too. I dont think it makes one right and better and one wrong or worse.
teenagers can be independent and helpful with a SAHM. Mine have lots of jobs ets, they do moan about them but i think thats normal.

I'm struggling to think of anything less attractive than an ambitious person.

Is it not better to glide effortlessly through working life and reserve energy for family life, theatre, dinner, friends, etc. DH is successful but he's never broken into a sweat about it. I actually think he's more successful because he doesn't let the tail wag the dog.

I think we all need to be less ambitious in the workplace but more personally ambitious.

Oh Bonsoir you do make yourself sound dafter and dafter .

You know full well how high my expectations are for my son and my daughter and how ambitious they both are. Not altogether surprising given how ambitious and successful their father is. And me, to an extent. So far neither chuild gives me cause for concern .

But that is blindingly obviously different from bringing up a child to think they need to live their life in a certain very contrained way simply because they are male.

Wordfactory, I can see where you are coming from re: sons with high earning careers consequently having 'to juggle their need to earn highly with the desire for family time'.

This is especially true in the early years. There may be some men who are happy to miss out on the DC's bedtime routine but there are also some who cherish that time with their DC. Just like lots of young DC love a parent (even better if mummy and daddy can be there) to be at the school gate at the end of the day, many also love both parents to bath them/tuck them in/read them a story/sing them a lullaby.

Ideally, even parents in high earning careers would get home by the DC's bedtime and make up the hours working from home whilst the DC sleep.

pickled and of course ther's travelling.

Many highly paid jobs require travel. And not everyone likes that. And it certainly eats into the time one spends at home.

DH is a very good man, who never complains. Very stoic. His view is that for the silly money he takes home, he can't expect to 'have it all.' But I'm not sure it's fair to expect that all men will feel like that.

In reality, the chances are my DS will enter into a highly paid profession. At the moment he's toying with studying economics. But I don't think it's right that he feels that's his duty IYSWIM. Not if I'm on the otherhand telling his twin sister that being a SAHM is perfectly valid.