Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Help please....Found out that DH has been taking oney out of savings & hiding bank statements!

69 replies

M2T · 03/03/2004 08:46

Please help me, I’m utterly distraught . …. Here’s a bit of background first…..

When I met DH he was in debt up to his ears and was blacklisted, couldn’t get a bank account etc. Consequently everything is in my name and his wages go into my bank account.
I deal with all the bills and all I asked was that he kept an eye on the account and made sure there was enough money in it to cover all the Direct Debits….. if there wasn’t then I could speak to the bank about overdraft increase or another way of avoiding bank charges. So DH has access to the bank and knows my phoneline password so he can check the balance.

Last night I asked him if he had checked the account as DS’s nursery fees and the mortgage were due out. He hadn’t….. same as last month and the month before. So he phoned. We got a bit of a fright at the balance so I phoned to transfer money from my ISA. I knew there wasn’t much in it coz we’d spent it at Christmas, but was disappointed when the balance was only half the amount I expected.

That’s’ when DH blurted this out…… he had found the cash card for the ISA account (which he told me was lost last year) in his WALLET and had been dipping into it since AUGUST without telling me….. he has been hiding the bank statements for that account. One of the times he used the account to get enough money for a £30 taxi fare to his friends house when we had had an argument (only about 3 wks ago). We are really struggling for cash just now, I’m pregnant and we need a bigger house. How could he betray my trust like this?? He says the guilt has been eating him up, yet he carried on using the account. In the same breath he said has been shitting himself that he got caught!!!! I had been wondering for a while why the balance hadn’t been climbing as I expected, but never got around to phoning the bank to check.

He has always been careless with money, but I really thought he was getting better. I am the main earner, he already spends more than he earns and if I ask him why he’s spending so much it always ends in an argument. Now I find that he’s also been taking regular amounts out of our already grossly depleted savings account!

What do I do? He says he’s sorry, but he’s always been a selfish b*stard (his words) with money and he knows he’s done wrong. I feel like he’s made such a fool of me. My instincts are telling me this is just the tip of a huge ice berg and I should send him packing back to his Mummy’s house, but I know that I couldn’t cope financially, especially as I’m going on Mat Leave in 3.5 months time.

All advice would be gratefully received. At the moment I just want punch him in the face.

OP posts:
marthamoo · 03/03/2004 10:04

I think Citizens' Advice can give financial help. Relate ask for a contribution if you can't afford their fee (think I read that on here somewhere).

Oh M2T - really feel for you (((hugs)))

lazyeye · 03/03/2004 10:23

M2T, don't mean to hijack your thread, but am so amazed there are others like me out there (but I bet not as bad as me). I would really appreciate some help getting over my over-spending. Maybe should start a thread, but think I would be too embarrassed.

katierocket · 03/03/2004 10:23

M2T - I know but I really think that if he feels like he has no power in terms of money etc and if that is one of the reasons he has been doing it (again probably subcionsciously as a way of asserting himself) then to show him this thread will just make him feel even more as though things are taken out of his control IFYKWIM. He has to LEARN responsibility for money but maybe you do need help to do this.
would defo recommend RELATE for counselling and they will only charge you what you can afford.

M2T · 03/03/2004 12:40

God this is depressing...
Just spoke to him on the phone to ask how DS was when he took him to Nursery (I always need to ask this as I never get a chance to drop him off.)

He was acting all normal. Then he went quiet and said "I know you don't believe me, and I know it doesn't make anything better, but I am really really sorry for what I've done". The trouble is that if I hadn't decided to phone the bank and ask about the balance.... I still wouldn't know!
I just feel that he's only sorry coz he got caught.

OP posts:
iota · 03/03/2004 12:48

MT2 really sorry to hear this - I was in a similar situation once, but no kids involved.

Agree with all the good advice re changing passwords and not allowing him access. Some people just aren't good with money, others are.

best wishes

bossykate · 03/03/2004 12:48

m2t, lots of sympathy, this is an awful situation. i think the breach of trust involved is akin to if you found out he was having an affair. i agree with the other posters who have suggested that you take away all access to bank accounts immediately - you simply can't afford not to. as www says what if there hadn't been enough money for the mortgage?

The Consumer Credit Counselling Service as the name suggests is a charity offering counselling to help people get out of debt - they may also be able to help your dh also.

good luck.

lilibet · 03/03/2004 12:51

Which account does his salary go into and does he spend that on himself or does it go into a communal pot? I jsut saw the suggestions of giving him an allowance, which is good as long s he doesn't get his salary as well!

miranda2 · 03/03/2004 12:53

Might be a bit out of order here but... here goes!
when dh and i got married we discussed money quite a lot - at the time he wasn't working and i was, but we knew that may change if i did a phd as i did soon after, plus if i had kids, or one of us had an accident and couldn't work etc. We decided to have a joint account which everything went into and bills etc out of, and two individual accounts which both received an identical standing order of 'pocket money' each month. That was because we didn't want to feel that whoever was earning more had more money - it was a partnership and (especially as we were married) we had committed to sharing everything.
I can't help feeling that as it has just been a tenner here and there, resentment at you doling out your money to him as needed might be behind this? Could you give each of you the same pocket money each week, to emphasise that individual spending is something you both need to keep under control for the family income/expenditure to balance? I think giving him just enough for lunch etc is asking for trouble - it sounds like the problem started becasue he didn't have enough in th first place.
Just my tuppenceworth....

jimmychoos · 03/03/2004 12:58

M2T - poor you - must be the last thing you need at the moment. I agree with so many other pople on this thread - that there must be reasons for his spending. Doesn't sound like being 'careless' with money to me - it sounds as though he has an 'addictive' personality - and spending money may be how he is getting his kicks at the moment. I am similar and really have to keep control of my own spending - Dp and I are currently auditing evrything we spend in a month to find out where all the cash goes!
I'm sure the CAB should be able to help.
I do feel for you - sounds like you are the 'mummy' in this relationship which is a role no-one wants to play with their dp.

Twinkie · 03/03/2004 13:01

M2T - I know this won't hep but I think you must be a pretty amazing person to be going through what you are, being pregnant and still helping everyone.

I was like your DP when I was with X2b - although he spent all our spare cash on booze - I frittered away an awful lot and still do - not sure why - DP is much better though and can go days without spending money - how does he do it - I get the jitters if I haven't spent anything all day - even if it means just going to the sweetie machine at work!!

Do you think he could be back on drugs or maybe gambling as others have said - and maybe he is pleased that you have found out - he is being an arse but I bet he really wanted to get caught before things got too bad.

scoobysnax · 03/03/2004 13:02

M2T -very sorry to hear about this - more than you need when pregnant.

Maybe you could work out a financial strategy together and set up some spreadsheets to go through together every week/month with all expenditure itemised and recorded. Also have a section for bank statements so you can reconcile to them each month.
You could set financial goals and targets together so you are agreed on what you have to achieve. Then you could try allocating cash into envelopes for different purposes each month.

If you go down the route of treating dp like a kid with money it might be hard to maintain respect for him, so I would try to avoid this path if you can.

I am sure that you can get through this - it sounds as though you both want to.

Good luck
Scoobysnax
xxx

crystaltips · 03/03/2004 13:03

M2T - poor you

As every one else has suggested there musst be a reason for this "overspending" be it his feelings of powerlessness or an addiction.

Sorry to mention this - but is there a chance that he might be dabbling in drugs again ? Has his behaviour changed recently ?

Whatever excuses / reasons he comes up with I ( personaaly ) would fing hard to stomach ... not only is he denying you the money - but your kid/s too. I'd play the family card if I were you - so that he knows it's not just you getting stroppy ?

Be thankful that you have found out now - and NOT when you are hugely in debt

Take Care xx

crystaltips · 03/03/2004 13:06

Rather a lot of posts crossing just then !

Batters · 03/03/2004 13:14

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Janstar · 03/03/2004 13:21

Hi M2T. I do feel for both of you. This problem is extremely common. I have heard that money causes more relationship problems than any other issue.

I really do understand how worrying it is to be landed with all the responsibility for balancing the books, it can seem as if your dh has the understanding of a child but a child that you cannot prevent from being allowed to have access to the money. All the same I think you are being very hard on him because I don't think he can help being the way he is, as others have said, there are all sorts of complicated reasons why he has spent this money, and they are more to do with control, power and feeling valued than the actual items purchased. I know that isn't much help when you find half your savings have disappeared and it's understandable that you are angry.

He's crap with money and he knows it. He knows he needs you to organise that side of his life for him, but in turn that makes him feel like a child and that makes him angry. He knows he has no right to be angry with you, he knows his actions have caused this, but he is still angry. My guess is that he spends because he is angry. The spending makes him feel more of a man, he has notes in his pocket like the next man, he can stand his round in the pub like the next man. He worked hard today, he deserves a little treat, why shouldn't he go to the pub and buy a few drinks? (I'm guessing this is how he is thinking).

People who do this very rarely ever think about the big picture, they think about £2 for a pint today not being a big deal, they don't think about £2 for a pint every day being £700 a year. I would say that this type of person is typically generous and kind-hearted, and very popular with friends since he has shallow pockets and long arms. All this is no help to you though.

I agree that counselling would be helpful since the issue is not really money, but the feeling that money gives him. I also think that he would get a kick out of learning to save, if you could teach him. If you don't feel you can entrust him with any of the financial dealings of your household, perhaps you could ask him to take over things like searching for a cheap holiday on the internet, to see how much money he can save you, or handing over £50 and asking him to do the shop for a week and see how well he can make that money stretch. He needs to know that he is absolutely invaluable to the running of your family. If he's not good with figures, so what?

But I would also stress that if there are any more secret debts he really needs to confess now. Offer him a once-only amnesty and be prepared to mean it. Make sure he realises this can never happen again. Tell him how much money you expect to have for personal spending and ask him if he thinks he should have more. How could he possibly say yes? If you both have the same amount, set, per week to spend on yourself, perhaps it will bring it home to him that you are not somehow richer than he because you are earning more.

I am lucky that both my dh and I are good with money and so we don't really need to worry about what we spend. It's lovely. But both of us have had partners in the past who were bad with it and it is very easy to end up feeling like you have another child to support in these circumstances. I would tell dh that you hate feeling like that about him, he is your love and your partner in life, what can you do to help him feel as indispensible as you know him to be?

My guess is that there is a big part of him that's relieved as anything that you have found out about the spending. He knows now that you will control what he could not.

Unfortunately, I think if I were in your shoes, I would also have to say, once and for all, that I did not intend to work all my life and end up with nothing. If it looked like that would happen, I would leave. But if he would like to get to grips with money and learn to turn it to his advantage, I would support him all the way.

Good luck. It's not easy at all, I know.

Tortington · 03/03/2004 13:23

really sorry for you, i think you need to emphasise the issue of trust above the issue of money. its my opinion that a marriage/relationship is built on trust above all else. if he could see that if he is decietful about money how this could be the hairline crack of trust that spreads into the wall falling down. trust is the issue i think

Mum2Ela · 03/03/2004 13:25

Hi M2tT.

NOt sure if I can say anything useful but I will have a go.

Am really sorry you aregoing through this at the moment. The last thing you need when pregnant!

A few people have suggested drugs and gambling. Do you really think he is back on drugs? Has enough money been used to suggest gambling? Only you knowhow much money is missing but, as it has been since last August the he started spending, thats quite a while. Drugs are certainly not cheap (does he 'seem' sometimes like he has been doing stuff? I think its quite hard to miss sometimes), or has there been times when you don't know where he is - so he may be at a casino?

If not, may I suggest it may just be the gentle frittering away of money - god its sooo easy to spend a tenner here and a tenner there, I do it waaay too often and although DH and I don't often row about it, we don't have as muc money as he / we would like cos I really need this or really need that. It all adds up. Too quickly.

Perhaps you being in 'charge' of the money might be an idea, and not letting him have the plastic that goes with the accounts this time.

You could do it in a non - patronising fashion . . do you have several bank accounts? Say, onw for bills, one for savings, and a current account? Can you set up standing orders that sorts your salaries as soon as it hits your current account and moves money between the other accounts and so your DH only as a cash card for the current account? That wouldn't be unreasonable, would it? It would be that sorting the bills and savings is like your 'job' and not for him to worry about too often.

I am not sure if I would send him packing just yet - some people are just shit with money, but I think it can be controlled.

Sorry if I have duplicated what anyone else (or you) have said, I haven't had time to read the whole thread. And sorry if I haven't said anything useful to you!

Debbiethemum · 03/03/2004 13:36

M2T, I was never any good with money, used to spend it before I earned it etc. What has helped me improve and could be something your DH could do. Is to set up a spreadsheet where you budget so much against each category ie so much on food, so much on spending, clothes, books & magazines, household maintenence etc. So at the end of each month you can see what area you have overspent on and concentrate on that the following month.

If he looks after the spreadsheet, he may feel responsible to keep the spending under control, rather than the one who has been found out. I am not saying you give him the bank cards back yet, just control over the budget.

If I am talking out of my a**e please ignore me.

M2T · 03/03/2004 13:46

Goodness! Thanks for all the wise words and opinions!

No I don't think he is taking drugs or gambling, it isn't enough money to suggest that.
He has always had unlimited access to the account that both our salaries go into. Every other evening he takes the bank card to the cash point and withdraws money. I've never limited his access to it, so can't understand why he needed to do this.
However, that fact remains he told me that the cashcard for the ISA was lost last year. Yet he's had it in his wallet all along!
Even in situations where we could really have done with using it he still didn't tell me he had it! That just shows me that this was premeditated and it worries me just how far it would've gone if I hadn't found himout.

I know some people are crap with money, I'm definitely one of them, but like a few have pointed out it's not the money as much as the deceit.

I need to give DH some responsibilities not only for his benefit, but for mine. I feel like I'm cracking under the strain of all this.

You have all given me fantastic suggestions and I think I'll take select parts of this thread and show him.

I want him to learn from his mistakes..... he never has and I just keep thinking he'll do this to me again.

I don't want him to leave, but I don't want to be twice as hurt and let down IF (resisting the urge to say WHEN) this happens again.

Thanks again everyone!

Twinkie - thanks for you comment too.

OP posts:
drasticmeasure · 03/03/2004 16:46

M2T not much time to post but your message gave me a chill. I paid off my dhs debts of around £4000 plus a carloan for £3,500 when we got together seriously. He is hopeless with money ( and that includes being hopless at earning it) Whan I was pg with my second I discovered statements for a credit card account of his he had started I kew nothing about. It owed about £2000. I seriously considered booting him out. I had to bale him out of that one too.
I didnt but have since sometimes wished I did,that was three years ago and I lost a lot of respect and tbh the kids are the only reason I stayed.

Freddiecat · 03/03/2004 17:32

m2t this must be really hard for you. agree with what someone said about having an "allowance" account. make sure for your DH it's a savings account with a cash card as you can't go overdrawn with them.

i lived with someone once who was hideously in debt and had been blacklisted. i gave him a 2nd card on my credit card as he needed it for a new job. within a month he'd run it to the credit limit (only £1000 thank god!). he would leave all bills unopened and when we got a pre bayliff notice from council tax (all in his name and i'd only just moved in) he was completely unconcerned so it was me that ended up going to the council office with MY cash and taking the morning off to pay off 2 years of council tax - the bayliffs would have taken my posessions too. when i left him he probably had 20 grand in debt (and a really good job so no excuse!) and owed me about 2.5 grand.

i will say to his credit that over 2 years he paid me off completely so leopards can change their spots. CAB helped me deal with it and might be able to help him - they have a debt councelling service

MrsCodswallop · 03/03/2004 17:39

it s not your fault m2t thast you have a good job.

this has been worrying you for some time and maybe ow he will get his finger out and get a better one

eddm · 03/03/2004 18:33

Oh M2T so sorry about this. No answer but loads of sympathy. Am going to take up some of the tips here because my dh is also crap with money. It wasn't until the house was nearly reposessed I found out (his was the first name on our mortgage because originally he put the deposit down out of an inheritance so all the letters went to him). Then the stupid idiot got himself a county court judgement on a credit card when I could have easily paid them for him. What really wound me up was that we had the f*ing money to pay the mortgage it was just him being stupid. He'd put the joint account, from where we pay our bills, over the OD limit by taking cashback every time he went into a shop, so the mortgage kept bouncing. I think this amounts to stealing, particularly as it turned out he wasn't paying in every month. He seems to fear dealing with money, doesn't open letters, got into major s**t with credit cards. And he's 36 FFS. Agree with some others here that there's a nasty male inadequacy about dealing with wife earning more than them ? he was great with finances when he was the main earner and we were really strapped for cash. His CCJ nearly put paid to our plans to move house but mortgage adviser did get us a deal in the end. Caused a lot of embarrassment and difficulty though.

suedonim · 03/03/2004 19:08

I'm sorry to hear you're having this hassle, M2T. I haven't read all these posts so I hope I'm not repeating too much. My dad was profligate with money and in the end my mum took over the financial reins completely. This was back in the days when people were paid in cash, of course, but dad had to hand his money over to her and she would work out what was needed to run the house etc and then give him what they called pocket money. It did solve a lot of problems, although I suspect my dad was actual relieved to be rid of the money juggling.

As others have suggested, I think you should change your accounts so only you have access to them, for now. Then maybe you could work out with your dh roughly what he needs to keep him going each month then set up an account for him, paying an agreed amount in every month from your main acc. Then he'd have to budget according to his allowance, which might help him learn to manage more efficiently.

Take care, it must be very hard for you.

M2T · 04/03/2004 08:40

Morning All, thanks again for the good advice and for sharing with me what seems to be a frighteningly common problem!

I spoke to DH at length last night. He was so remorseful that it was embarassing for me!! He practically begged me to just give him the money he needs for the week. But then I started to get all bitter and resentful about the fact that now he has absolutley no adult financial responsibilities!! I would LOVE for someone to sort out all my finances and give me a cash amount of pocket money that's all for me. I have to budget for the whole family whilst he gets off with just worrying if he's got anough money left on a Friday to buy an NME. I feel like I can't win.

On a positive note I realise I am lucky in that he has never had the opportunity since I met him to run up serious debts. He can't get a credit card and has no access to mine, he isn't on the mortgage and can't Switch any purchases. So really this problem has been well contained.

I suppose I'm just going to have to put up with burden of all the financial responsibilities and give it time. I just wish that when I've had the baby he could watch the finances for me. That last thing I'm going to feel like doing whilst on Maternity leave with a 3 yr old and a newborn is to be phoning the bank to organise payments.

He has fully acknowledged that he has no excuse for what he did. I asked him if there was an underlying reason why he did it and he said it started off with him finding the card in his wallet a few weeks after we thought it was lost. He found himself skint one morning going to work and took a tenner out to buy lunch, cigarettes etc... with the intent on paying it back on pay day so I would never notice.... then it happened again.... and again..... until he realised that I would notice and so hid the bank statements (2 to date).

OP posts: