What's wrong with me?

[womblesofwestminster]

Any psychology/relationship-enthusiasts want to have a bash at hypothesising what's wrong with me? Please do. I feel mentally 'broken'.

I've been with DH for almost 10 years (we have a 2 and 3 year old). The relationship has its ups and downs. Sex life nil. I have a history of anxiety and depression stretching back to my teens. When I gave birth to DC1 I had TERRIBLE PND. About 8 months into my PND I began anti-depressants and they transformed me. Whilst I'm still vulnerable to bouts and anxiety and depression, it's not chronic and constant like it used to be. Most of the time I feel on top condition. At least I am until DH starts on me, or something bad happens at work, but it's mostly it's DH.

DH is unpredictable (like a woman with permanent PMS). Whenever he's having a bad day he will become volatile, argumentative, spiteful and sweary (I made a thread about this in AIBU a week ago and apparently most blokes are like this when they're stressed). When he does it, it takes me by surprise and always knocks me out of my "top condition" mental state. When it happens, I feel the anxiety flooding back, I get tearful, get a headache, the shakes, my chest feels tight and I get pains in it. I also feel overwhelmingly lonely (and this is the part I need you guys to help me understand). I have many friends. And when I'm feeling on "top condition" I am happy with the state of my friendships. But when the anxiety and depression grips me, I reach out to them (sometimes turning up crying at their door) and then feel stupid afterwards. Sometimes they're just not available at the time I need them. So here's my questions for you guys:

1. How can I let the behaviour of one person (DH) have such an effect on me? Why do I do this? Why can't I just shrug him off and recognise that he's just a grumpy fuck?

1. Why do I feel lonely when I'm depressed/anxious, when a few hours earlier I was fine?

1. How can I stop this cycle? I feel mentally weak, a wimp.

1. Why can't your DH change his crap behaviour rather than take his 'stress' out on you?

I think if he sorts that out you'll find your depression and anxiety might magically diminish, if not disappear. It's not acceptable behaviour, is it?

First off... 'volatile, argumentative, spiteful and sweary' is NOT how most blokes are when stressed. Just nasty jerks who want to take their inadequacies out on other people... usually those weaker than themselves. Most blokes are capable of saying 'I'm stressed today' and taking some quiet time out, going for a run or talking through a problem. Most blokes have enough self awareness to find a solution. Bullies turn it back on others. So that's the first point.

1. Why does it affect you? In part because you care about what he says/does/thinks and in part because it's meant to affect you. He knows your history, knows that you are easily knocked back and he's doing the opposite of what a caring man would do in that situation. He's deliberately bringing you low and if you want a psychological term it's called 'predatory self-esteem'.... making yourself feel better by making others feel bad.

1. Why do you feel lonely when you're depressed? Because anxiety and fear are very personal and very isolating. That the anxiety and fear is coming from someone who is supposed to love you will be confusing and debilitating. He's threatening your physical and mental security. All bullying victims feel what you feel.... alone.

1. How to stop the cycle. Tell the grumpy fuck to take a running jump. I'm serious. Not 'shrug him off' (passive) but be assertive. However 'stressed' he is, he does not have the right to be 'volatile, spiteful, etc' He does not have the right to bully you

Sorry but he sounds like an abusive bully.

And btw.... AIBU is not the place to canvass sound relationship advice. It's the equivalent of bitter old bigots hissing at each other across a backyard fence...

He doesn't sound like a "grumpy fuck". That's not normal behaviour. Yes, sometimes your OH will come home after a bad day and be short, snappy and a grumpy - but not spiteful. Spiteful is just horrible; spiteful is deliberate. For example, DP does a very tiring and stressful job and occasionally he will come home exhausted and in a right arse, and he will snap that something of mine he has just found in the fridge is going off because I didn't keep an eye on it, and he'll stomp upstairs... but ten minutes later he comes downstairs and apologises for taking it out on me. That to me is more normal.

It upsets you because this is your husband, the man you chose to spend your life with, and he is the last person who is supposed to have a go at you.

There is a cycle here, I agree - but the last thing this cycle is is you overreacting. The cycle is him bullying you.

There is nothing wrong with you. But by the sounds of it, there is plenty wrong with him.

I think if he sorts that out you'll find your depression and anxiety might magically diminish, if not disappear. It's not acceptable behaviour, is it?

I totally agree. He's behaving like an arse. But I can't change him. I can only work on myself.

CogitoErgoSometimes I'm going to Google 'predatory self-esteem'. Thank you. Do you think he recognises that he does it?

Not 'shrug him off' (passive) but be assertive.

Whenever I try to be assertive, it just escalates things, and he ends up turning it on me, like I'm terrible.

And btw.... AIBU is not the place to canvass sound relationship advice. It's the equivalent of bitter old bigots hissing at each other across a backyard fence...

It was quite a good thread actually. Lots of empathy.

Why should you "work on yourself" so that he gets to continue being an arse?

Whenever I try to be assertive, it just escalates things, and he ends up turning it on me, like I'm terrible.

Bullies are great at this. Google "gaslighting" while you're about it.

And I'm afraid I agree with Cog about AIBU. It's not that people lack sympathy there, it's just that like most people they'll minimise nasty behaviour when they hear about it in others. They're imagining you're talking about the same occasional shouty argument they might have with their spouses.

Why should you "work on yourself" so that he gets to continue being an arse?

Because it's all I really have control over?

He makes so many demands (I'm too messy, I don't do enough, I sleep too much, etc) and I try to do better on all the things he criticizes me for, but it's never enough. I'm making real changes, but he's never satisfied. It's leading me to believe that it's not actually MY behaviour he's reacting to, but something else that he isn't telling me about.

While you're looking up 'predatory self-esteem' and 'gaslighting' look up 'emotional abuse' or 'psychological bullying'. I'm sorry but the type of person you're describing who sets impossible targets for their partner but is never satisfied is doing it purely as a way of exerting a crude and cruel form of control. The something else he's not telling you about is that he's a shit.

Why do you feel it's down to you to try to be better? Who made him the boss of you?

That something else is him being a textbook emotional and mental abuser. None of this is about you. He enjoys treating you like this.

The reason you feel so anxious and depressed when he acts like he does is because he is abusing you and people feel anxious and depressed when they are being abused.

What do you think you want to change about yourself?

If you sleep less, tidy more, I bet you he would find something else to criticise because it sounds like that's just what he does.

If you stop caring about what he says to you... well, that's like closing yourself off. He will still be saying these things to you. And I know it is harsh to say this, but would you be happy with your children growing up thinking this is how one partner should speak to another?

I'm sorry, I know none of these are answers that you want to hear. But there really is nothing wrong with you that needs changing. I know that sees like the simpler answer at the moment, but other than completely ignoring him, there is nothing you can change about yourself and nothing that needs changing about you. What needs changing is the way he behaves to you.

"But I can't change him. I can only work on myself"

To a point. You may not be able to change him but you can very easily reject him and show him the door. Just a few weeks without this person fucking with your head and you'd probably find your need for medication reduced sharply.

I remember that thread. Lots of women minimising and shrugging off their partners' shitty treatment.

I'd hazard a guess that he is responsible for 99% of your anxiety.

is doing it purely as a way of exerting a crude and cruel form of control

What does he get out of that? (I know I sound naive but I don't understand).

Why do you feel it's down to you to try to be better? Who made him the boss of you?

I want the drama to stop. I want him to stop being chronically grumpy.

If you stop caring about what he says to you... well, that's like closing yourself off.

True, and that sounds liberating, but he will of course, keep trying, and like you point out - we have children to witness it.

there is nothing you can change about yourself and nothing that needs changing about you

Something he always brings up - very regularly - is that I'm messy (so is he). So that's actually something I could (and should) change. After all, we have kids, and as he says, we shouldn't be "living in filth". By messy I mean clutter and mould.

"But I can't change him. I can only work on myself"

this little gem kept me in an abusive relationship way beyond when I should have seen it for what it was and left.

It's not you, it's him and whilst you may not be able to change him you can point out that his behaviour is wrong...to yourself if not to him...and make plans for a healthy happy future without him.

have a look at some of these links......
Verbal Abuse
Emotional abuse
Emotional abuse
a check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
20 signs you're with a controlling and/or abusive partner

you don't have to be hit to be abused

and if you read nothing else read this www.amazon.co.uk/Why-Does-He-That-Controlling/dp/0425191656 You'll feel like Mr Bancroft has crawled inside your relationship and your head...

I'd hazard a guess that he is responsible for 99% of your anxiety.

I've had anxiety since my teens (well before I met him), as did my mother and her mother. I think it's genetic. Although without a doubt, he exaserbates it.

PS we all know that there are things about ourselves that are not perfect...saying it is not you but him does not mean that you are perfect...if just means you are normal but what he is doing is NOT normal. Once away you may well find there are things about yourself that you need/want to change, but you are not responsible for his behaviour.

My worry with closing yourself off is that you wouldn't be able to just close yourself off to him. It would be a general hardening. So your family, your friends, your children - everyone. It might sound liberating at the start, but I can't imagine it would be long-term?

No one can understand what he gets out of it other than your DH himself, and I doubt he would ever be able to explain it. But I imagine it will be something to do with power. He feels better by making you feel worse. That's not something that is ever going to really make sense to people who don't think like that.

foolonthehill I'm reading your links. Regarding the first one, I've bolded the points on that list that reflect his behaviour:

1.Does your partner speak to you differently in private and in public?

1. Do you often leave a discussion with your partner feeling completely confused?
2. Does your partner deny being angry or upset when he/she very obviously is?
3. Does your partner act as though you were attacking them when you try to explain your feelings?
4. Does your partner discount your opinions or experiences?
5. You feel as though no matter how hard you try, you just don't seem to be able to communicate your thoughts and feelings to your partner as he/she always seems to misunderstand you, and/or it always seems to cause an argument no matter how you try to approach the subject?
6. Do you feel nervous or avoid discussing issues which disturb you with your partner because you 'know' that trying to discuss them will just leave you feeling even more upset?

Do you feel as though your self-esteem and your self-confidence have decreased?

1. Do you find yourself spending a lot of time working out either how not to upset your partner or wondering what you did or said which did upset your partner?

Hmmmm it doesn't look good. But he could probably bold a lot of things on that list about me and my behaviour (particularly 4, 5, 6, and 7).

I have family history of stuff same as you Sisters, cousins, Aunts and uncles etc 3 different continents etcc. and had nearly 40 years of anxiety and depression and I haven't had it for 2 years since I left m y H.

Family susceptibility doesn't mean you have to have it any more than if you have the cancer gene for lung cancer. You only get it if you smoke.

You may only get anxiety and depression because you are living with an abuser.

I think the biggest change to make you feel better is to get rid of your arse of a husband, that behaviour is not normal, it's abusive, and I'm not surprised you get anxious.

Then perhaps look into some CBT techniques to stop the downward spiral when something negative happens. I do the same thing and go from being happy with life to thinking that everything is wrong and it's all my fault, but some CBT techniques I've been told is helping that a lot.

I hope it all gets better for you.

Do you think he recognises he's doing it?

Cleorapter you sound like me. What stuff triggers you into a downward spiral? Which CBT techniques have you found particularly helpful?

What does he get out of it?

Life on his terms. A relationship where he is in control. A partner who is so anxious to please and so unsure of themselves that they keep going back to the GP for more meds rather than looking too closely at his selfish behaviour.

Do you think he recognises he's doing it?

An observation exercise for you. Does he talk to other people the same way he talks to you? Is he volatile, sweary and aggressive with others (colleagues, strangers, friends) or just you? If you could show them CCTV footage of how he behaves when 'stressed' would friends and family be shocked at what they saw? If you are apart for any length of time, do you feel calmer? Do you ever dread hearing his key in the door?

Ticking seven out of eight things off that list is really a very bad sign. I'm sorry that you're still self-blaming and thinking in terms of CBT and meds when it's very clear you are being bullied.

OP, no type of coinselling in the world will help you when the problem is that you are being abused.

Sorry, I posted that too soon. I meant that there's no point in doing any therapy to change yourself when the problem doesn't lie with you, the problem is that someone else is abusing you. You could get therapy for improving your self-esteem so you can see that you must leave him, but anything else will just you futilely trying to make him change via your behaviour, when only he can change.

If he wanted to treat you beteer, he would be doing already.