DP's annoyances - is this just reality and what all men are like?

[elsaisnotatiger]

My DP is very sweet, kind, attentive and helpful. He loves our little son and is a great father.

However when it comes to real life he is a basket case. Leaves clothes lying all around the house, wet towels on the sofa, plates everywhere. If he starts a DIY job he will leave bits and tools all over the place. He has no common sense whatsoever (eg leaving the baby in a bumbo on the roof of the car once, and said the baby could not fall out of the bumbo. Could not understand why I went mental). He forgets to buy food, lock the house etc. We have a bath mat that says "hot" when the water is too hot for the baby and yet he put him in regardless. He just doesn't NOTICE things. He will let the baby play with a bottle of paracetamol, saying it has a childproof cap and therefore is perfectly safe....
When we go away I have to double check that he has remembered all the basics, because if I don't, some vital item will have been forgotten.
I get really frustrated with all of the above and end up snapping at him and feeling like I have two children, not just one.

Am I being overly fussy? Are all men like this? Or will these annoyances end up being a deal breaker in time (we have been together two years)?

Serious word - show him pictures of news stories etc of babies who have been burned or fallen from a few feet. Horrible but at least tangible.

I just don't get the knee-jerk reaction telling people to leave partners, take kids away from their parents etc. Like women or mothers have never done anything wrong.

The tea towels comment was responding to the significant part of the op that was complaining of messiness and disorganisation

It's not a knee jerk reaction. The op mentions she's already tried speaking to him and he thinks she is crazy.

It is a child protection issue.

If you did these things in a professional capacity caring for children you'd be sacked.

And the genders are irrelevant. As evidenced by my response to bohemiangirl's strange idea about safety re: a car roof

Good grief why would the OP leave him?
He obviously loves his child but is not good at common sense. Have a serious chat with him. Get some info on child accidents / prevention But towels and general untidiness you will find is not gender related!
I do laugh at the holier than though MNetters.

Exactly. With hindsight I can see that I did some things with the baby that others would be aghast at, safety wise, and which I am aghast at now, but having a newborn was a learning curve. Very few people are perfect.

OP, you seem to be saying your dh is all brains and less common sense? Do you think reports from professionals etc might get through to him more?

I think he needs to be told of real life situations where doing what he is doing has caused harm. The toddler who opened a safety cap and ate or drank the contents with horrific consequences, the child who fell out of the bumbo on the table/work surface and seriously hurt themselves. Serious and sometimes tragic stories like these are forever in the news and if he won't listen to you maybe he will believe the papers.

Leaving him doesn't seem like the answer to me. At least you are usually there at the moment to prevent serious harm. Taking yourself out of the picture for part of the time might just add to the problem. Assuming you are otherwise happy of course. If it all gets too much so you don't want to be with him, that would be different.

Also for the stuff which is less serious like not bringing jumpers on a holiday, I would let him suffer the consequences. You look after you and the baby and if he fails to pack vital stuff for himself he has to deal with it. Surely that way he will eventually learn the power of the packing list!

Crikey, I thought DH was bad because he won't listen to my entirely reasonable request to put the coffee pot on the back ring, not the front ring, to avoid the possibility of DS running past and knocking it over with coffee scalds resulting (tiny flat, passage between table and gas hob is very narrow) and (God, I still remember this) putting 24-hour old DS in a car seat to come home from the hospital without checking the instructions and insisting that he had it the right way round. He didn't.

The bath mat saying hot and putting him in regardless really makes me furious. Perhaps you need to find written evidence from a clearly reputable source like an NHS website as to the long term effect of burns on a child's skin. I know that my husband tends to disregard anything I say as just ravings: telling him that children's burnt skin doesn't heal like adult burnt skin just did not sink in (I think it has, now).

Otherwise, you could consider getting a male GP to talk him through child safety issues like hot baths and others. Depressingly, when men deliver safety lectures, they suddenly become Important Information safeguarded by The Brethren, I think. And, infuriatingly, passed on by my DH to me as Stuff I Need to Know, although I've been saying the same stuff for years.

Obviously, you don't want to get to the point where you want to split up over this stuff, but you've got quite a few years ahead of you of this type of thing, and you need to find a way of getting him to recognise the most obvious dangers and avert them - plus you need to find a way to deal with the fact that he probably won't ever see things in exactly the same way as you do, because I suspect that is a factor in many co-parenting arrangements.

Oddly enough, I have been the more willing to let our now-10yo DS walk home from school alone. My husband has kittens about it on a regular basis.

Have you all missed that the op has already spoken to him and he thinks she is crazy. He doesn't respect her objectively reasonable view and continues to put the baby at risk. I don't believe any of the things listed really are things you should have to learn when you have a baby. Changing nappies, feeding, burping etc maybe but should someone need to be told not to leave a baby on the roof of a car while they clean the gutters? And he won't accept this was dangerous? He is therefore quite a serious risk to the child.

How likely is it that giving him some pamphlets will make a difference. He already doesn't respect the op's view.

I'm aghast that people would put their romantic relationships above their children's safety tbh.

X post

Neglect is just as serious as abuse and I doubt many people would be saying to the op to give him pamphlets on why hitting children is bad if he'd hit the baby.

But, with no disrespect to the OP, we don't know how the conversation between them went. I know that my conversation with DP in that situation might well not have been calm. There are other avenues to explore before.jumping to ltb, and only let him have supervised access!!

Some people are just naturally dippy. Alot of these dippy people are women.
Didn't these characteristics make you cross when you were dating. Why did you marry him? Why are you only bothered now?
My dh is not like this at all. But he has other faults. As do I. Don't we all?

Sadly many men (and maybe women too) will only believe stuff from a "reputable" and possibly male source like MrsSteptoe says. So I think written reports or a chat with a male doctor, as she suggests, or even running the scenarios through with some sensible male friends could work wonders. Worth a try before filing for divorce anyway.

i think some of the things you have mentioned are really really petty - like the bath mat that says hot - we dont use a bathmat which says hot because we can judge for ourselves what is right(no doubt you dont even know what temp the mat changes to say hot so its useless really...) - no i wouldnt mind if a baby had a bottle of something with a childproof cap on it and heaven forbid he doesnt take a jumper with him when he goes on holiday... the only serious thing you have mentioned is the car seat but if someone is with the baby then its not so bad either.

i think you need to concentrate on yourself and leave him to manage on his own - hes not a child and doesnt need another mother. stiop nagging him!

Seriously people are suggesting that the op needs to get a man round because some men only listen to other men? Why would you want to be with someone like that?

Oh god, Elsa you could have just described my XH. Exactly the same level of neglect and complete unwillingness to accept that he had endangered the dcs. Wouldn't hold hands with ds when he was 2 and walking beside a road, fell asleep with dd on the sofa when she was 3 days old (after I'd specifically asked him not to, he even got himself a duvet - completely planned neglect), doesn't dress the dcs appropriately for the weather and won't stop an activity because they're crying with cold, took ds (very fair) out in the sun all day and only applied suntan lotion once, and so on and on and on.

I used to think he was a good dad. He'd change nappies and seemed really engaged with them. But I always had to be the responsible one.

2 years after separation I am now fighting a battle to keep his access as supervised. He can't be trusted. I doubt myself constantly, but seeing you describe your dh in such scarily similar terms (even down to the job) makes it very clear that it is neglect. Your dh and my XH are not good dads. They endanger their dcs because they are so certain that they are right and to my XH at least they are his possessions.

One question, is your dh a safe parent when other people are around? My XH would be perfect in front of others, but utterly neglectful when on his own or just with me.

No, people are saying that different people learn different ways, and it would probably be worth the OP investing that before just walking out...

Re the mess and disorganisation, people are different. Sometimes over years it becomes too much and relationships end over it, other times you work out how to.compromise and live with each others quirks

Oh and XH finally agreed that sleeping with a newborn on a sofa whilst on meds that made him sleepy was unsafe (after 2 days of arguing that he'd done nothing wrong), when I highlighted the relevant passages in the baby book.

The fact that he had no respect for my view and needed the "proof" is in itself hurtful and degrading.

Good point, Chris. None of us can tell from the op whether there is actually a wider picture of him being neglectful to the baby, or just one or two (serious) things which need addressing. Hopefully this thread will help the op to think about it and decide.

This must be so stressful for you, OP! I remember, when my kids were babies, having chats with other mums about how dads seemed to lack mums' ability to anticipate/predict danger.

Like a mum would walk into a room and see it from her child's POV, and note the chair under the open window, the kettle on the edge of the worktop, the knife in the low drawer. But a lot of dads would be oblivious.

I realise I'm being sexist in that post and the vast majority of Dads are very good. But many of them seem reactive to threats, not proactive.

Oh -- before I dig myself a deeper hole, can I say that I really feel for you. This kind of behaviour is terrifying and limits your ability to get on with your own things, as you can't even relax when DH has the baby. I'm sure you lie awake at night worrying about what could happen. You look ahead and see a lifetime of having to babysit BOTH of them, just to keep the baby alive. And when he's a toddler... Ugh. :(

Stay calm, do research and get factual evidence, and tell him CALMLY that he needs to buck up. Don't cry or you'll be painted as hysterical and neurotic. I'd give his mum specific examples of stuff he's done (things you've listed here) and make her give him a stern warning. Get everyone on your side.

Very true Thurlow, I could be projecting, it depends entirely on whether this is a pattern of behaviour or isolated incidents . We all make mistakes, but we don't keep remaking dangerous ones.

Everyone projects I know I am too, we did silly things as new parents that horrified me later! But the experience of others hopefully helps posters to work out what is going on for them

His behaviour is pretty consistent. He just put a packet of kitchen cleaning wipes on the floor, put the baby down and wandered off. The baby immediately picked the packet up and started chewing it and the next stage would have been him pulling the chemically saturated wipes out and eating them. I had a go at him and he said he couldn't put the wipes in the cupboard because he had been holding the baby at the time. He just doesn't get it and I am struggling to get through to him.
I can deal with a certain number of irritating character flaws and other failings but not everything together! The child safety thing being far and away the most important.
Oblomov these traits weren't apparent till after we had the baby.