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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Those of you who've gone NC or had major issues with in-laws/parents...

64 replies

vinetime · 11/12/2013 13:58

...what do you do when said people send Christmas gifts to your children?

DH on very bad terms with his parents. Relationship always been strained for various reasons, and a recent family row has resulted in a total stand-off. They've behaved horrendously, and the upshot is they cannot be in our lives unless they acknowledge their behaviour and make some serious changes. I doubt very much this will happen. Poor DH has (I think) more hope that eventually their relationship can be restored. But he is also standing firm on the situation, and not intending to 'back down', as he has so many times in the past.

Anyway - this morning's post brings presents from them to our kids. Kids young enough to not really notice who does or doesn't give them gifts at Xmas, but old enough to remember/acknowledge their grandparents if you see what I mean. Kids haven't seen them for several months as a result of this latest row - and before then only about twice a year, as they live in a different country. So it's not like they're close to them.

Part of me thinks that we should just give them the presents - why should the kids lose out? - and be breezy about who they're from. Yet I can't help but feel very uncomfortable about this. DH parents are very manipulative, and I can't help but feel this is a way to try to re-enter our lives without acknowledging their deeply hurtful behaviour.

If we accept the gifts, and then get into thank you cards (my eldest DD knows how strict I usually am about this!), then it's contact, which we ultimately don't want in our lives until a lot of amends are made on their part...

What do other people do?

OP posts:
PTFO · 11/12/2013 17:07

I think the key, if you pass on the gifts is to check them first, and get kids to send thank you card- nothing fancy. Don't engage in anything else, everything else gets ignored.

My ds knows he never sees inlaw GP's as they live a very long way away (true) as this has always been the case its nothing knew to him that he never sees them, he's just accepted that, that's the way it is. We don't openly talk about them either.

pippop1 · 11/12/2013 17:07

I'm surprised that more people haven't said to send the gifts back unopened.

Surely keeping them, in whatever form, is acceptance of some kind of contact with your in laws.

Can you imagine them saying "Well, they are happy to accept our gifts" and they will have something on you to be used in an argument.

Return them I say.

vinetime · 11/12/2013 17:11

I'd feel happy to return them pip pop - it would reinforce what we've already said to them.

HOWEVER, I know that there's no way DH would do that. He would see it as incredibly aggressive and if anything, descending to their level.

I realise this thread has slightly become 'my husband and I have different views on what to do about a situation with difficult parents'. Has anyone been in a similar position?

OP posts:
AttilaTheMeerkat · 11/12/2013 17:13

Returning them unopened is not a good idea because it is a response and communication to them on some level. It also gives them an "in" to further communicate; toxic people always but always want the last word.

PTFO · 11/12/2013 17:14

ahhh but PIPPOP1 quite the opposite!! they scream that we are horried enough not to pass them on how evil we are...

we didn't give ds one card as it promised something on it when he was 5yr old. We were not even talking and yet they think they can take our ds on a day trip two hours away from us when they don't even know him because they cant be bothered to get to know him... Its a no win thing. whatever they do it will be wrong so the best bet is to try and do what is right generally speaking. iyswim

AttilaTheMeerkat · 11/12/2013 17:15

Some toxic people will let you leave a relationship without caring one bit. They never really cared about you, and if you don’t want to be used and abused anymore, they’re simply on to the next person before you can say, “Bye!”

Others, however…

Others hoover.

The toxic hooverer doesn’t truly care about you either — they just want to keep you around to feed on emotionally, and when you decide to go no contact, they don’t plan on letting you get away that easily.

Many hooverers have traits of borderline, narcissistic, antisocial or histrionic personality disorders. You can click the green & purple buttons to the lower right to find out if that may describe the person hoovering you. People with Dependent Personality Disorder may also hoover.

Hoovering is manipulation to gain control over your choice to distance yourself, and typically takes the following forms:

•Ignoring your requests to break off the relationship and attempting to continue on as if nothing has changed.
.
•Asking you when you’re going to “get over it” and return to your past actions.
.
•Sending you a fake apology to give you hope that things have changed.
.
•Trying to trick you into contact by saying someone needs you, is sick, or in trouble.
.
•Triangulating with others, communicating things to you through them.
.
•Saying they’re worried about you, concerned about whether you’re okay, need to know where you are, etc.
.
•Sending unwanted cards, messages and gifts, sometimes gifts for your children, as they know you are likely to feel guilty about keeping a gift from your kids. Don’t allow this – exposing your children to manipulation is far worse!
.
•Returning old items you left behind.
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•Baiting you with drama games.
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•Contacting you about “important” things they “forgot” and suddenly have to tell you.

Don’t Fall for Hoovering Tactics

Attempts to pull you back into a toxic relationship are not valid expressions of caring and concern — they are attempts to regain control over your behavior. Beware — hoovering attempts are often disguised as caring, loneliness, hurt, desperation, fear, illness, and other things designed to play on your sympathies and pull you back. Abusers know that pulling on heartstrings works very well. (In the case of BPD, it may be simply out-of-control emotions and fear of abandonment more than an attempt to control you per se; however you will likely still feel that you are not being allowed to end a relationship you no longer want).

If your wish to end a relationship is not being honored, whatever a toxic person thinks will work best on you will be what they try, so when one angle doesn’t work, they will try another, and another, ramping up their efforts until it seems they might never stop. Typically, hoovering DOES stop if the person being hoovered does not fall for the hooverer’s tricks.

The sooner the person being hoovered completely ignores everything and does not respond to anything at all in any way, the sooner the toxic person finally understands that they do not have the control. Some toxic people may still make the occasional attempt on holidays, anniversaries of events, etc. Don’t bite the bait. Simply ignore any attempts.

If you have already made it clear that you do not want a relationship (or if it’s obvious) then DON’T ever contact the person doing the hoovering to tell them to stop again, or how angry you are. That is a reward. They will be thrilled to receive your attention and pleased to know that their efforts have paid off by snagging you, so they’ll be contacting you even more!

More Here: lightshouse.org/lights-blog/when-toxic-people-start-hoovering#ixzz2nBgsPQxT

PTFO · 11/12/2013 17:18

yes Im in he same position and I would return to sender BUT as someone mentioned that's interacting with them, it gives into the game which is what they feed on. If you do nothing then they have no idea whats going on, which is why my inlaws still send the they are waiting for us to bite. Its also useful to guilt trip my dh and bring them up twice a year (ds bday)

Your right Attila they DO always want the last word- a nasty one.

MrsEdinburgh · 11/12/2013 17:20

The first Christmas when we went NC the presents went to charity. This was after asking my DD what she wanted to do with them.

DD has unfortunately witnessed some of the behaviour of my ex mother & her husband, so we haven't indoctrinated her.

Luckily we haven't received anything since.

PTFO · 11/12/2013 17:23

oh, and my dh feels the same as yours- to refuse would be lowering ourselves to their level which he wants to rise above. its frustrating I know.

vinetime · 11/12/2013 17:36

Thanks again everyone.

DH's mother is definitely a narcissist (she ticks every single clinical box!). I used to think DH's father wasn't so bad, just weak and somewhat brow-beaten, but his behaviour recently has also been exceedingly hurtful.

Things got to a point where DH said 'you need to apologise to us if you want to be in contact with me and my family.' Of course, no apology, nothing for weeks - this seems like a pretty massive statement from them.

And then to send Christmas presents to our children weeks later...it's very fucked up. (Also, why have they arrived so early? Are they hoping this might make us forget everything, and then on xmas day they can pretend we're happy families from afar?!!)

OP posts:
Shellywelly1973 · 11/12/2013 17:37

The concept of 'hoovering' has described my sister perfectly!

I After reading that I know its not me...

The whole gift thing has become a massive issue but this is my first Christmas with nc. Hopefully nect year will be easier

vinetime · 11/12/2013 17:37

And PTFO - how do you cope with your situation?

OP posts:
BookWorm37 · 11/12/2013 17:48

My ex-mum leaves a bag of gifts outside our house, after banging loudly on the door for about 20 mins, so I don't have the choice of returning to sender. I usually unwrap the presents (they have hidden little notes etc inside the toys before) and some I sell on eBay or donate to charity, and some I give to DC without ceremony. At first I felt as though I didn't want things from them contaminating my house and I used to hide the presents away or throw them out. I still feel uncomfortable at times when I see things from them in my house but I try to see the things as just objects/toys now.
It is very difficult, and feels as though they are still having a bit of control via the gifts.

BookWorm37 · 11/12/2013 17:49

My ex-mum leaves a bag of gifts outside our house, after banging loudly on the door for about 20 mins, so I don't have the choice of returning to sender. I usually unwrap the presents (they have hidden little notes etc inside the toys before) and some I sell on eBay or donate to charity, and some I give to DC without ceremony. At first I felt as though I didn't want things from them contaminating my house and I used to hide the presents away or throw them out. I still feel uncomfortable at times when I see things from them in my house but I try to see the things as just objects/toys now.
It is very difficult, and feels as though they are still having a bit of control via the gifts.

BookWorm37 · 11/12/2013 18:06

Oops sorry for duplicate post Confused.

AttilaTheMeerkat · 11/12/2013 18:07

Vinetime

His parents are simply trying to "hoover" you back into their control.
Do not acknowledge anything from them, you need to go radio silent on them because they want a response from you. ANY response only draws you back in, you must not respond at all.

Not at all surprised to read that your DHs mother is a narcissist and it is not possible to have any sort of relationship with such a person. Women like his mother too always but always need a willing enabler to help them and that is his dad's role in their dysfunctional marriage.

vinetime · 11/12/2013 18:08

Bookworm - do you tell your DC who they're from?

OP posts:
vinetime · 11/12/2013 18:12

Attila, agree wholeheartedly.

Problem is, I just don't think DH could STAND to take the presents and not thank them. He is naturally very well mannered and has also suffered years of conditioning.

I am worried he will be manipulated by this, in all h

OP posts:
BookWorm37 · 11/12/2013 18:13

Vintime, I don't usually. I just give the unwrapped toy and if pressed on who it's from I'll make something up.
I used to be so confused about what to do but I always unwrapped gifts so they weren't 'special'. Still not sure whether it's right to keep the stuff or not.

vinetime · 11/12/2013 18:13

Whoops - 'in all honesty...'

OP posts:
KingRollo · 11/12/2013 18:13

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

vinetime · 11/12/2013 18:22

Yeah, absolutely Rollo. His mother has never accepted me - it's part of the entire problem.

OP posts:
yomellamoHelly · 11/12/2013 18:26

I couldn't stand the reminder of that person in the house, so unwrapped and took to charity shop. Presents have dried up now - 6/7 years in.

yomellamoHelly · 11/12/2013 18:28

And no acknowledgement of receipt. Have met on odd family occasions and been asked about them and acknowledged they arrived but avoided any further comment / made excuses and gone elsewhere.

deste · 11/12/2013 18:48

I would give the gifts to the children as they have no involvement in your no contact. In years to come they may wish to have contact with them and how will they feel knowing you did not pass on gifts to them. I went no contact with my MIL for 11 years and if she gave me a cheque I tore it up but would not have done that to my children if she had given them a cheque.

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