Am I doing the right thing here

[cherryademerrymaid]

Brief background:

1 child, over age of 6.

ExH left us in my home country (Hague convention country) several years ago.

ExH now lives in another country (Hague convention country)

ExH refuses to visit child here.

ExH insists only way seeing child is either putting child on plane or allowing ExH to come here and taking child away for a week.

ExH had telephone contact up until earlier this year.

Now ExH has e-mail contact - my choice.

ExH has done these things in the past that resulted in me insisting on E-mail only

ExH closed his e-mail account so we could only communicate via phone

Made accusations of me not allowing child to tell him via phone what child wants for Christmas/birthdays

Has gotten annoyed at child when child hasn't heard him properly/misunderstood what he is saying and told child that child is very rude

Has told child there is not need to talk if they don't' feel like it and then accused me of stopping child from talking

Has refused to call on time demanding a 30 minute calling window

Has called unexpectedly and then got angry at me for child not being available and gotten verbally aggressive with me, made fun of me to whomever was in the room with him and told me I need to shut my fucking mouth

Has told child he is going on a family holiday with his step children to a place he knows child would be desperate to go to and subsequently sent a brochure from the place as a "Christmas present"

Has asked for more time, been offered calling every single day, has come to an arrangement for less than every day but for just 5 minutes at bed time and then has gotten angry when I've said we need to change the arrangement because he's insisting on extending calling from 5 to 10 to 25 to 20 minutes (and sometimes calling late too) and accused me of being controlling and alienating him from child

Has been annoyed when telephone conversation isn't going the way he wants it to go and has then said to child that since he can't be bothered to talk to him he's only going to call once a week form now on (child was upset, didn't know they had done anything wrong) and then subsequently made out it was merely for the child's own good when the delivery was obviously due to anger not care and concern

Accusations of not allowing him to know child's measurements so he can buy clothe/shoes for child and purposely buying the wrong sizes even though I have given him the right sizes on the phone and then saying that I'm just being critical and every single present he sends isn't good enough (completely not true)

Final straw - ExH told me he wanted to come here with his family, take child during school term time, on a trip to a third country to somewhere he knows child really, really wants to go to. We have been over the fact that I have been advised to not let child out of country based on previous behaviour of ExH without certain things being in place via a court order, and we have been over that time and time and time again, each time he declares that he has no idea why I am being so difficult and that there are laws in place to prevent him from keeping child outside this country (yes, there are....but first I would have to find child and ExH - but I have his address so of course I'd be able to find them) then I would have to pay for the case to be brought to court (in a country that is notorious for astronomically high lawyer fees and dragging out such cases for years and years and years). Anyway, I reiterated that such arrangements needed to be sorted out in court and that he was welcome to apply to this jurisdiction. I asked him to please not say anything to child until we had sorted it out in court.

So, ExH on next phone call told child all about the trip, letting child know that whole family would be there including step-children, and would child like to come....of course I had to say no, child was in bits.

I said no more phone calls and have stuck to that since. E-mail contact only. I've just been through another 24 hours of random phone calls and e-mails asking me to let ExH speak to child. I haven't backed down. I don't' feel I can trust ExH to not pull more of these stunts.

Am I doing the right thing? Am I being too harsh? Since me implementing the e-mail contact ExH has frequently gone weeks and weeks without replying to child's emails.

No you are not doing the wrong thing. Ex is not acting in the child's best interests, only his own.

If he takes child out of the country then is there a serious risk of kidnapping/not bringing child back? If so then there is no question he must never be allowed to be in a position where he could.

Perhaps you might benefit from a 3rd party involvement OP, some legal help to ascertain contact & access & to let you take a step back from him. Can you consult a lawyer to draw up appropriate contact & access details that make it fair to your child? This would stop the phone call/email rubbish that he's currently doing.

Does child want to maintain a relationship with ex?

My legal advice is to not let child out of country with this man and to not engage unless he comes to court here, which he keeps threatening. there has already been a Children's Act his hearing here with ExH denies all knowledge of, but his lawyer subsequently submitted the documents I'd sent during that case to ExH to the court in ExH's jurisdiction when ExH tried (and failed) to apply for a custody and division of property determination. All he got was a divorce. He's been repeatedly told that for child matters the correct jurisdiction is here but several years on he is yet to come here to apply for contact. After him repeatedly contacting my lawyers over the years to try to negotiate (costing me money) and then not taking it any further than a few e-mails that my lawyers had to deal with, the advice was to ignore until I got court papers form him because he was just racking up costs to me each time. It has been made clear to him that he needs to apply for contact.

yes, there is a risk he wouldn't' return child, despite him saying the opposite. he financially strangled me when he first left and then tried to use that to get me to send child until is was "on my feet" and when that didn't work he took the "you're mentally unwell, look at all the stress you're under, you can't look after child, let my parents step in" When I suggested going there with child he was all against it - not surprising really since I subsequently found out the reason he left us here was because he'd found someone else.

Child goes between wanting to and not waiting to have contact. I insist on some contact at the moment.

Right.

Stop talking to him on the phone. He knows your e-mail, so he can contact you there, or have him text you.

Allow phone contact with child. Put it on speaker phone and record it.

Allow 30 min window.

Do not allow him to take child out of the country.

Would he do skype video calls? It would be better for the child as they can see eachother and it's more relaxed.
DS and his dad have been doing it for over 2 years now and it works well.

Be as tough as you need to be to save your child from heartache.

I can't see how you can possibly think you might be doing the wrong thing. You also have sound legal advice to back you up.

Any possibility you could arrange a (very cheap) holiday to the place your child wants to go to without her father having any input? Or somewhere else for a change of scene if nothing else. It would be a shame if you were put in the position of being the parent who stops all the fun.

Thank you.

Lweji - Skype or phone is what I would like for them. However, ExH cannot see in the slightest (or refuses to) what was wrong with his actions I that last phone call re the holiday. I emailed him about it and his response was hat Im a controlling, mentally unstable parent who cant handle her child's predictable response at being told "no" to visiting Disney. Not once since then when we've clashed over this has he taken any responsibility for his actions: it's all my fault.

I honestly think he'd pull that crap again. He was pulled up on telling child that he was missing out on Harry Potter world and subsequently sending a brochure as a present. He didn't think that was wrong either.

Annie- unfortunately Disney, even Paris, is way out of our budget.

Oh, fair enough; there are more and less expensive ways to do Disneyland but there is no cheap way. I did a whole weekend once with two of the DCs on the very cheapest package at an unfashionable time of year (the weather was awful!) and it was still cripplingly expensive.

That really is a filthy trick he is pulling, getting your DC all excited about stuff they can't see because mean old Mummy won't let Daddy take them.
Of course he doesn't see there's anything wrong with it, because child is not a real person, just a possession to be fought over. (I wonder whether he would actually bother with the going to Disney bit first or would just get straight on the plane to home once he had child in his keeping. Hopefully you'll never find out.)

If he refuses to see anything wrong and keeps ignoring what the lawyers have said then I'm afraid you are left with the only option of laying the law down with him and saying 'take it or leave it'.

It is very very clear that you should not allow him to take your child out of the country.

He seems to be messing your child around as much as he is you. Is it not better to keep contact down to infrequent and explain why (age appropriately) to the child? Saying manipulative things about you to the child is going to hurt him or her a lot. You don't need to be spiteful, you can simply say plainly and without malice that you have been told by legal advice that Daddy can come here but that you must not your child to go there, that it is going through the courts, your father knows that and it is not nice of him to keep sending you brochures and talking about it. That Daddy sometimes doesn't act the way that he should so you have to be very careful. It can be said gently, not meanly.

I also think that if the child does not want contact, you should respect that. You can encourage him or her, but should not force it.

I often feel that DC is actually just a trophy and it has been pointed out to me by others who have been involved in the case.

Bit more information in case it helps:

He doesn't pay maintenance stating that he earns no money (maintenance doesn't equal visiting rights, I know this. DC is not a pay per view movie. But, he stopped maintenance when I replied in the negative to me allowing DC to visit outside the UK)

He has noted in e-mails to DC that he can't do this or that for DC because he's busy saving up for a solicitor to "stop your mother from keeping me from you."
He says in e-mails to DC how wrong I am and that I am putting DC in the middle.
He sends pictures of himself on fantastic holidays and mentions things such as relaxing in their hot tub in their garden in the evenings and how fantastic the set up that they have at DCs home for him when he comes.
He's sent cards saying "Can't wait to see you at whatever the holiday the card pertains to" when we haven't discussed a visit over that particular holiday at all.
He tells DC how much the woman he moved in with and her DC love DC and that they are upset that they can't meet DC (they've never met DC)

Half the time I feel like a right royal bitch.

And obviously, for a while now, I've been vetting things because of this behaviour. I guess I've just had a bit of a concern this past 24 hours since another clash over the no phone contact (which kicked off because DC doesn't want clothes bought for him for Christmas because he is very picky and has asked xH to please just buy a gift card for clothes instead because we've had stuff in the past that then can't be returned because it's not been bought here - DC got pretty upset when ExH insisted that he wanted to buy clothes and put it pretty bluntly to ExH that unwanted gifts are not a nice thing to receive.)

Interesting how he can afford all these lovely holidays but not maintenance for his child's day to day needs innit.

Ask yourself honestly: if you knew you would definitely get DC back after a holiday with their dad (with or without OW), would you let them go? If the answer is yes, then you're not a bitch, royal or otherwise.

Sorry Meerka - yes I have explained and DC accepts it - but it doesn't stop upset when the carrot is dangled.

Annie - I would let him go if I knew for definite. Nothing, not one single thing, that ExH has done since this all started tells me he is trustworthy. He's not done one decent thing, of if he has acted decently it has been only temporary turning back to threats and nastiness when he hasn't got what he wanted.

Hold on.

You are under NO obligations for any of this are you? this is not court sanctioned?

Your child is getting NOTHING out of any of this, and in fact is being regularly upset, hurt, disappointed and manipulated.

All the while you have had no help with any of this.

Stop all contact. It's not in your child's best interest and he's being used to hurt YOU. Your child is being abused by this vile excuse for a 'dad' so that YOU are hurt too.

I was going to go along with everything that Lweji said, but IMO, its gone way past that.

Withdraw your team.

You have tried, he has failed.

Do not allow any contact until he is prepared to behave like a human being. He has to behave like a human to YOU, MummaBear, first, before you let him near your cub.

got that? (((HUG)))

I'd have the age appropriate conversation with your DS too, and tell him about acceptable ways of behaviour towards your kids and that you BOTH need to see this man adhere to common decent boundaries before allowing him any more space in your lives.

None of this is court sanctioned. He tried for custody in the wrong jurisdiction - and used a pack of lies to try to gain jurisdiction. Took a year for the judge to realise she'd made a mistake in thinking she had jurisdiction.

I withdrew my team after the last time he started mucking about with visitation but refusing to actually go to court - it cost hundreds of pounds for nothing.

I've tried to keep up contact because he still has me scared I suppose and I don't want to come across as one of those parents who cause intractable hostility - but yes, DC doesn't really get anything out of it.

The last time we really got into it I got hit with threats of proving how insane I am - which is utterly laughable - why did he leave me with DC in the first place?

I'm being pretty silly really, reading this thread back, questioning my refusal for anything more than e-mail contact. I think the next time DC gets an e-mail I'll ask if they he wants to reply and if the answer is no I'll not encourage him to do the opposite. I've been told that before by me now ex lawyer too - to ask if he wants to reply and if the answer is no to support DC in that - but like I said, I think he still has me scared that one day he's going to waltz into court and show me for being the vindictive, psychotic, unsuitable parent he says I am.

What an arse your ex is.

Sorry not in the least bit helpful, but don't let him cast you in role of baddie.

There y'go then. You're not a bitch of any flavour. It's official!

Still sucks though. Obviously it makes you feel bad to deny your child these promised treats (which may or may not be delivered, but in any case would come at an unimaginably high price to his future). ExH knows this. He is using your love for your child as a stick to beat you with. That's not exactly good role model behaviour.

X-posted with your update. Yes, you are doing the right, the only sensible thing. Basically, if your ex believed he had any chance of getting his way in a UK court he'd have been there by now instead of trying to sort it out from overseas, all this mucking about pretending he was going to etc. As you rightly point out, if he believed his precious dc was living with a madwoman he'd move heaven and earth to get the poor mite out of there, instead of ringing/emailing her to call her mad. It's all bull. But hurtful bull.

I think he still has me scared that one day he's going to waltz into court and show me for being the vindictive, psychotic, unsuitable parent he says I am.

But you AREN'T. So let him fill his boots, let him haul you into court and just smirk at his attempts. EVERYONE'LL see through it all.
He won't because he knows this.

He is only saying this because he thinks it's what you most fear.

The TRUTH will set YOU free! :)

Stop actively encouraging contact if your DS isn't bothered. Tell DS that it's OK to let go if he wants to, and that you are there to help and support him in his decisions, not force him to do things he doesn't want to and that don't actually benefit him.

You and DS are the team. Be that team.

My ex is a twat. He even woke me up at 2.30am to request my presence to ASK me not to call him a twat.

I used to listen to his conversations with DS on speakerphone and anytime he tried the manipulation, the call would be ended. Same with skype. If he started having a go at DS about anything, OFF.

I've asked him NOT to discipline DS, as he's never had any role in parenting him as he's too lazy, so not to start with it. He didn't listen so Actions speak louder than Words. End the call, don't reply to emails unless they are polite, respectable and kind. Ditto Skype.

My ex had random 'relatives' over onetime he wanted to skype, asked them to say hello to DS. We'd lived there over 3 years and never met any of them, but here was Ex, inviting them to look into MY kitchen talking to MY son on Skype, without so much as a by your leave. Ended that call there and then.

I will not have my DS disrespected by a twat of a man, nor will I allow him to be manipulated by adults (my mother included) they deal with me unless they can be trusted.

Funny you should say that - when we were trying to arrange Skype I said there and then that it wasn't a tool for the OW and her children to peer into my home (he Skyped a couple of times before but insisted on doing it from his phone in his car - signal was always crap) He blew up at that but I refuse to have the woman who merrily encouraged him to dump his family and leave them homeless and who seemingly has no problems with the fact that he contributes nothing to DC's life play the doting stepmother with DC - if she loves him that much she'd be stepping on ExH to be an actual responsible parent. It all seems so fake and dysfunctional and I don't want DC to think that this is how you treat people - out of sight out of mind but put on a nice show when it's convenient - though in fairness to her god knows what he's told her.

I find Skype SO intrusive when we have to deal with arseholes like that. I used to tell him to switch his camera off and would refuse to have mine on or stay out of range.

Trust your instincts! (((HUG)))

I don't think I would find it intrusive if he wasn't so abusive. Maybe I'll let DC do it when he's old enough to hold his own and has been around a mainly reasonable-functioning set of relationships long enough to realise when his dad is pulling crap and can call him out on it?

My child is 7, he knows his dad's treatment of me/im wasn't right.

Age appropriate truth. You have to.

He's his son, there's evidence of genetic traits, so if you enable so much as an 'A' for Abuser, it may validate something somewhere.

My son's clear on equality, fairness, kindness and the importance of family.

You have to have the conversation now, low level, not high pressure, but drip feed it to him about how it's acceptable live and treat people.

My ds dad left when ds was about 5, I chose to be age appropriate honest with him.

He knows the score pretty much, although not details.

I don't want him growing up hero worshipping an abusive male. I want him to see him for who he really is and know that if a man treats his family as he did, it can't be allowed to continue.

Our sons have to learn how to be men from us. Not from the men that spawned them.

DS dad no longer has internet access so can't Skype. I'm glad. I have to call him, so unless it's important, I don't.

DS doesn't ask to call anymore. We used to try a lot, but he'd have his phone off for days, wouldn't text etc. I warned ex that he's lose ds, but as the only person important to Ex is Ex, he didn't do anything about it.