Toxic Family and Christmas

[theeverydaydancer]

After a lifetime's worth of misery I decided to go pretty much completely no contact with my toxic parents in September this year. I feel this has been one of the best decisions of my life and wish I had done it years and years ago. The only contact I have with them now is the occasional times that they come have a day with my DD who they may take out somewhere or have her overnight.

My mum has been badgering me about what my plans are for Christmas. I've been really blunt with her this morning - saying I won't be spending any time with them over the holidays, that I don't want any presents and that my plans are none of her business.

She has come back saying I should have more respect for "my old mother" which just makes me think all the times she has shown me a total lack of respect.

Don't really know the point of this thread other than just to vent.

She is sending me texts saying things like "before you started counselling I used to have a lovely daughter and now I have a monster". She has said that I have demons inside me.

How old is your DD? Are they ok with her?

It might make sense to go fully non-contact, if they still can't respect your boundaries.

My DD is just over 2 years old. I have thought about going completely no contact and when I first cut ties in September they didn't seen DD for about a month. I just thought maybe I was being a bit mean to deprive them of seeing their grandchild.

Treasure those demons. They are your best friends.

That's just your conditioning talking.

Your daughter is not a commodity, to be dispensed for the fulfilment of others. She is an individual and your first duty is to protect her.

So ask yourself: will they damage her (directly, or by undermining or bad-mouthing you)? Then decide if it is in her best interests to have a relationship with them.

Generally though, toxic people are just that - toxic. They poison those around them, often unintentionally (or at least without seeing what they are doing) and their "love" for the person doesn't stop it happening, either. I find it hard to see how they could be so bad for you yet good to her.

"too toxic for you, too toxic for your children".

Also, Im going to quote something from the bible. " honour thy father and mother. Parents, drive not thy children to distraction" (Paul).

Something that somehow, strangely, many toxic parents tend to forget. Funny that, isnt it? Just food for thought

You're definitely not being mean by depriving them of their grandchild. Being a grandparent is a privilege, not a right. And if they are toxic then you have to consider that, in order to protect your DD, you may have to go completely NC.

It's difficult, I'm in a similar position with a relative at the moment, but I think you're going to have to think about whether or not you actually want your DD to be exposed to behaviour like that.....

In an ideal world I think I would like to have nothing to do with them at all. Whenever my mum has spent time with my DD she always has to make some sort of comment when she drops her off about how DD has told her how much she loves her grandparents that she doesn't want to come home to me which I'm abit about because she is only 2 and her language skills are not that great. I also know I provide a very happy life at our home for our DD, so I just see as a thing my mum does to undermine me. She also keeps telling me that I am unhappy, that I'm lonely, that I have mental health issues, I have demons, the list goes on and on. My counselling sessions have given me the confidence to say actually no, I'm not mad and that like Annie said, they are actually my friends as they are telling me that I am not happy about things.

DD has told her how much she loves her grandparents that she doesn't want to come home to me
fuck that, one whiff of that crap would have me go NC at once.
it is emotional abuse of your little one do you realise that?

"I just thought maybe I was being a bit mean to deprive them of seeing their grandchild".

No, that is really your inbuilt conditioning talking. Also societal convention can play a role here too.

It is important to keep in mind that if they are too toxic for you to deal with, they are FAR too toxic for your vulnerable and defenceless children. Toxic parents do not make for being good grandparents, she is already badmouthing you as a parent to your child. Do not allow that to keep happening!. Boundaries need to be strengthened here as well as maintained.

Many adult children of toxic parents feel torn between their parents’ (and society’s) expectation that grandparents will have access to their grandkids, and their own unfortunate first hand knowledge that their parents are emotionally/physically/sexually abusive, or just plain too difficult to have any kind of healthy relationship with.

The children’s parents may allow the grandparents to begin a relationship with their children, hoping that things will be different this time, that their parents have really changed, and that their children will be emotionally and physically safer than they themselves were.

Unfortunately, this is rarely the case, because most abusive people have mental disorders of one kind or another, and many of these disorders are lifelong and not highly treatable. (Others are lifelong and treatable; however, many people never seek the necessary help.)

The well-intentioned parent ends up feeling mortified for having done more harm than good by hoping things would somehow be different — instead of having a child who simply never knew their grandparents and who was never mistreated, they have an abused child who is now also being torn apart by the grief involved in having to sever a lifelong relationship with the unhealthy people they are very attached to.

No contact is precisely that, if your mother cannot behave then she gets to see neither of you.

You do not have demons within you, your mother instead does. She is basically projecting all her toxic crap onto you and is not above using your child to do this either.

also, dancer, where/what are comments like that leading to?

Excellent post Atilla, bang on

listen to Atilla!

i've been no-contact with my mother for about 6 years. she was also banned from seeing my daughter, as i knew that she would subject her to all the passive-aggressive 'it's such a shame that mummy doesn't love me any more' pity-flavoured bullshit that is her speciality.

my daughter is thirteen and understands that she doesn't see that nanny because nanny isn't a healthy person and would not be trusted to keep her safe.

you don't owe your parents anything, not even a grandchild. cut the toxicity out of your life altogether and reap the rewards.

incidentally, my siblings have also cut my mother off so she no longer sees any of her children or grandchildren. we consider this to be a reasonable exchange for our peace of mind and mental health.

Nigella - well I think the comments are meant to undermine me and is quite manipulative. Perhaps she has eyes on trying to take my DD off me, I don't know.

I do find the whole going completely NC quite compelling because they do have such a negative effect on my mental health. She is continuing to text me this morning asking what I'm doing for christmas and what present I want even though I've told her I don't want anything and I won't be telling her anything about what we're doing.

NC for you but not your DD, that must be awkward as she gets older and your Ps give her their version. 'Demons' in you, how will she talk about you to DD?

I haven't experienced this OP but I don't see how much good maintaining contact will do you or DD ultimately. Already you are being leaned on for more than you are comfortable with. If your DD is told you are a bad mummy later on what damage will that wreak..

my thoughts exactly dancer!(great minds and all that)
also why the fuck is she texting you? it is just such a passive aggressive communication means, isnt it? why not simply (gasp!) talk?
is it possible to get a new phone or would be it be too difficult to change your number?
really i would just get rid if she is affecting how you feel mentally.

You know why she wants to know what you're doing for Christmas. So she can tell you how rubbish your ideas are and complain to others about how X stupid thing is more important to you than a lovely family Christmas with your dear old mum . She wants to know what you want for Christmas so she can either get you (a) something you don't want, (b) nothing at all, or (c) the thing you do want accompanied by a side order of "and this is the gratitude I get".

Just because somebody gave birth to you (their choice, you weren't in a position to have a say!) does not mean you owe them your immortal soul. ok I tell my boys it does

If she's telling you you have mental health issues, you're unhappy (god, people telling you what you are or arent makes me so allergic to them) you have demons, you're lonely etc etc .... Just how long before she starts giving your daughter some version of that about you?

Do you trust her to be neutral and decent about you?

Yes she will emotionally abuse your daughter - she did it to her own, why on earth do you think she wouldn't??

Yes she will do that by trying to manipulate your daughter's feelings about you - two birds with one stone! She'll tell your DD that she loves her more than Mummy does. She'll pump your DD for information about your home life if you continue trying to keep her out. She'll try her best to undermine your authority and your bond with your DD. In short, she'll fuck up her life the same way she's fucked up yours, and try and ruin your mother-daughter relationship in the same way she made sure your feelings about your own mum were one big bag of headfuck.

How can you say that going not contact with this person was 'The best decision of your life' and then happily set up the same contact for your impressionable daughter to have to deal with?!

I said this on another thread the other day: there has been more than one thread recently about women BITTERLY regretting not cutting contact with their own toxic parents when their children were still of an age to be under control. Maintain this contact, and when you see your lovely 12 year old DD start spouting her Granny's vile poison at you and telling you how much she hates you and what Granny told her about you was right all along, then it'll be TOO LATE.

CUT CONTACT FOR YOUR DD'S EMOTIONAL WELLBEING.

Why are you letting this woman have contact with your daughter when you've cut ties yourself? Can you answer this with regards your daughter's well-being as opposed to your mother's?

I can't see how you've gone No Contact if you are still hearing from her and on the receiving end of her hectoring questions.

DD has told her how much she loves her grandparents that she doesn't want to come home to me

Say to your mother, "Did she say that in French, because she sure as hell couldn't say it in English!"

I went nc with my mother in march. I had my second baby in june. I came under massive pressure to kiss and make up, mostly because my mother was missing my older daughter - I have been uninvited from wider family holidays and gatherings but this advice above

Your daughter is not a commodity, to be dispensed for the fulfilment of others. She is an individual and your first duty is to protect her.

Really hit home. I will protect my children from the narcissistic bullying and negative influences whoch have had such an effect on me. I had two years of therapy (and now beginning another block) whoch helped me to identify why I had no confidence or self esteem. I don't recognise who I was for so so many years.

Imperial