Do you 'need' anyone?

[Heartofgoldheadofcabbage]

Had a big row with other half. He made comment regards my sister (was going through a difficult time) and made a throw away comment " she needs a man to keep things on the straight and narrow" or words to that effect.

Now my OH puts his foot in his mouth regularly and sometimes blurts things out without thinking and with an apparent complete lack of sensitivity. But after 4 years together I understand him and his frustration at sometimes trying to find the right thing to say in difficult situations. I get frustrated at having to explain appropriate-ness. Truth be known I just wish he was more emotionaly intelligent.

Anyway we had a massive row and I have pretty much been silent and moody since ( I would say contemplating! ). I was trying to get across my POV that nobody 'needs' anyone...I want him, love him, and choose to be with him. He cannot belive I said (shouted!) that I dont need him and noone 'needs' anyone.

I genuinely belive that noone needs anyone...is this normal? Is my view to extreme? Would appreciate some feedback. I have a lot of thoughts going round in my head and wondering if crap from my past is the reason I feel this strongly about 'need' vs 'want'?
TY

If you don't need anyone, and are with someone because you want them and love them, then you are on to something good. Needing other people is something that the insecure do, and it leads to often fragile or volatile relationships, since no other person can fill one's own emotional gaps.

That said, I would ask yourself just why you reacted so strongly to your husband's words. You are right on the substance, yes, but your reaction was extreme. Do you know why that is?

It's a very tough one. I do think that I need my DP. I find this fact very scary Could I live without him? Yes. Would my life continue without him? Yes. And yet I do feel that I need the support he gives me, the love and affection he gives me every day, knowing that he is on my side (particularly when I feel that my family are against me) gives me strength. Don't get me wrong - there are times when he drives me crackers, but overall I rely on him a lot and I do feel that I 'need' him and our relationship. There would be a huge hole in my life without him.

It's taken me ages to be able to accept this though, because of what you describe as 'crap from my past' My parents have a bloody horrible marriage and my mum has drummed it into me and my sister that men will always let you down and that being in a relationship will always end in disaster. While we both rejected that on the surface, the scars of that kind of emotional abuse run very deep.

It is very scary to think that you need someone, because admitting that makes you vulnerable straight away. I don't know if it's something you would be interested in, but psychotherapy is helping me hugely to see the unhealthy stuff I learned from my parents and to unpick it all so I can become my own person.

I certainly need people. I need my friends and family and my various gentlemen callers. Not in a clingy, possessive, 'I'll die if I don't see you for five minutes' kind of way but I miss them when we're apart & I feel more energised when we're together. When Kirsty asks guests how they'd cope on a Desert Island, I always think I'd fade away if I had no-one to interact with.

I don't take issue with needing particular people, but I'd have been v v pissed off with the inference your husband was making that a woman without a man is lacking in some way - straight and narrow FFS.

I understand your attitude but like cogito there are people I need.

Depends what you mean by need.

Obviously you need other people otherwise you'd have no food, water, electricity... but I'm guessing that's not what you mean.

You won't die if you don't have anyone significant in your life, that's true, but 'need' is about more than not being able to physically survive/function without someone.

I could survive without my kids in my life but it would utterly break me to the point where there would be no meaning to my life. I could carry on day to day plodding along without my husband but I would be awfully lonely and unhappy.

So I suppose beyond needing other human beings in the world in order to have your survival needs met, the only reason you 'need' people in your life is if not having them in it would make you so intolerably miserable that your quality of life would be zero. You could argue that that is a want rather than a need because you won't die if you don't have it. But that's a really extreme interpretation of want v need.

I forgot practical needs like financial, caring, medical ....

FWIW I think, sadly, some people do 'need' a partner of some kind for their own sense of self-worth. They can't abide being single for any length of time. They see independence as very scary . They are unfussy who the partner is as long as they have one. This 'need' to be with someone often clouds their judgement and can be quite destructive as it is easily exploited.

'FWIW I think, sadly, some people do 'need' a partner of some kind for their own sense of self-worth. '

I agree Cogito. I have a friend who is staying in a marriage with a man who has been repeatedly unfaithful because, to quote her, 'I just can't be on my own' i.e. without a man in her life. It's so sad - she has so much going for her but feels inadequate without a man (even a cheating scumbag).

Obviously the statement that this particular woman needs a man to 'stay on the straight and narrow' places the woman in the position of a dog on a leash.... in need of controlling. If he feels that women are generally things to be controlled that would be very worrying. However, I can certainly point to people who, left to their own devices, are a liability or just totally lacking in confidence ... male as well as female incidentally ... and they certainly need some sort of 'mentor' (not necessarily a partner) to help them navigate life.

I totally take exception to that comment he made. I don't see why no-one else has picked up on it.

He said she needs a man...

What an appallingly sexist thing to infer, that it matters not which man, but that any man would sort out her life for her...

If this is the kind of thing you are talking about when you refer to him saying inappropriate things I think I'd be less concerned with his lack of emotional intelligence and more concerned about his fundamental views about women.

X post with cog.

But also I would like to say that having needs fulfilled by a partner is different to needing a partner, subtly but importantly different.

I think you should not ever feel you need a partner, having one may be an easy fix for your own problems, of course people mostly benefit from human interaction but if you feel you need a partner I'd suggest what you really needed was to work on your own self esteem, self respect and life skills.

DH complained to me once before we were married when drunk that I didn't need him. I was a very independent lass.

So now I need him to put the bins out, bring me a cup of tea in bed and administer medicines when I can't be bothered to get out of bed.

But whilst I agree that I'd still be a whole person without him, I do need him for support and companionship and I need to share my life with him as it would feel emptier without him.

So maybe it depends on what you mean by need.

I think we need people plural. I think it can be unwise to need a particular individual.

Humans are a social species. Very few of us have the necessary psyche to cope in social isolation. Our relationships with friends, family, colleagues etc are what define us to a large extent. The presence of those relationships, when positive, have a strong bearing on someone's mental health, and their absence can mean the difference with coping with a mental illness and going under in some cases.

We all need people in our lives.

I think in the past, before the nuclear family became the dominant social building block, peoples relationships were probably less intense on an individual level but broader. I also think this particularly affects women.

In the past, many women had a network of female support to call on from their mother, MIL, sisters, etc because of the extended family norm. Men also had that but they also had, and continue to have, social groups outside of the family. As the nuclear family has taken precedence, women have become more isolated because they've lost that extended network and have taken on all the subsequent responsibility for . Even on MN how many times do we have posts from SAHMs whose DH/DP is out with his golf/pub/work mates on a saturday while she's at home with the DC etc.

Of course, in some cases we have SAHDs and not everyone had a good extended famil - for some women losing the MIL has been a blessing - but I'm talking about social norms as a group, not individual cases.

So I think for many women society has actively encouraged them to need just one person - their DH/DP. Isn't that what the spin is about "the one" etc? And, if you're lucky enough to meet the right person and have a good, healthy relationship, that "needing" someone can work out quite well.

Ironically, as people age, I think it tends to reverse. As children grow up, women seem to broaden their network, often through their children, while men can often find on retirement that theirs has dwindled to nothing.

Hi All and thanks for your responses.

To clarify OH does not have a sexist, 'chest beating' 'Me man you woman' type bone in his body. He is a people pleaser and loves me completely and utterly. Probably too soft and soppy and puts up with a lot of crap from me! People have taken advantage of him in the past to the point of abusing him.

I know that to him he 'needs' me. When we met he was in a dark place, past relationships (so called friends and partners) had been exploitative and abusive.I took a chance on him as there were a lot of red flags for my liking but 4 years later we are in a very good place.

The 'crap' in my past I refer to is a drunk abusive ex, an OCD mummy's boy ex, large family some of whom either ignore me or blame me for whatever is going wrong in their lives, sexual abuse, job I hate but the salary and security are seductive, friends who have taken advantage of my good nature etc etc.

I spent 10+ years single and yes I am very independent person...and self sufficient.

I do protect myself emotionally and financially...I did not think I would physically or mentally survived when my first relationship ended (drunk who beat me and I spent the whole relationship trying to fix him and forgive him!...until he dumped me!)

Sorry for the epic!!! I think I am answering my OP.

I think we need to sit down have have one of those conversations where I try to explain what I know I shouted during our row..."I love you, want you and could not bare to be without you...BUT I NEED NO-ONE"

I do not 'need' anyone. Everyone is in my life because I want them there and love them in one form or another. I also try not to have anyone in my life who 'needs' me.

Honestly, sounds like you are making excuses for him there.

There are alarm bells all over your description. Like you have perhaps picked a fixer upper because it gives you assurance that he will not have power over you but that very fact is giving him control, because he is so needy and insecure, I don't know but he may well get to dictate much of the terms of the relationship (like he is now).

He said your friend needs a man. I think there are no excuses for that, it's an appallingly sexist thing to say and I'd be reconsidering my view of him as not a misogynist if I were you. Common mistake to mix up lack of confidence/self esteem in a man with them not being misogynistic.

Your sister sorry!

I think your position is totally correct btw with respect to needing someone. People have needs and often those needs can't be met by them alone, but that is completely different to being dependent/needy and needing a partner/relationship.

Have you really established what it is he meant by your sister needs a man to keep her on the straight and narrow? Also whether his insult at your feelings is because he feels emasculated by the idea that you don't feel he is keeping you on the "straight and narrow"?

Just strikes me as strange that he said that particular thing and that he is so attached to the idea that you should feel you need him.

Also concerned about what you describe as his foot in mouth syndrome - could it not equally be that the things he says are what he believes and just that you have a different perception of him than is represented by the things he says?

Honestly, sounds like you are making excuses for him there
Nope no excuses necessary.

There are alarm bells all over your description. Like you have perhaps picked a fixer upper because it gives you assurance that he will not have power over you but that very fact is giving him control, because he is so needy and insecure
Nope he has annoying points as do I. I have learnt over the years that you cannot fix anyone...you either accept (with occasional frustrations) or you move on.

I don't know but he may well get to dictate much of the terms of the relationship (like he is now)
Nope...not sure where this conclusion came from? We have a great and balanced relationship. It took and takes work and sometimes loooong discussions when we have opposing ideas and opinions.

He said your friend needs a man. I think there are no excuses for that, it's an appallingly sexist thing to say and I'd be reconsidering my view of him as not a misogynist if I were you. Common mistake to mix up lack of confidence/self esteem in a man with them not being misogynistic
Had long discussion tonight. No excuse for the comment. He meant she needed someone, a partner to stick up for her. She was in a situation where he wanted to jump in and help her and defend her (my sisters love him like their own and visa versa) and she was getting upset and stressed but refused his help...or any-ones.

I think your position is totally correct btw with respect to needing someone. People have needs and often those needs can't be met by them alone, but that is completely different to being dependent/needy and needing a partner/relationship.
Thank you. As I explained in our chat tonight. Wanting and choosing to be with someone and loving someone I believe is stronger and clearer than 'needing' someone...in the way I think he thinks he 'needs' me ( and you are right he is insecure and has self esteem/confidence issues)

Have you really established what it is he meant by your sister needs a man to keep her on the straight and narrow?
Yes as above

Also whether his insult at your feelings is because he feels emasculated by the idea that you don't feel he is keeping you on the "straight and narrow"?
Couldn't understand this? Stupid comment made at 2ish am in the morning, yes...insult to my feelings, no. Keep me on the S&N...no

Just strikes me as strange that he said that particular thing and that he is so attached to the idea that you should feel you need him.
Insecurity and listening to too much Lionel Ritchie and cliches of " your the air that I breathe"! He also explained that me saying (Shouting ) that I dont need him brought back memories of it being said to him in an abusive relationship.

Also concerned about what you describe as his foot in mouth syndrome - could it not equally be that the things he says are what he believes and just that you have a different perception of him than is represented by the things he says?
Fair point. He does sometime 'parrot' what other people have said and its an ongoing thing where I have to explain why its inappropriate...its a self confidence thing mixed with not reading peoples reactions and situations...like verbal dioreah (spelling?) he will normal fill a silence with poor humour or a stupid comment when he is stressed or nervous.

We have had a chat tonight both shared our point of view. I am a little concerned at his 'romanticised' idea that he needs me. I have also elaborated that not 'needing' him but loving him and choosing and wanting to be with him should make him feel more secure as its about choice not dependency...Its so hard to put into words.

Thanks everyone for all your input!

Well... I've spent most of my adult life single, and I don't get much support in life - my parents are both dead, never been close to my sister, not many local friends.

I don't need anyone in that I am very self-reliant and independent and very used to doing things for myself, and I'm partly like that because I've been let down by people in the past.

But I think actually I probably do need someone close from time to time for better emotional health. I don't need a man or someone particular, but I do need to have friends or family around from time to time. It doesn't do me good to get too isolated. But that's needing people in general, rather than specific people. We are social animals, and though I'm used to (and now need) a lot of time a lone, I also know that too much time alone sends me back towards depression.

I'd rather be with someone who is there because they want to be, rather than they think they need me, so they're there through choice. I think if someone felt they really needed me, I'd find it a bit smothering rather than romantic. So I think I mostly agree with you.

You state that your husband is emotionally unintelligent and that you do silent and moody treatment.

Perhaps you both need a course in respectful adult communication.

Good luck.

No I don't and no offence but I find relationships where one is dependent on the other in that way really quite pathetic.

Eg my dsis can't come to New York with me because it wouldn't be "fair" on her DH, they've no children, it just wouldn't be fair and it "wouldn't be the same without him". I am a lone parent with two dc with ASD I could really do with a fab break! And I would love to go with her but no she just wouldn't enjoy it without him .

Interesting thread, actually. I don't engage in romantic relationships, because I don't like them. However, I would find life more difficult if DS' father were not a presence in DS' life, to share the parenting by seeing DS at least twice a week and being available to look after DS at short notice if I have to (or want to) go and do something that I can't take DS to. I would find life less pleasant without my friends, each of whom has qualities that I don't find in just anybody, whether that's a practical sklll or the ability to make me laugh.

He meant she needed someone, a partner to stick up for her. She was in a situation where he wanted to jump in and help her and defend her (my sisters love him like their own and visa versa) and she was getting upset and stressed but refused his help...or any-ones.

Yes, because sometimes it is important to manage your own emotions and to feel in control of a situation, even if other people think you are not coping and you 'need' help. In such a situation, it really does depend how the support is offered; it can be undermining, as much as supportive. The implication of the above statement is that she couldn't defend herself, she needed a man to do it. Whereas maybe she just needed a bit of understanding as to why she was stressed and upset, not someone wanting to fix it.