if my dh cannot even be civil to my dm i don't think i can move forward

[Fairylea]

There is so much backstory to this but essentially my mother is a functional alcoholic. She is not elderly, she is young 60s and works part time. We do not allow her to look after the dc on her own at all, although she is welcome to visit. We do not visit at hers because she has dangerous dogs.

My dm lived with me (I owned the house and paid bills) until 4 years ago (we had separate areas in the house) when I met dh and she basically went off the wall for a number of reasons... she disliked dh with a passion and didn't want him to move in, even though it was my house. So after a lot of painful arguments dh and I remortgaged my house (it had no mortgage) and we paid my mum off to move to another house 10 mins away.

So that is a short version of the history.

Because of things that have happened between usall my dh hates my dm with a passion and cannot understand why I don't just cut her out. I do understand why he is angry and yes I don't deny she was awful to him. However, a lot of what she said was in anger and fear at the time (fear of her living alone, she is divorced). She has since tried to make amends.

One of the reasons I cannot simply cut her out is because my eldest child is from a previous relationship and the grandparents are still reasonably close friends with my mum. So if I did stop contact then mum would just go through them and I'd be the evil one to everyone Iincluding my dd. Everyone thinks the sun shines out of my mums backside, no one has any idea whatsoever what she is like when she is drunk, not even dd as mum always drinks alone and in the evening.

Anyway. I try to keep contact short and away from dh, usually timing it when he is at work. We had a situation this week when he happened to come home earlier than planned and she was here. He literally went straight upstairs and hid the whole time. I was furious. My mum asked what was wrong and I made up some bullshit about him having to prepare for a meeting.

I'm not expecting him to gush over her but just being civil is not too much to ask, mainly so I don't look like I am married to a complete arsehole and so the dc do not have to suffer a bad atmosphere.

Neither of us are talking to each other now really as I am so angry with him. We have a discussion and he agrees we can't cut contact and then it goes round in circles when he does happen to see her and we argue about it all over again. I'm sick of it.

It's also awkward with things like Christmas because obviously mum wants to bring the dc stuff on Christmas day and see them open presents and dh will sit there with a face like thunder the whole time rather than just getting on with it. I am an only child and mum does not have a partner so if I do not invite her she will be home alone. She will only stay a max of an hour or so because of her dogs anyway.

I'm not expectinghim to put up with lots of contact either.. she never rings, only emails, comes round maybe once a week, usually when he's at work and for Christmas. That's it!

I really don't see how we can go forward.

We're just constantly arguing about this. Going round in circles.

I know some will say I should side with dh but I've known my mum inside out all my life and I understand why she does the things she does. We have always been there for each other. I've only been with dh 4 years. I can't just cut my mum out, I don't want to.

Please be kind. I'm very upset and know I'm perhaps wrong. I'm frustrated.

I completely understand how you feel . It's so hard to live with. You do seem like you're in an impossible situation - you don't need people like that (ahem - bitch - ahem) random coming on being all high and mighty about it .

I think you've been punished enough by your mum though, don't you? Please don't let your relationship with your dh get poisoned by her as well.

Fairy there have been lots of valid points made above and they have clearly given you food for thought. No point in going over the good advice again, but I just wanted to say that, exhausting as this situation is, you have done brilliantly over the last couple of years, in achieving a workable balance.

As an only child with a mother with MH issues, I can entirely understand how important it is to you to maintain some contact - which you have done - whilst also having some boundaries in place to protect you and your dcs - which you have done too. You are protecting your family, and have protected your home, whilst still keeping ongoing contact with your mum. In the long run, I think you will feel more at peace knowing you have done that, as long as you can maintain it and not feel pulled too hard in two directions. Al-anon will certainly help you to look after yourself and to identify if you are getting stretched too far in the middle.

Let dh take responsibility for his behaviour. You have enough on your plate. You can say to him that you would like to see your mum for one hour on Christmas Day and that you would like him to come into the room for a few minutes and say hello. But if he chooses not to, then that is his responsibility, and you do not need to make up excuses for him. Just enjoy your day - she's there to see you and the Grandkids, and doesn't have to be close to him to do that.

Once again, though, don't underestimate your achievement in keeping clear boundaries, having your lovely new family, but still having a place for your mum in your heart and at an appropriately safe place, in your life.

I don't think everyone else can think your mum is sweet and kind, since you say she has few friends. You are entitled to feel angry. Yes your mum loves you, but she has failed you in many ways. And you have an unmanageable burden in attempting to be the peacekeeper all the time. I'm not surprised your husband is angry to see that happen, he loves you and he doesn't love your mum. And why should he?

Whilst I agree with the majority of posters, I STILL think that the DH is being unreasonable if he won't let her there for an hour in Xmas without "a face like thunder".

There is a difference between enabling- which the OP is, to some extent- and basic respect to his partner.

I wouldn't want my SIL in my life as she is a paranoid alcoholic, and DH knows and accepts that. But I would never see the need to make my H uncomfortable for the odd hour here or there. I do that, as respect to HIM.

It doesn't mean I have to enable her behaviour, or tolerate abuse.

Fairy it's good to see that you were willing to question your own position in the course of this thread.

I second all the posters who have recommended Al Anon to you and encouraged you to examine your own co-dependence, and I think your husband is entitled to choose who he does and does not spend time with.

Tribpots posts are spot on.

I think you must focus on your relationship with your DH. Are you beginning to see that you are being a little bit U in expecting him to be civil to your DM?

I don't know quite how you go forwards from this but can you begin to soften your feelings towards DH in light of what posters are saying on here?

It must be incredibly hard to be stuck between but your dm is going to end up destroying your marriage to a lovely sounding man.

I think if you can somehow communicate openly and honestly with your DH then you will be able to work out a way to move forwards together with your dm. If you can do this, it may mean you changing how you behave with regards to your mum and putting your DH first a bit more.

Good luck

It may be that if your husband feels that you are more on his 'side', supporting him, in time he will chill out a bit about one hour at christmas.

If I was coming home for a few mins peaceful lunch from work and found someone who is so damn abusive in my house, I'd be very unhappy too. She may think it's water under the bridge but that midnight behaviour and verbal abuse was completely unacceptable and I can understand anyone not wanting someone like that in hteir house again, MIL or not.

I'm sorry, but you are in the relationship as equals and your husband is not there to carry you in supporting this terrible behaviour. You are in a very difficult position but your husband should come first.

I'm not sure what your mother is like but for the families of many alcoholics Christmas can be a real issue as it's a time of year when it's socially acceptable to drink too much. Which, for many alcoholics, is free license to hit the bottle in the morning and get absolutely shit-faced by lunchtime. And given your mother's tendency to get aggressive when drunk I can understand his reticence.

This may not necessarily be the way that you would deal with this situation, but I'd not choose to share a family Christmas with someone who a) I know is aggressive when drunk and b) in a situation where she'll be drinking. At least, not again. I've been there, I've done that, and I'd move heaven and earth to ensure my children won't be exposed to that bullshit again.

Al Anon (which is, just to be clear, separate from Alcoholics Anonymous. Al Anon is for friends and families of alcoholics) can help. But I think that some one-to-one counselling for you might help you more. The anger you feel for your mother's inability to be the parent she should have been is entirely normal and justified. But at the same time you know there's no point expressing that anger at her so it's just festering inside you. A good counsellor will help you be able to deal with this in a constructive way.

There's a really good book called "Codependent No More" written by Melody Beattie. It's aimed at people like you (and me) whose lives have been heavily influenced by other people's addiction problems. I think you'll find it tough reading at times but I do think you'd get a lot out of it.

My mother is an alcoholic, keeping the peace, the rambling telephone calls for hours, the complete lack of interest in what you are doing, the next "crisis", is all utterly exhausting.

Do you actually enjoy her company, does she actually demonstrate care for you?

To be honest it sounds like your dh is trying, but your mum isn't prepared to do the same - and it sounds like she never has had to with you prepared to make the peace.

Don't stand in the way of their relationship - they are both grown adults, they can sort it out without you it is not your problem.

Do take some time to consider your feelings and put relationships in context, it is painful thinking that I did more mothering to my mum than she ever showed me.

Thank you for the replies. I've left the thread for a few days to have a think about it all.

Firstly, Christmas will not become a drinking occasion in our house. Neither dh nor I drink at all, ever and we do not have alcohol in our house. Despite mum being the old troll that she is, she does respect this and wouldn't bring drink etc. She will only be coming for a max of about an hour, probably not even staying for dinner. She worries about the dogs being left on their own for even a couple of hours! Also, as per upthread she only ever drinks in the evening anyway. Ever. She thinks (!) this makes it okay because she has a curfew that she doesn't drink until 9pm!!

Anyway....

Dh and I had a discussion and I said I didn't feel like he trusts me to deal with my mum in the way that I know how to, and I pointed out that I have already made big headway by moving her out and limiting her contact from all day everyday basically to now once a week. I also apologised to him and said that I understand the way he feels towards her and I am not expecting him to change his behaviour. I said I will do all I can to keep them apart and (as per wisdom of mumsnet) I won't force him to be around her.

So we sort of made up. Ish. There's still an uncomfortable mood really.

I have also, on the back of this, distanced myself from mum a bit. She was starting to email and text me a lot everyday again and I don't really want that so I have replied less and left more time between texts. She is visiting later today as per her weekly visit but dh is working today.

I don't really enjoy her company, I actually find it very hard to even look at her most of the time as I remember all the times she's been drunk and told me to piss off or whatever else. It's hard to look at her and not see that.

But yes there have been good times too. She can be warm and funny and caring - when she isn't in the depths of despair or drinking. Dd and ds aren't harmed by her at all because around them she is the typical doting granny, gushing, cuddling and bringing presents. Its just me, I have seen all sides to her.

I'm struggling at the moment, I'm really worn out with everything. Dh and I keep sniping at each other about everything... last night's stupid row was because I wanted to watch a particular film with him that he'd said he wanted to watch too so I waited all evening for him to stop faffing about on the pc trying to upload music (he was in the same room as me doing this) but he was getting more and more angry doing it and the atmosphere was tense and horrid, so in the end I said I was going to bed as we ran out of time to watch the film. He then assumes I am in a huff and we are back to not speaking really again.

I know he's also feeling a bit down because we just don't have much sex anymore. I just don't have the desire for it much at the moment what with feeling so tired and arguing over mum and stress with everything. I don't know how couples can argue about things and then feel like being intimate again. It makes me want to isolate myself. Dh doesn't understand that because he's a very physical person so touch and sex are part of reconnecting after a disagreement and making up. Not for me.

It's all so fucking hard.

You've had lots of good advice here.

Despite what you say about your mother's bad behaviour, what comes across to me in your posts is that you seem to see your DH as the problem, or the difficult one here, not your mother. Of course, it is the other way around.

And, a lot of the anger he is feeling is likely to be anger on your behalf at what you have had to go through, and not just the way your mother has directly treated him (which is what you concentrate on). I expect he has fears that you will stay under your mother's influence (you say you can't cut contact because of how she will turn her friends and DD's grandparents against you, for example), not to mention concerns about your DS coming into contact with this damaged person.

She's capable of vile behaviour that could rear its head at any time, you don't enjoy her company. Time to dial down the contact, if only for a while to let you get things back on track with your DH.