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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

"But We Took You To Stately Homes!" - Survivors of Dysfunctional Families

999 replies

DontstepontheMomeRaths · 23/08/2013 16:00

Thread opener here: webaunty.co.uk/mumsnet/
You may need to right-click and 'unblock' it after downloading it.

It's August 2013, and the Stately Home is still open to visitors.

Forerunning threads:
December 2007
March 2008
August 2008
February 2009
May 2009
January 2010
April 2010
August 2010
March 2011
November 2011
January 2012
November 2012
January 2013
March 2013

Please check later posts in this thread for links & quotes. The main thing is: "they did do it to you" - and you can recover.


Welcome to the Stately Homes Thread.

This is a long running thread which was originally started up by 'pages' see original thread here (December 2007)

So this thread originates from that thread and has become a safe haven for Adult children of abusive families.

One thing you will never hear on this thread is that your abuse or experience was not that bad. You will never have your feelings minimised the way they were when you were a child, or now that you are an adult. To coin the phrase of a much respected past poster Ally90;

'Nobody can judge how sad your childhood made you, even if you wrote a novel on it, only you know that. I can well imagine any of us saying some of the seemingly trivial things our parents/ siblings did to us to many of our real life acquaintances and them not understanding why we were upset/ angry/ hurt etc. And that is why this thread is here. It's a safe place to vent our true feelings, validate our childhood/ lifetime experiences of being hurt/ angry etc by our parents behaviour and to get support for dealing with family in the here and now.'

Most new posters generally start off their posts by saying; but it wasn't that bad for me or my experience wasn't as awful as x,y or z's. 

Some on here have been emotionally abused and/ or physically abused. Some are not sure what category (there doesn't have to be any) they fall into.

NONE of that matters. What matters is how 'YOU' felt growing up, how 'YOU' feel now and a chance to talk about how and why those childhood experiences and/ or current parental contact, has left you feeling damaged, falling apart from the inside out and stumbling around trying to find your sense of self-worth. 

You might also find the following links and information useful, if you have come this far and are still not sure whether you belong here or not.

<a class="break-all" href="http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/0553814826/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&linkCode=as2&camp=1634&creative=19450&creativeASIN=0553814826&tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-relationships-1834279-But-We-Took-You-To-Stately-Homes-Survivors-of-Dysfunctional-Families" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">'Toxic Parents' by Susan Forward.</a>

I started with this book and found it really useful.

Here are some excerpts:

"Once you get going, most toxic parents will counterattack. After all, if they had the capacity to listen, to hear, to be reasonable, to respect your feelings, and to promote your independence, they wouldn't be toxic parents. They will probably perceive your words as treacherous personal assaults. They will tend to fall back on the same tactics and defences that they have always used, only more so.

Remember, the important thing is not their reaction but your response. If you can stand fast in the face of your parents' fury, accusations, threats and guilt-peddling, you will experience your finest hour.

Here are some typical parental reactions to confrontation:

"It never happened". Parents who have used denial to avoid their own feelings of inadequacy or anxiety, will undoubtedly use it during confrontation, to promote their version of reality. They'll insist that your allegations never happened, or that you're exaggerating. They won't remember, or they will accuse you of lying.

YOUR RESPONSE: Just because you don't remember, doesn't mean it didn't happen".

"It was your fault." Toxic parents are almost never willing to accept responsibility for their destructive behaviour. Instead, they will blame you. They will say that you were bad, or that you were difficult. They will claim that they did the best that they could but that you always created problems for them. They will say that you drove them crazy. They will offer as proof, the fact that everybody in the family knew what a problem you were. They will offer up a laundry list of your alleged offences against them.

YOUR RESPONSE: "You can keep trying to make this my fault, but I'm not going to accept the responsibility for what you did to me, when I was a child".

"I said I was sorry what more do you want?" Some parents may acknowledge a few of the things that you say but be unwilling to do anything about it.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate your apology, but that is just a beginning. If you're truly sorry, you'll work through this with me, to make a better relationship."

"We did the best we could." Some parents will remind you of how tough they had it while you were growing up and how hard they struggled. They will say such things as "You'll never understand what I was going through," or "I did the best I could". This particular style of response will often stir up a lot of sympathy and compassion for your parents. This is understandable, but it makes it difficult for you to remain focused on what you need to say in your confrontation. The temptation is for you once again to put their needs ahead of your own. It is important that you be able to acknowledge their difficulties, without invalidating your own.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I understand that you had a hard time, and I'm sure that you didn't hurt me on purpose, but I need you to understand that the way you dealt with your problems really did hurt me"

"Look what we did for you." Many parents will attempt to counter your assertions by recalling the wonderful times you had as a child and the loving moments you and they shared. By focusing on the good things, they can avoid looking at the darker side of their behaviour. Parents will typically remind you of gifts they gave you, places they took you, sacrifices they made for you, and thoughtful things they did. They will say things like, "this is the thanks we get" or "nothing was ever enough for you."

YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate those things very much, but they didn't make up for ...."

"How can you do this to me?" Some parents act like martyrs. They'll collapse into tears, wring their hands, and express shock and disbelief at your "cruelty". They will act as if your confrontation has victimized them. They will accuse you of hurting them, or disappointing them. They will complain that they don't need this, they have enough problems. They will tell you that they are not strong enough or healthy enough to take this, that the heartache will kill them. Some of their sadness will, of course, be genuine. It is sad for parents to face their own shortcomings, to realise that they have caused their children significant pain. But their sadness can also be manipulative and controlling. It is their way of using guilt to try to make you back down from the confrontation.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I'm sorry you're upset. I'm sorry you're hurt. But I'm not willing to give up on this. I've been hurting for a long time, too."

Helpful Websites

<a class="break-all" href="http://www.alice-miller.com/index_en.php" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Alice Miller</a>

<a class="break-all" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personality_disorder" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Personality Disorders definition</a>

More helpful links:

<a class="break-all" href="http://www.daughtersofnarcissisticmothers.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Daughters of narcissistic mothers</a>
<a class="break-all" href="http://outofthefog.net/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Out of the FOG</a>
<a class="break-all" href="http://www.vachss.com/av_dispatches/disp_9408_a.html" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">You carry the cure in your own heart</a>
<a class="break-all" href="http://www.havoca.org/HAVOCA_home.htm" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Help for adult children of child abuse</a>
<a class="break-all" href="http://www.pete-walker.com/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Pete Walker</a>

Some books:

<a class="break-all" href="http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/0749910542/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&linkCode=as2&camp=1634&creative=19450&creativeASIN=0749910542&tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-relationships-1834279-But-We-Took-You-To-Stately-Homes-Survivors-of-Dysfunctional-Families" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Homecoming</a>
<a class="break-all" href="http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/1439129436/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&linkCode=as2&camp=1634&creative=19450&creativeASIN=1439129436&tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-relationships-1834279-But-We-Took-You-To-Stately-Homes-Survivors-of-Dysfunctional-Families" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Will I ever be good enough?</a>
<a class="break-all" href="http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/0060929324/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&linkCode=as2&camp=1634&creative=19450&creativeASIN=0060929324&tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-relationships-1834279-But-We-Took-You-To-Stately-Homes-Survivors-of-Dysfunctional-Families" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">If you had controlling parents</a>
<a class="break-all" href="http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/0385304234/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&linkCode=as2&camp=1634&creative=19450&creativeASIN=0385304234&tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-relationships-1834279-But-We-Took-You-To-Stately-Homes-Survivors-of-Dysfunctional-Families" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">When you and your mother can't be friends</a>
<a class="break-all" href="http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/1572245611/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&linkCode=as2&camp=1634&creative=19450&creativeASIN=1572245611&tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-relationships-1834279-But-We-Took-You-To-Stately-Homes-Survivors-of-Dysfunctional-Families" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Children of the self-absorbed</a>
<a class="break-all" href="http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/0671701355/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&linkCode=as2&camp=1634&creative=19450&creativeASIN=0671701355&tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum-relationships-1834279-But-We-Took-You-To-Stately-Homes-Survivors-of-Dysfunctional-Families" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Recovery of your inner child</a>

This final quote is from smithfield posting as therealsmithfield: 

"I'm sure the other posters will be along shortly to add anything they feel I have left out. I personally don't claim to be sorted but I will say my head has become a helluva lot straighter since I started posting here. You will receive a lot of wisdom but above all else the insights and advice given will 'always' be delivered with warmth and support."

Happy Posting
OP posts:
pumpkinsweetie · 23/11/2013 15:13

Gosh what a drama Good, can't believe someone would call the police over such issues Shock

Why can't she buy one of those plug-in stick on doorbells ? Instead of relying on the world & his wife to fix her broken doorbell! And then devoid all responsibilty from herself!

Pil are much like this, if something in their home goes wrong the responsibility always falls on a neighbour, a neighbours neighbour, or dh. When quite simply it is their problem. dh ignores their calls & texts about diy/heating etc now, possibly because not only did he become their slave for almost a year a few years back but also because of the hassle from me he will get if he gives in as he does bugger all in his own homeConfused. He never got so much of a thanks or a cuppa tea for helping them either & the bloke next door to them became roped into every diy venture they had for free Shock!!! Poor bloke think he was too scared to say noGrin

Just the other week mil text dh to say a few tiles had come off the roof, wtaf did she expect him to do about itGrin, god only knows what goes through that womans head. He is scared of heights and it was raining that night!

GoodtoBetter · 23/11/2013 15:22

Well, the neighbour couldn't rouse DM cos of the doorbell, so it was sensible to call the local police and they turned the water off at the meter. But it wasn't the drama DM made it out to be.
I can't fucking stand the pathetic little me routine "I was so scared, my nerves are shot"

GoodtoBetter · 23/11/2013 15:38

Ha! Got this from Dbro just now:
"Just got a completely normal benign message from her about cricket, no mention of plumbers, policemen or drama. Therefore, it's clearly all for you, to get a reaction. She's such a freak. She obviously thjnks that we only speak when in in Spain."

TheDrugsDontWork · 23/11/2013 16:17

GoodtoBetter what a melodrama! It sounds like she enjoys the helpless act and having you run round after her.

DoYouEver welcome Smile Your problem is not a silly little one and this thread is for problems big and small anyway. Unbelievable that your parents are supporting your sister's affair but fairly typical if she's the 'golden child' and can do no wrong.

Hissy is your mother still calling?! She's not making things easy, I know, but at least you know you've made the right decision keeping your distance.

Just noticed I wrote desert not dessert. I appear to be slowly losing the ability to speak English. The other day on the phone a friend I haven't spoken to in a while said I was getting a South African accent Confused

My own mother has increased her manipulative efforts in the face of me reducing contact. It's even more obvious now though, as well as how she's using my father as her puppet. She's been telling him blatant lies, and when I told him what had actually gone on she came creeping back acting the perfect mother. She also managed to trip herself up over Christmas plans and how upset she was I'm staying here as it turns out they're on holiday anyway. Then she made a joke when I said one of my animals might have to be put down (I wouldn't have told her but she has some paperwork I need). All a bit complicated as not a 'normal' pet but she went from saying how I was so mean considering it to how I could get my other (healthy) animals put down at the same time on a 3 for 1 deal. Fucking hilarious. Not long ago I would have gone along with it, but now I just think what the fuck is wrong with her that she thinks that's ok to say.

Anyway for the first time in my life I don't have to spend Christmas with them and I'm SO relieved.

Hissy · 23/11/2013 18:20

Yes TheDrUgs she's still ringing, once a week, Saturdays.

Except for last week, when I got Saturday AND Tuesday.

She rang today, left a LONG message as it took ages from when I silenced the ring to when the phone told me i'd got a voicemail. Deleted it without listening. That's getting easier.

I've not answered a call since Aug, and not answered a text since Sept. Yet every week is an exercise in utter denial and re-writing of history.

GoodtoBetter · 23/11/2013 19:30

Blimey Hissy she's got stamina! I wish I had the balls to go NC with my mad mother, or that she'd get fed up and move back to the UK. I am so fed up of the whining and catastrophising. At least for me...happy enough to e mail dbro about the cricket. Fruitloop.

Hissy · 23/11/2013 19:40

G2B, I asked for a bit of space back in august.

So, of course i've not had it.

Everytime she engages with me and I listen to or read a message she says or writes exactly the wrong thing, or the thing i've specifically said all along NOT to do. Whenever I hear what she has to say, it reinforces why I have to do what i'm doing.

But of course it breaks my heart every time, that I have to do it in the first place.

This is not the life I wanted, expected or deserved dammit.

It's a fecking nightmare that I can't wake up from.

I can't solve it. It's not about me. It never was.

GoodtoBetter · 23/11/2013 19:49

I know, I know. NC is the only thing you can do. I can't control my mother or make her happy, I bent backwards trying and she just complained about everything and tried to destroy me and my marriage. I just have to get on with living my own life happily and try to limit my exposure to her, but it frustrates me that someone with so so so much going for her is such a fucking misery.

Hissy · 23/11/2013 19:58

But she's only a misery to you.. Dbro doesn't get the wailing stuff, does he?

GoodtoBetter · 23/11/2013 20:10

He gets a bit of gentle whinging when he's here, but not on the same scale at all. He doesn't get the lip trembling teary eyed crap as a whole and no histrionics. I think because she's afraid he won't come and visit any more, she's not as scared of me, cos she knows I'm only 5 mins away. Maybe I need to cut contact further. There was a while where she was on much better behaviour, after we moved out.
The weekend after next we're going away and I'll make sure to keep away from her during the week.

GoodtoBetter · 23/11/2013 20:11

and as Dbro says, it proves that it's all to guilt me about daring to dey her.

GoodtoBetter · 23/11/2013 20:11

defy

Hissy · 23/11/2013 20:37

G2B you said of Fri that you'd not had contact since the previous monday.

And then disaster...
Funny that. Are you sure she actually had the emergency?

Did she perhaps manufacture one? Funny how the doorbell worked this morning.

Funny how she only called you at 9am...

GoodtoBetter · 23/11/2013 20:58

I could see where the water had run down the street and J could see where the rubber tube had come out of place and it's something that happened about 18 months ago. J is going to sort it next week.
But, it's not like she was woken at 2am, she slept through that. I just don't understand all the drama over what actually happened.

The local police woke her to say "oh by the way, your water pipe went last night so we cut the water off as we couldn't get hold of you. You'll need a plumber". Anyone normal, would go, "oh what an arse at the weekend" not start leaving their daughter gasping, weepy messages and going on about being "frightened" and "having no one" and "not being able to cope". FFS.

It's like last week with the small leak in the false ceiling in the hall: "I'm so frightened, I don't know what to do, it'll bring the ceiling down, it's near the light, I'll lose power to the whole house..."

I do all the not responding and then seeing her less for a bit but IT GETS ON MY NERVES. Sometimes I want to shriek in her face SHUT UP YOU STUPID OLD WOMAN, YOU'RE PATHETIC!

Hissy · 23/11/2013 21:02

That's kind of what I meant, there was no drama, even when the police did manage to raise her.

You could always try the 'well if you think life's too hard out here, you could always go home' trick...

:)

GoodtoBetter · 23/11/2013 21:09

God, I wish she would.
But, I was thinking this today. If I were as fucking MISERABLE here as she claims to be, I'd leave. She could rent somewhere in the UK on her 2500 euros a month quite easily and wait for the house here to sell, which it would eventually even if she lost money. She can manage perfectly well here, she'd manage much easier in the UK. I don't know why she doesn't go. Except I do. Because I am the narcissistic supply. Where's the fun in life with nobody to whine at? She followed me thousands of miles to gate crash my life when I had the temerity to leave, she's not giving up that easily. And if she went back, she might actually be happier, god forbid.

Hissy · 23/11/2013 22:11

The way I see it is that she 'is' happy with her life, it IS meeting her needs; to ruin yours.

Why not let it slip that you're thinking of moving back..

GoodtoBetter · 23/11/2013 22:34

Ha ha ha! You're probably right! We were talking today and DH said he reckons we'd have ended up divorced as there's only so much of it he could have taken, much as he loves me. He started smoking again when we moved in with her. Stopped once we left, hasn't smoked since.

If I said that, she'd probably do some woe is me, I'm too old and infirm now and I'd never sell the house....

No, I quite enjoy revelling in how much I enjoy my life now. She doesn't like the new library building opposite the house, says it's garish. I told her I thought it was lovely. Grin

Hissy · 23/11/2013 22:55

"Well mum, if you don't like it..."

On a fecking loop!

Dare ya!

GoodtoBetter · 24/11/2013 15:20

Well, went out with her and the kids this morning as usual and not a peep about yesterday...as if it had never happened. Nutter.

AttilaTheMeerkat · 24/11/2013 16:02

GoodtoBetter

I think you need to seriously reconsider how much time you are spending with your mother at all to be honest; she is using you as narc supply along with your children as well for that matter. She is not interested in any of you; just wants to use you instead. Your mother indeed trained you well didn't she?.

Having a narcissist for a mother is a lot like living under the supervision of a six-year-old. Narcissists are always pretending, and with a narcissistic mother it's a lot like, "Let's play house. I'll pretend to be the mother and you pretend to be the baby," though, as the baby, you'll be expected to act like a doll (keep smiling, no matter what) and you'll be treated like a doll as an inanimate object, as a toy to be manipulated, dressed and undressed, walked around and have words put in your mouth; something that can be broken but not hurt, something that will be dropped and forgotten when when something more interesting comes along. With narcissists, there's also usually a fair element of "playing doctor," as well of childish sexual curiosity that may find expression in "seductive" behavior towards the child, such as inappropriate touching of the genitals, or it can also come out as "hypochondriacal" worries about the child's health and/or being most interested and attentive when the child is ill (thus teaching the child that the way to get Mother's kind attention is to get sick). Having a sick child can also be a way for the narcissistic mother to get the sympathetic attention of authority figures, such as doctors and teachers.

I will reiterate this - it is NOT possible to have any sort of relationship with a narcissist.

I would also suggest you read Children of the Self Absorbed by Nina W Brown if you have not done so to date.

GoodtoBetter · 24/11/2013 16:46

I have children of the self absorbed on kindle, Attila, will try to go through it and do the exercises.
I do hear what you are saying about contact but I haven't had the bollocks to cut contact to less than once a week (unless we're away for the weekend). I expect I should. I feel I am shit parent when we're with her as DS is usually pressing buttons (today he was fighting with DD and then spat at her, so I got down to his level and shouted told him off) she never outright criticises (although did in the past call me a " very shouty mother" and claimed she hadn't been Hmm) but I feel her disapproval of my parenting methods. Or maybe I'm paranoid. But I feel she thinks I'm really hard on him, which puts me on edge and he can smell it iyswim and it ends up in a telling off of some sort.
He gets told off at other times, but I feel under the magnifyig glass with her there.
I know we should see her less, but I guess I'm too chicken to get down to less than once a week. it was more...I'm making progress, honest. I'll stretch it out more.

GoodtoBetter · 24/11/2013 16:48

and yes, she trained me. I am astounded how well actually, more and more of it becomes clear as I read more and more. I've always felt very under confident career wise and unambitious/afraid of new things and I think that's partly where I get it from.
All a bit of a headfuck still tbh.

AttilaTheMeerkat · 24/11/2013 16:56

GoodToBetter

I think you are making progress but you still have a long way to go.
As I stated before she has trained you your whole life to do her bidding.

The malignant narcissist is still a malignant narcissist even after you give birth. The fundamental nature of your malignantly narcissistic parent is the same as it was when you were a child. (If not worse.) Due to no reason other than the fact that you brought a child into the world, your narcissist parent is now a narcissist grandparent. Your bringing new life into the world did not fundamentally change your abusive parent into a loving family member. But adult children of narcissists (ACONs) seem to show a natural affinity for believing in this work of fiction. We have always wanted our parent to be loving to us, and now we want our parent to be a loving grandparent. What we want and what we end up with are two very different things. Where we usually get tripped up is our failure to recognize the adaptability of the narcissist to changing circumstances.

It is highly unlikely that your NPD parent will interact with your children in exactly the same way they did with you. At least, not in your presence. They have adapted their methods to the new situation of you having a family of your own. They know they don't have the same power and control they used to so they usually switch to sneakier methodologies. Which allows you to think that they have changed from what they were when you were growing up. From my personal experience, and from observing the experiences of others, the NPD grandparent will use their grandchildren in the same way they would use an inanimate tool. Without regard for the humanity of your child, that child becomes a tool in the hand of your NPD parent to hurt you. This will always result in moral and/or emotional harm being done to your child as well.

The actual mechanics of how the NPD grandparent will misuse their relationship to their grandchildren will vary. Generally, they will either over-value or under-value the grandchild as a means to get to you. Often, when they over-value, it is the objective of the N grandparent to steal the child from you. I mean that in both senses, physically and emotionally. Ngrandparents are known for so much trash-talking against you behind your back to your own child or children that they want to go live with grandma or grandpa, or the N grandparents simply inspire rebellion of the child against you. They steal the hearts of the grandchildren. Sometimes, they will battle for physical custody of a grandchild after their slander campaign against you has won them powerful allies. Many times the N grandparent has a lot of extra cash to throw around since they are done raising a family. They may successfully exploit the natural selfishness of the child by using cash or toys to lure them. I have read heart-breaking stories of these kinds of situations often enough that I recognize the clear danger any narcissist grandparent represents. They can even steal your children's hearts from you when the children near adulthood with promises of money, houses, cars, college tuition, etc. as bait.

It is imperative to let yourself know that, without profound evidence to the contrary, your narcissist parent is a narcissist still. You must let yourself know for a fact that your N parent can not be trusted with your most precious responsibility, your children. If you allow contact between your children and your N parent it must never be out of sight. Never for a moment leave your child alone with this serial abuser. They only need a few moments of alone time to inflict damage. A whisper, an insinuation, a pinch, a look. If you consider yourself a responsible parent you will never, ever leave your child alone with your N parent. Ever.

So you've made the decision that cutting off contact with your N parent is a necessity and now you're dealing with questions from your children, or you're anticipating questions. First of all, let us establish another fact. You are the parent. You get to make these decisions without apology or excessive justification. You can assure your child that you are making a wise and loving decision for them as well as yourself. I am not going to script what you should say because you are the only one who knows your children, but you must convey that this isn't up for negotiation. This is not a decision that the child gets to make. Yes, children usually love their grandparents. Children are often quite indiscriminate in their love which is why they need parents to guide them. Not every person is safe to have around and this is a good time to teach that important life lesson. The more matter-of-fact you are, the more matter-of-fact your children will be. When we act hysterical, they will usually reflect our hysteria. If you act anxious, they will act anxious. If you appear unsure, they will push. Model the reaction and attitude you want your children to adopt.

If you have another set of grandparents in the picture then focus on them. It is rare that both sets of grandparents are nasty. Emphasize to your children how much we enjoy being around grandma and grandpa so-and-so (the decent and loving grandparents). Cultivate your children's relationship with the decent, loving grandparents. Teach your children to be grateful for the decent, loving grandparents. Gratitude is a highly effective antidote to loss. Focus them on what they have, not what they don't have. Model that attitude of gratitude.

You will find that the children will eventually stop mentioning the loss of the narcissist grandparent if you are not bringing it up. If you are talking about your Nparent in the hearing of your children then you are inviting them to keep talking about it, too. I can not over-emphasize the need for your explanation to a younger child to be calm, pragmatic, measured and short. Long explanations make you look defensive which will tend to peak the interest of the child and prompt him to push the issue. You can gauge what is appropriate information depending on the age of the child. If the child is older and has experienced or witnessed the Ngrandparent's nastiness in action then you can say more.

Young children are not known for their long attention spans. This works in your favour. With younger children you have the advantage of distraction. It is easy enough to get the child's mind off onto another track. Every parent has done the distraction routine at one time or another. "Mommy, I want to see NastyGran today!" "Honey, we aren't going to see NastyGran today because we get to go to the park and eat ice cream." (Make up fun time on the spot if necessary for this distraction.) "Yay!!" says the kid and off we go. Subject changed, kid distracted. In time, NastyGran will fade from memory. Any bonding that may have occurred will dissipate in the process of time.

Remember, you are the parent. You're older and therefore more experienced which is the point of being the parent. The child is dependent on your good sense and protective wisdom. You're smarter than your child; use that to your advantage (such as using the distraction method). You are the final authority. This is not a negotiable issue. Kidlet doesn't get to decide on this one because they lack the understanding, wisdom, experience and good sense that, hopefully, you have. So don't look like you're unsure or open to quibble. You'll undermine yourself if you look anything but firm and resolved on it. Use your advantages as parent to smooth the effects of the cut-off. Over time this will all quiet down. Kids tend to accept what is. It will happen more quickly if you follow the above advice.

Most of all, do not operate from a fearful mindset. Don't be afraid of your children's possible, or actual, reactions. Don't be afraid that you are depriving them of something important by cutting off a set of grandparents. You are only "depriving" them of bad things. Reassure yourself with that truth. Family is not everything. Blood is not binding. You are escaping the Mob Family. What should connect us is how we treat each other with love and respect. This is always a good lesson to teach our little ones. If any part of you is unsure of your decision then, for Pete's sake, don't show it. Your resoluteness will go a long way toward reassuring your children that you are acting in everyone's best interest. If your children know that you love them, they are going to feel reassured that this decision is also based in your love for them. They will find an added sense of security to know that you, as their parent, are willing to protect them even at the cost of your relationship with your own parent(s). Rather than being fearful, see the plentiful opportunities in this. You are protecting your children from someone whom you've experienced as being abusive; you are reassuring your children that you are in charge and are watchful for their best interests (creates deep sense of security); you can teach healthy family values which include that family doesn't get a pass for abusive behaviour; you can strengthen and reinforce the healthy relationships in your extended family. Kids are less likely to feel like there is a void in their life if you fill it with good things.

Cutting off from your narcissist parent is a good thing. No need to act otherwise. Your children will sense it is a good thing by how you behave. Model how you want them to respond and it is likely they will imitate. Don't be afraid of their questions. Kids are amazingly resilient and well-equipped to handle truth. Parents are supposed to protect their progeny. If your child doesn't agree with how you go about that don't worry. They will often disagree with your decisions for their best interests. Nothing new there. It is your job as parent to make the tough decisions. If you know it is the right decision then proceed with confidence. Showing confidence is a quality of leadership. As a parent you are supposed to be a leader. Lead...and they will likely follow.

AttilaTheMeerkat · 24/11/2013 16:57

And I know this to be true also:-

It's painful to watch a narcissist "interact" with their grandchild.

Mostly because there's not much interaction.

And what little there is is so brief and shallow that it hardly rates as a true encounter. More like a hit and run.

Not only do you feel bad that your poor kid doesn't have a real grandparent and is missing out on such a special relationship, you can't help but be reminded that's exactly what you had to deal with for most of your life.

It's like getting to watch reruns of a TV show you always hated.

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