Dear Mum

[NameChangeToGo]

You've just left and as usual, I feel broken. Sad and guilty and hopeless and, oddly but as always, ill.

Our relationship is the most complicated and saddening thing in my life. My friends simply don't understand it, but I make a point of keeping you out of my 'real' life as much as I can, so they only see a very small side of you. DH and SIL get it, at least to some extent.

To anybody else, I think I would seem quite 2 dimensional given the limited input you get from me. But given that you don't actually seem to see me as a separate entity, rather as an extension of yourself, I don't suppose that really matters. It's a claustrophobic and stifling perspective. The disappointment whenever a situation occurs which clearly disputes this is palpable but is soon 'rewritten' and forgotten.

You consider yourself to be so 'nice' that any perceived criticism results in an extreme defensive response. I always end up feeling as if I've just booted a small puppy, no matter how light-hearted or innocuous the comment.

You are a little girl in a women's body. You consider your childish affectations to be somehow charming. I champion strong women and it pains me that the woman I should be able to look up to and respect is such a child.

Your ability to turn every topic of conversation, every achievement of mine, everything my children do, even the bloody weather onto yourself is mind blowing. I still can't quite fathom how you can be so self-deprecating and so self-obsessed at the same time.

You seem to think you are a big help. In reality, you do nothing except add another person trying to claim my full and constant attention to the mix. I'm not sure how you aren't embarrassed to just lounge on the sofa while we run around organising or clearing up after family get-togethers.

I can't hug you or tell you I love you. I turned it off during my teenage years (a very dark time at home for me) and can't turn it back on again. I hate it when you touch me.

You have lied and manipulated, and when challenged you deny everything. It's all done in your little girl, I'm just so nice persona, and it leaves me disorientated about what is real. You also make stuff up in order to appear empathetic. Or to make a point. Or to make you sound more wise. Or for a hundred other reasons. If we challenge you on it, the booted puppy makes a reappearance.

You fill every pause in conversation by telling us how much you love us or love spending time with us. This should be a wonderful thing but it feels stifling. Something about the rise in intonation at the end and the pause which suggests you're again fishing for validation (the search for validation, about everything from your clothes to your opinions, is constant and draining). Is it wonderful to see us? Can it really be wonderful for you while I'm struggling so much just to be in the same room as you? Probably not and it again means that it's not clear quite how much of it is truth.

When you're around, I can hardly breathe. My stomach is tight and there have been occasions when I've had to fight a panic attack. There is no other time when I feel like this. The only way I can cope is to switch a part of myself off when I'm with you. But your words about how much you love us are in my psyche, even though I doubt their truth, and it means that as soon as you've left I feel cripplingly guilty.

In many ways I would love to cut you out but know that I will never be able to. I wish I could find a way to allow us to get on, but I think I finally have to accept that it's never going to happen. Every single time I let my guard down I regret it. I don't know what the answer is and I'm so, so tired.

YoungBritishPissArtist my mum ticks about half of those things on the will I ever be good enough site. :(

I have to share a very strange realisation I've had

I grew up believing my brother was the favourite. I hated him for it, we did not get on at all until we left home. When it turned out we got on brilliantly. But anyway. The understanding that he is the favourite is actually a part of my identity, it was such a massive part of growing up.

At first I didn't bother reading much about the SG/GC thing as it was so obvious.

But then... Something I read rang a very distant bell. And I started reading more and have realised that I was the golden child. It never felt like that, because she was so engulfing, it felt like my brother had more trust and freedom and less expectation (I interpreted it as she'd still love him even if he didn't achieve highly). It's been like a light has been turned on. And explains about a million things.

Very very strange to get my head around.

Sorry, will come back to other posts later x

I think scapegoats are better off in the long run compared to golden children.

It must be lovely to have a mum who is supportive and, well normal. My triumphs and successes have been rubbished and my tragedies revelled in

This. All my life my mother has undermined me.

Another shock to the system, OP
Deep breath time.
Really
You have taken a massive amount on board, in a very short space of time.

I don't agree that GC's have a worse time than SG's. Just different. But still just as destructive to the child, and sense of self.
My GC older brother went NC years before I managed to.

apologies Holey ....I realise you didn't say "have a worse time"!

It is just an opinion based on limited experience. It often seems easier for the rejected sg to break free

I do envy the gc for having had someone on their side and having had happier childhoods compared to the sg

Holey - in our case, my childhood was not at all happier. It was dreadful. The thing is that she did (and does) revel in my achievements, but only in the sense that to her, they were her own. I don't know how to describe how suffocating that is.

Mumngran, I think you're right. I won't be able to get on as much in the next few days, which I think is probably a good thing. I'll be dipping in and out though and will be back properly next week. There are many, many thought provoking questions and statements on this thread.

(Ps holey, not at all trying to make this sound like a competition! I can imagine it is equally shit to be a SG)

Oh, and she wasn't 'on my side', it simply isn't a normal relationship for any of us, I guess.

Yet another ps for holey - I think I may have got a bit confused about your side of it and can't even work out quite where I got it wrong, my head's spinning a bit. Sorry if I've got what you said mixed up (I think I need a !)

tangerine :( (()) I know what you mean about those moments. Seeing my friends with their mothers always sets me off, although I guess that's a bit more predictable!

I'm wondering if anyone else gets the amnesia.

Firstly, I get it every time I've seen her - the first couple of days are the aftermath, when I have to physically recover. Then the relief that I have my own space back when I can start to get over it emotionally. Then, and it takes less than a week, I struggle to remember exactly what caused the problem. I can remember the effect but for the most part not really the cause. Does that make any sense to anybody?

Then something else I hadn't realised. Me being the GC makes a lot of sense but I can't remember my brother being the SG as such. I can think of certain clear examples in a general sense but remember, until today I was certain he was the favourite, in the more traditional sense. So I tried to think back to our teenage years. Again, I can remember the effects - the times of depression and some pretty self destructive behaviour on my part and spending as much time away from home as I could in the last couple of years there... As a result of spending so much time away with friends I also have some wonderful memories of that time. I also do remember some of the particularly notable incidents as there were some awful scenes as I fought for my independence. But day-to-day stuff at home... Nothing. How strange is that?

I know what you mean a bit about the amnesia. I am currently engaged in a game of chicken with my mother. Haven't spoken or texted since Monday (when I said DD had had d&v) and I'm interested to see how long she'll leave it without contacting us. We're not back til about the 17th so could be an extended game. My mother is the opposite to yours OP and doesn't contact. I do all the running. I'm not sure why really. I suppose it means the contact is in my terms and I also feel beyond reproach...she can't do the whole martyr thing about being abandoned if I keep in touch. But I really want to see how long she'll leave it, especially knowing her GD has been ill.

I wonder what she'd do if you just didn't get in contact for a very long time . What's the longest you've ever gone without speaking to her?

Since moving out, not very...about this long? That's why I'm tempted to do nothing and see what happens. Especially as she knows DD has been unwell.

My mum would never think of calling in those circumstances, either. She might call by chance after some event or illness, but even then it doesn't occur to her to ask about it, she just talks about whatever fluff is in her head that day. Very occasionally she might remember, but it's rare and sometimes just a ruse to start another conversation about her!

How's your daughter now, is she any better?

But what's pissing me off is that if it were DS I think she'd have texted by now. DD is fine, thanks . My mum also does the talking about fluff thing. She tells me these great long monologues about tennis players (she loves tennis)...on and on and on. She knows I have no interest in it but she can talk for 5 or 10 mins about it.

with me going "um, ah ha hmmm" the whole time.

5-10 minutes? That's rookie ;)

When I was at uni and our talks were on the landline, I could put the handset down, go into the kitchen, make a drink and get back to the phone without her ever noticing I'd gone. I told her that once, a few years later, joking around. The next three phonecalls she didn't say a word, not one it was bliss . Then it went straight back to normal.

Yep, I've got the um ah hmmm down too, although it's entirely superfluous :)

Mine talks and talks and talks in social situations...if I have friends with me or she's with me and we bump into someone. Really embarrassing. When I lived with her I never had people over cos she jusy took over the conversation completely.

How is everyone - goodtobetter have you heard from your mum?

Playing on my mind this morning.... I believe that I was the GC in the sense that I was the one she saw as an extension of herself. She has fantasies of what the mother/daughter relationship should be like and tries hard to mould us into that. Unfortunately (for her) I'm not really cut out for that, being insanely independent since being very tiny, and so I have never really achieved true GC status because alongside my (her) achievements, I disappoint her on a daily basis. My brother doesn't have the same capacity to disappoint, so has never achieved true SG status.

I think if I was like the sister of a poster above (ie, grateful on any level for the interference), we might fit the more traditional roles.

Nope, not a sausage. That rings bells though about being an extension of her but then I am also independent. I remember wanting to emigrate to Canada when I was about 10 and I now live abroad and have done since I was mid 20s. She unfortunately followed me and now lives in the same village (see engulfing reference from before ). At least we don't actually live in the same house any more. The wanting a perfect mother daughter relationship also makes me think. My mother had a terrible relationship with her mother. Says she remembers knowing as a little girl that she didn't love her. She also felt unprotected by her over the sexual abuse. My mother has made a big thing of how "close" we are/were and one of the things that provoked her narcissistic rage when we had the big row was that I was a disappointment (by disagreeing) and that I was disrespecting her (by disagreeing). My DBro has always fitted much more easily into sg as he was a pain when younger in terms of pissing about at school, drinking etc.

Sorry but I haven't read all the replies.
That was my mum. Everything was about her etc. I cut her out of my life for about six years. It was lovely. I then started to contact her again a couple of years ago as I felt guilty.
She died suddenly in May. Since then all sorts of skeletons have come out of the closet.
I don't know how I feel about her dying, and don't know what to do with my feelings. It's very strange.
I don't really have much advice to give you. All I can say is that I'm very glad I cut her out of my life, but very glad I had resumed contact before she died.
I'm sorry for hijacking your thread. You do have my sympathy as its an awful situation. I think you have to do what makes you feel happy and not think about what other people might think about your actions.

Really struggling with not texting her. Feel I should somehow, but I know that's silly. Such a hold over me still.

Mrsdavidcassidy, not hijacking at all. Sorry to hear about your mum. I can sort of imagine how confusing and complicated those feelings are :( I do think about that sometimes.

Goodtobetter do you want to text her? Do you think you could gain anything from not getting in contact yet?