Guiltripping me...

[Hanbury]

Hi all, been lurking here as DH and I have been having problems and I cant work out if its my fault, his, or both. I have been thinking he might be EA, but I might be too... I'm not perfect by any means.

I have a specific example that's confusing me. When we discussed this he made out there's something wrong with me not understanding that this is how things work in a relationship, and to be fair I dont have many examples to draw on as I have divorced parents and this is my longest relationship...

Here goes:

I have to go away for work occasionally, and very rarely I go to social things and both mean that DH has to look after our DC. Every time he makes comments about me abandoning them both or says "poor DC" or "poor family". These comments make me feel wretched because I already feel bad every single day I drop of DC to childcare so I can do my postgrad.

This happened again on the weekend as I am going to a family thing today and staying overnight. This time I called him on it and previous times, and he admitted that he was guilt tripping me. He explained that he does it to make me feel bad as when people feel guilty they make an effort to do nice things (and I never do nice things for him...). He also insinuated (we were in public) that he expects sexual things in return. We are having problems in this area...

I asked how this works the other way round when he goes away for work and he said of course he feels guilty (I never ever make such comments and dont think he should feel guilty) and that he does nice things for me all the time (not sexual) and these include making sure one of the grandparents come up and stay with me to help out with DC. And he thinks I dont seem guilty for going away and I should :(

This conversation turned into an argument as I just cant see this as normal behaviour: making your other half feel bad to get something in return. He sees it as normal, and played out in films, telly etc. He didnt say it, but he generally implies that I am socially inept and dont understand normal couple behavior. But this CANT be normal can it?

I'm still going away, but I dread every single upcoming work/social thing now. Even more than I already did. I've long dreaded asking him if I can go because almost everytime he does this "woe is me, we are abandoned" thing :(

Help please?

No. It is not normal. It comes across to me as childish at the least, but more like abusive.

My Ex was the same. Eventually I gave up everything I wanted to do because it just was not worth the trouble is caused :(

No not normal

Manipulative and dysfunctional ime

If it is played out on films and telly, it is bound to be dysfunctional, otherwise there would be no story!

What made you eventually think enough is enough? I woke up last night because of DC and couldnt get back to sleep thinking about this and what I should do... but today he is sending me links to cute things and I am thinking how would I live without him...

He sounds like a dick.

Of course it's not normal. Normal & healthy is being supportive of each other & the family unit.

If you love someone, you want them to be happy, not to make them feel bad.

Don't doubt yourself.

You are not abusive Hanbury but he's doing his very best to doubt your own judgment here. Its a tactic employed by abusers because it works on their victims.

Your H is being controlling by trying to control your access to the outside world. Such behaviour is at heart abusive in nature. he does not honestly think he is doing anything wrong. His thoughts about when people feel guilty they make an effort to do nice things is frankly creepy as well as dysfunctional. Small wonder therefore that your sex life is non existant; he is the root cause of the overall dysfunction.

This is at heart about power and control; abuse is about power and control. I would suggest you read "Why does he do that?" written by Lundy Bancroft because your man is in those pages and it will open your eyes some more. Controlling men are often very angry men as well.

He saying poor DC or poor family in such a context as well damages the DC. What are they learning about relationships here. Damaging lessons that is what.

What do you get out of this relationship now?. What needs of yours are really being met here?.

"He sees it as normal, and played out in films, telly etc."

I'm sure there are plenty of thrillers & dramas with psychological bullies featured in them. I'm pretty sure that his behaviour pattern is common enough to be described as 'normal'. Neither of those facts make what he's doing acceptable however. Links to cute things? Twisted bastard....

I have thought about reading the Lundy book, but would have to hide it from him. I do call him on the negative things he says about me, and he'll say that he cant be that bad because who would stay with someone like that. But I think a lot of women do...

@Attila What do I get out of this relationship? I'm not sure at the moment I know how to answer that. I know he thinks he spoils me and he probably does: funding me through postgrad, selling his house and moving so I could do it... both of which are very true and I do appreciate it, even if I dont show it according to him (he usually refers to how little housework I do...).

But I also feel I am doing this because I am the ambitious one with a plan and although he has a very good job he's always saying he will lose it one day but is not making any contingency plans/looking at retraining as he's not qualified in his role even though he has lots of experience. And he wanted to sell up and move out of London even before I thought of doing my postgrad...

I am very worried about this behaviour rubbing off on DC... or him being the next target. DH already calls him names but says its okay as he's too young to understand :(

I would also be thinking how on earth can I live with him?. Short answer to that is you cannot because he is too screwed up. You cannot save or rescue him but you can certainly make a better life for yourself and your children.

BTW how is the relationship between he and his parents. I would put a crisp £5 note on it that either one or both of them are controlling as well, this type of behaviour is often learnt and is deeply ingrained within their psyche. Such men do not respond to any sort of counselling.

Cogito summed him up succinctly in the two words that she used.

"Links to cute things? Twisted bastard...."

Maybe I didnt explain that fully... we havent been arguing about this one thing since yesterday, so atmosphere is okay at the moment and he does usually send me silly things

@Attila well, his dad died when he was 16 but I think there was tension in that family because his dad gave up on some ambitions when she got pregnant young and later she refused to move for a good job abroad. And now she seems a little depressed (not just as a widow) and has a boyfriend who I would describe as taking advantage of her loneliness...

He is already calling your son names - he is showing your son how to become an abuser himself. That's just vile. Your son will get the meaning of those names soon enough. You cannot stand back and do nothing, doing nothing now is not an option because he will control your children just as he is controlling you. You are probably very afraid of him as well.

Abuse like your DH is showing is infact insidious in its onset. You probably were in a low place yourself when you met and he likely also targeted your vulnerabilities (they are so good at this) and any low sense of self esteem and worth you possess. He does nice/nasty very well but its a continuous cycle. Abuse is all about power and control. You and your son are being controlled. You are not entitled in his eyes to a life of your own; he wants you kept in that gilded cage of his own paranoid making.

He feels that you owe him big time now, he funded you and now he wants payback for all that he has done for you. He is a truly nasty conniving individual but Cogito summed him up far better.

I asked you about his parents and was not altogether surprised to read the answer you provided. His own birth family was itself dysfunctional at its very heart.

I do not write this at all lightly but I would now enlist the help of Womens Aid to free yourself from such an individual. Such types actually hate women, he certainly hates you and all that you stand for.

There is no future for you if you stay with him, you'll just end up even more crushed.

I think I have a lot to think about (well, I knew that)... I might not be online for a bit as I go to this family thing, but I didnt want anyone to think I had run away from good advice.

Thanks to everyone who replied. I dont know what I should do but I think talking about it helps to get it out of my head where I can decide it is 'just in my head' IYKWIM...

Thanks again,

Hanbury

He is currently in the nice cycle until the next time he starts. And there
will be a next time.

Perhaps you can have the book delivered to your workplace or close friend or neighbour. The library too may have a copy.

You have a choice re this man, your children do not. Remaining within this will not do you or your children any favours at all. You need to plan your exit carefully, Womens Aid can and will also help you here.

He is likely to be very plausible to many in the outside world but perhaps one or two have their suspicions re him.

Oh this isn't normal

How old is your son ? And what names is he calling him ?

It is bullying behaviour, making you feel guilty so you will give him sexual favours in exchange, that makes my skin crawl. If it was a film it would be a horror.

It's easy to tell you why you're with him and why lots of women stay with abusive men, because it's habit, it feels easier to stay than leave, the thgout of leaving is daunting because your self esteem is completely non existent and you tell yourself you wont be able to make it witohut him and the kids will be devestated.

I know what I'm talking about I lived with a physically and mentally abusive man for a decade. It's only when I left that I was able to see the actual damage he'd done and we (my children) were able to start healing.

"making your other half feel bad to get something in return. "

You might want to look up the concept of 'predatory self-esteem'. The thing they get back from making others feel bad is making themselves feel good... not a good personality trait. You say he thinks he spoils you by funding you through postgrad, selling up and moving etc. Significant word 'spoils'... usually applied to over-indulged children rather than adult women who are seen as equal. Again, has he done this motivated by his love for you and wanting to support you, or is it going to be put on the table as yet another way you are supposed to be indebted and grateful to him?

I stick by 'twisted bastard' btw. Someone who admits in the one breath that they are deliberately making a mother feel bad about leaving their child in the care of its father and, in the next breath, is messing around sending childish 'cute links' is twisted.

The minute I read that you were confused I had a fair idea what was coming and that it was unlikely to be you at fault. I discovered on a website ages ago (can't remember which one) that if you feel confused when interacting with someone then suspect abuse because that is one of the common ways that abusers work. They want you off balance, doubting yourself - it gives them control. Finding that out certainly cleared up some mysteries in my life. He is probably jealous of your phd and what it represents for you - independence, fulfillment, growth etc.

Also if you stay with an abuser you start to take on their mindset - you are already questioning yourself over something that should be totally clear. You are entitled to study or even have time off from childcare duties and no way should you feel obliged to offer your DH sexual favours - what a nerve he's got. You should be enjoying your phd not feeling miserable about it.

Oops - your postgrad not phd :)

That's alarming, I'd be quite worried about his state of mind, not yours, he sounds really quite sick to even think that never mind put it into action.

" DH already calls him names but says its okay as he's too young to understand"

How cowardly and mean. Reminds me of these nasty types that think its OK to hurt animals because 'they don't understand'. I think it's a good judge of character to see how someone behaves towards those weaker and more vulnerable than themselves, and this man is falling well short.

he has a very good job he's always saying he will lose it one day but is not making any contingency plans/looking at retraining as he's not qualified in his role even though he has lots of experience.

Please listen to him. He is telling you what is going to happen. I predict you will eventually be the sole breadwinner in this relationship.

He is playing the guilt card heavily now because, by his calculation, it may balance his true guilt of using you for 100% support in the future. Imho, he may be playing and banking on a point in supporting you now so that you can complete years of study to keep you tied down to the relationship no matter how he treats you or the innocent child. (Also, imho, you do not and will not owe him anything as he is presently employed and is able to support himself　((I have no idea if there are any laws concerning spouse rights in these circumstances, maybe someone else will come along and address this)) .)

Advice: Don't have any more children with him, never give up your financial independence, and slowly but surely find other childcare arrangements for your travel time. Phase out every reason you "need" him and eventually leave.

Every time he says such awful things to your child, be right behind him with an instant rebuttal verbal disertation to your child why he is the greatest kid on the planet. Your H has already shown he will not respect your request/demand to respect your child...shows he doesn't respect you either. Twisted bastard: spot on.

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I do agree with AndTheBand - he is setting up a scenario in which he becomes dependent and you will have no choice but to support him in return for funding your postgrad. He has already admitted that he uses guilt to manipulate you. I think he probably uses your parents' divorce as a trump card in any discussion about what is normal?

He didn't sell his house and move for you. He was planning to do that anyway. But he's spun it so many times that way that you can't see the contradiction in your post of 14:39.

You have no reason to feel guilty about being away from your children. You do need to live with someone who supports you, rather than trying to chip away at your self-esteem.

Oh do have fun while you're away! You know you're going to have to pay for it when you get back.

Do not believe a thing he says. Twisted bastard sums him up beautifully. Insults his own child? Gross.

Its not normal at all.

My BIL is a lorry driver and is away sometimes, my sis never guilt trips him, because hes working to support them like she does.

Your H is an absolute twat.