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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Help Please just need to see the wood from the trees

32 replies

deservebetter · 09/06/2013 14:23

this is going to be long.
Had finally had enough of H's emotional abuse and said it was over last week. He promptly arranged a meeting with a relate counsellor we'd seem nearly a year ago. I haven't changed my mind and gave him a long letter, I will post a few excerpts below.
Today we were having a disagreement, I tried to lead him round the corner out of DC earshot and he really violently bent my fingers and wrist back. It really hurts, part of it has gone numb now. Anyhow, he stepped towards me and I pushed him back and he's now saying that I punched him. He has never hit me, but I am scared of him.
He is now acting like I'm playing games. I'm so scared of how easily he lies, either to me or to himself, not sure which. I am trying to get in contact with my Mum to take DC down, and might go to a hotel.
He's gone out now, but kept saying that I hit him and I have to move out.

OP posts:
Tortington · 09/06/2013 14:27

go to a solicitor tomorrow, get your finances, letters, important documents in order, pack a suitcase of essentials and leave it in case you need it

make sure you have copies of bills you are jointly responsible for
pasports
birth certs
ID documentation - its hard to get anything without it.

if he's not admitting that he's hurt you - its time he leaves

deservebetter · 09/06/2013 14:37

Thank you Custardo. I am going to paste the letter I gave him, not sure why as it's long, so i'm not expecting anyone to read it!!
I've replaced the names.
Dear X,
I feel that our relationship has reached the end of the line. I can no longer tolerate your abusive behaviour. It IS abusive.
You have told me that you don?t know when you are being abusive. This is not true. You do know when you are upsetting me. It is those time that you get even angrier with me. I tried to discuss your lack of empathy with you, telling you that you did not get upset when you upset me, you said that you did. You said that you got upset when I went on at you, and when this (potential split) happened. I continued to try to explain what I meant and you could not understand that one might actually feel upset and having upset another. I believe that you still do not really understand this. I don?t think that I can help you with your lack of empathy. I am your wife, not a psychologist, or counsellor.
Your aggression scares and upsets me. I am definitely not a high maintenance person. I am very independent, and don?t ask for much. I know that. You get particularly angry if I ever you?re your care or consideration. You insisted that you needed all of the lights on, the blinds up and the radio (louder than normal) on when I had a full blown migraine. You did not come home when our beautiful child was very sick, then walked in very drunk repeatedly calling me a c*nt. What I find particularly concerning is that you have been at your most aggressive, hateful and belittling and exploitative when I was heavily pregnant. I have read that this sort of abuse can lead to violence. Your behaviour is sadistic. Again, you scare me. It is not right for a child to be in this environment.
You are rarely nice, in fact only properly OK when, as now, I really stand up for myself and say that I want ?out?. It is then that you suddenly find your nice side. On Tuesday you brought an unexpected gift, and made dinner. You told me that it was the least you could do. No, ?it? (being ordinarily nice and cooking dinner, or any equivalent day-to-day chore) is the least you should do regularly, not just when you sense that divorce might be on the cards.

You are completely unpredictable. I have learnt to think extremely carefully before speaking. The idea of upsetting someone inadvertently has always worried me. You often have a total meltdown, or shout, sneer, walk off, or just snap and say horrible things for no real reason. In the past this has happened when I have:
? Asked if you heard about a news story
? Said that the train was crowded
? Said I have had a lovely/tiring/interesting/stressful/relaxing/long/short day
? Asked you how you are
? Asked you how your day/interview/meeting/evening went
? Asked you what you think of a new dress
At other times you have has a complete meltdown because I haven?t asked you how your day/interview/meeting/evening went.
You have meltdowns of varying degrees EVERY DAY
I spend my life walking on egg shells then trying to work out what it is I said, or wishing I had though more carefully and got it right this time.
You often tell me that I have misunderstood things or just don?t get things. You laugh, sneer or shout at me if I don?t know things. You claim to respect me at other times and say that I am highly intelligent. It is so unpredictable that it leaves me feeling very insecure. If you ask a slightly ambiguous question and my answer does not match the one you were expecting you can have a total meltdown, or shout, sneer, walk off, or just snap and say horrible things.
You often say word or phrases that you know will upset me, and that you know I will find offensive. If I do rise to it, you will call me (often shouting, with significant levels of aggression) a variety of names, from boring, sour-faced, other less savoury terms etc. If I don?t react, you will do the same thing, only with more aggression. You know that these things will upset me. I will never find degrading words for people with special needs, certain ethnic groups, gay people, or basically any minority funny. You know this, yet you continue to try to get a rise from me virtually every day.
You regularly make very unpleasant put-downs. I find mixing with others ? something central to my work- increasingly difficult. The other day it dawned on me that a lot of this was due to the regular put-downs I get from you that are meant to ?better? me. These have included:
? Telling me that my breath regularly smells but that you don?t always tell me ? leaving me feeling very paranoid. You then make fun of me whenever I ask if my breath does smell ? refusing to answer and saying that it is my catchphrase ? I am forced to laugh this off or trouble will ensue
? Telling me that my expression/face/posture looks weird
? Telling me that you find the way I sit/eat/drink offensive for a range of varying reasons
You sometimes make jokes at my expense. These are usually quite offensive e.g. comparing me to a range of ugly people/animals ?I am forced to laugh this off or trouble will ensue as I ?can?t take a joke?. These ?jokes? are not funny, as they are intended to cause hurt.
To not be available is often just not worth it. You complain if I talk on the ?phone to my family and say that?s all that I ever do. When our beautiful child was a baby, you used to sneer and shout that all I ever did was breastfeed that bloody baby.
I have squirmed on countless occasions as you have put me down, or just been plain rude to me in front of my family, and some (not all) friends. I have also been really upset when you have, on many occasions, got people to side with you and join in your taunts.
You have regularly told me that it is my problem. You use gas-lighting a lot. You deny that you have said and done things. You tell me I am imagining things. You say that I am over-sensitive/have no sense of humour/ am po-faced or boring.
I am in the middle of a very unhealthy relationship with someone who is abusive on a daily basis; someone I am regularly scared of; someone who claims to love and respect me, but who shows me barely any respect or love.
I don?t like the way you sometimes grab and manhandle me. Sometimes it makes me feel scared.
We sold my flat, and I have no details of any of the accounts. I asked the other day and you shouted at me telling me I could get all of the information if I needed it. The whole time that I was the sole earner, you insisted that I pay large of sums to you, so that you could manage our finances. This has left me with very little money on many occasions ? you do know this. I have paid off all of your debts. You have been very aggressive towards me when you have felt that I was not giving you sufficient money.
You claimed about two years ago that you had no idea when you were upsetting me and I should tell you as I am obviously very sensitive ? nobody else had apparently had problems with you, and it was all my fault. I began to try to tell you. I got more blame and aggression directed towards me. You regularly blame me for your behaviour, in fact you did so for most of Sunday.
I have been blamed for your meltdowns for many reasons. These include:
? Leaving items in the sink
? Using my fork incorrectly
? Breathing too loudly
? Telling you that I am upset
? Waking up early and lying awake
? Waking up early and getting up rather than staying in bed
? Being too happy
? Feeling down
? Being too quiet
? Being too loud
I have tried for years to be the perfect girlfriend then wife. It is just not possible ? anything and everything can set you off.
Often if I try to stand up for myself, you will be aggressive, and then walk off. You do this at home, but have also done it in various other places
One thing that really scares me is your recklessness. If I ask you to slow down or be careful, you will speed up and drive dangerously, then blame me for telling you how to drive. You put our beautiful child in danger and blamed me for telling you to be careful. It is twisted. I find this side of you terrifying.
My self esteem was, until very recently very low. Made lower for the fact that I have been searching for reasons as to why I have felt the way I do ? blaming myself, looking for faults.
You make it confusing, as you also say nice things, and things that seem to be positive, but there is often a sting in what you say. E.g., you?d be so much better if you ? dressed better, looked more confident, didn?t have smelly breath, didn?t say silly things or spoke properly.
You often pick moments such as ? when I am about to leave for work/when we are about to go out, to tell me I look awful/ laugh at my appearance. At other times you will say nice things. If I ever complain that you are being unnecessarily unpleasant, you will be able to say ?last week I said you looked nice?. There are generally many more negative comments, than positive.
It has got to the point that I can almost hear you laughing at me, or insulting the way I look if I go shopping. I have very little confidence about the way I look, and the fact that you regularly tell me that I eat too much and that I am fat.
I used to do ALL of the housework whilst working up to 50 hours a week. At its worst, I was 6 months pregnant, walking and taking public transport to and from work, doing the shopping, cleaning and cooking. You did not have a job at this time. Your anger and aggression were so upsetting for me that it was better to do all of this than ask you to even put one cup in the dishwasher.
You now work, so have less spare time. However, I still do the majority of things.
When you want something, you will not take no for an answer. you will ignore answers that you don?t like and you will ask again and again, each time insisting that it is up to me and that you are not trying to put pressure on me, however, if I decide to do anything other than what it is you want, you will manage to be so difficult and stroppy that it is not worth it.
You constantly claim that I have removed you friends. I stopped coming out with you because alcohol makes you worse. You would be the life and jolly soul, then manage to insult me, upset me telling me that I was boring everyone, that I looked and sounded dull, nobody wanted to hear what I had to say. You would manage do this without anyone else hearing. You claim this has stopped. You were quite bitchy to me fairly recently. It has only lessened because I don?t come out much.
You often telling me that I don?t get on with my family. You know that my family, as with all others has its ups and downs, but you constantly try to drive a wedge between us.
I used to believe that if only I tried a bit harder, it would be OK. I did really think that it was all my fault..
It is making me very sad, and I don?t see why I should have to put up with daily abuse from someone. The main reason, however, that I want out of this is that it fills me with utter horror to think that given our relationship as an example, one day Our beautiful child might end up with someone like you, and go though what I have been through. I know that, my childhood experiences have led me into several abusive relationships. I can not allow that to happen to our beautiful child.

OP posts:
onetiredmummy · 09/06/2013 14:46

Keep your letter for your divorce OP, it goes above & beyond 'unreasonable behaviour'.

I am so glad you are leaving & IME the hardest bit has now gone. Anything he says to you now does not matter even a tiny bit, you do not have to put up with him anymore.

Second the solicitor & gathering all your paperwork together Brew

Tortington · 09/06/2013 15:11

xxxxxxxx

StuffezLaYoni · 09/06/2013 15:21

I read it all the way through. Your life with this man is intolerable. He is doing everything in his power to keep you feeling like you're losing your mind. I have no clue about how divorces work, etc. but please, please get away from this awful person.

ImperialBlether · 09/06/2013 15:23

OP, is there anywhere you can go to today? I wouldn't give him the letter, but would give it to a solicitor and tell her you want a divorce. Don't have any more communication with this awful man.

Just re-read your post - you say you might go to a hotel today. Do it. He has told himself you have assaulted him and he will feel free now to retaliate.

This man doesn't have a grip on reality. If you give him the letter you are assuming he's a rational man who will learn from it. He isn't.

I would pack up now and get the hell out of there.

something2say · 09/06/2013 15:27

My dear,

I am so sorry to read all that in the letter.

One bit of advice. Don't tell HIM this.

Find someone else to tell.

Avoid your husband until one of you can leave the house. Any conversation he will not agree with, and you will be in line for further abuse.

Do not expect him to be different, or want to hear your point of view, or then understand and accept it.

He will just be more as he is the letter.

Avoid all engagement with him, while actively seeking out other people and places to write more like you wrote to him.

Staying awa y from him will limit the a use you experience.

Off loading elsewhere will strengthen you xxx

TheSilveryPussycat · 09/06/2013 15:48

Your letter shows very powerful insight into your FW. However, don't expect him to take on board what you have to say. Although he may or may not make a pretty good show of seeming to do so, this tells you nothing.

I agree with otm - the letter is a very good starting point for drawing up a list of unreasonable behaviour for the divorce petition.

In addition, I would suggest you discuss things with him as little as possible, and be very non-commital if you should happen to find yourself in discussion ("I'll have a think about that") Believe nothing he says, detach as much as you can.

Any brilliant ideas you have - don't act on them...yet. Think everything through as thoroughly as you can.

YouKnowOfTheCrunch · 09/06/2013 16:11

DB he sounds horrendous. Could you please call the police and log the incident where he bent your wrist back? There's a chance he'll report you for violence, if you have already logged what actually happened it will take his power away. If he then threatens you again they will know the full story.

KristinaM · 09/06/2013 16:23

DB, what do you want? Do you want your husband to agree that you are right and he is wrong, that you are right to want to leave him? Because that isn't going to happen. He is not going to see things from your point of view.

Stop wasting your energy trying to persuade him and make your plans for leaving. Don't discuss them with him. If he asks what you want /what you are planning/how you are feeling, DO NOT respond in detail. Say things like

I don't know
I'm not sure
I'm a bit confused now

Do not show him this thread. Do not tell him what your solicitor says.

ShipwreckedAndComatose · 09/06/2013 16:29

Hi there,

I would do everything custardo says.

Have you contacted womansaid at all? They would be able to give you good advice/find somewhere see to go

xx

Locketjuice · 09/06/2013 16:41

Just read the letter, he sounds fucking awful, I am not one bit surprised you don't want to be with him and so happy you have realised what a selfish pig he really is!

Hope you feel a bit better for finally coming out with it and getting it off your chest

Lweji · 09/06/2013 16:48

If he doesn't leave, for your safety, get yourself out of the house.
And get yourself checked by a doctor.

CinnamonLatteIsJustForWinter · 09/06/2013 17:17

DB if you gave him this letter, he knows it's "game over"
Go to a doctor or a&e to have the hand looked at (and tell them what happened).
Get out of there. He sounds nasty.

turbochildren · 09/06/2013 17:30

hello deservebetter, what a horrible man. He should not see the letter, but show your solicitor. this person will turn it all around, even your letter, so don't show it to him. you are right that he's scary, and he is playing mind games and he will make it out that you attacked him. Please call the police about his behaviour, show them and the solicitor the letter which details his behaviour.
I hope you get away today, you and your child.

deservebetter · 09/06/2013 19:09

Well I already gave him the letter in the counselling session. He kind of apologised, but not convincingly. That was on Friday, so this blew up over him knowing it was over.
He did exactly as someone said and sent me an e-mail earlier accusing me of attacking him. He accused me off collecting a paper trail.
Took myself and DC off out of house not sure what happens next.

OP posts:
Lweji · 09/06/2013 19:20

He accused me off collecting a paper trail.

Well, so?
That's exactly what you should be doing.
Abusers thrive on secrecy and spoken words.

Mind you that letters you write carry little weight.
But if you keep all communication with him by email only, he's more likely to show his true colours in writing.

deservebetter · 09/06/2013 19:38

Interesting about abusers thriving on secrecy. Actually lots of people would think we have the perfect relationship as he chooses which side he shows people.
I'm so fed up with this!!!

OP posts:
KristinaM · 09/06/2013 20:05

DB,do you have somewhere safe to stay tonight?

Jux · 09/06/2013 20:25

DB, just get out and stay out. I hope you're somewhere safe now.

TheSilveryPussycat · 09/06/2013 20:32

And get the injury logged with GP.

deservebetter · 09/06/2013 21:16

At DM's

OP posts:
turbochildren · 09/06/2013 21:59

I'm so glad you are away from him. I hope you get all the support you need. It's awful when they mess wit hyour head like that, I'm really impressed you kept track of yourself and stuck to him being wrong. Well done for that, you are strong!

Jux · 09/06/2013 22:32

Good, well done.

Have a restful night, tomorrow is a new day.

deservebetter · 10/06/2013 07:59

Well he called when he finally realised we'd gone. He swung from blaming me for always doing everything to saying he wants to change and acknowledges everything. Did my head in completely. He kept going on about how he loves me. Obviously I'd love him to change, but of course that never happens, does it? I've been lurking round these pages enough for the past few years to have realised that.

OP posts: