In front of the children

[Milspeth]

I'm new on this board, hoping someone can help!

I have been living with my OH for 18 months. Our relationship is fraught because we're both feisty. I don't have any children, he has three teenagers who live with us half the time. We get on well and OH says I haven't put a foot wrong with them.

Recently OH had been in a stroppy mood all week and wouldn't let his youngest son have friends over to camp out because it was too short notice. In front of his son he asked me what I thought and I suggested they try to find a middle ground. Not backing him up annoyed him and OH turned on me. His anger quickly escalated and he started yelling abuse at me in front of the children. I yelled back. His eldest son tried to get him to back off but he'd lost it. When OH was out of the room his eldest gave me a hug, which OH walked in on. Furious, he told his son he didn't know why he was siding with me because I'm always complaining about the children. My turn to be incensed. I can't tell you how wide of the mark that is. I sometimes grumble about mess but I would go out of my way forthem and have never said a bad word about them to anyone. I told the children it wasn't true but OH persisted saying I was always moaning about them. To shut him up I slapped him. While I was comforting his youngest son, who was tearful because he felt it was all his fault, OH followed me and repeated it again, and I slapped him again.

I am depressed to hell by our destructive behaviour. I've apologised to the children but I feel embarrassed and awkward. OH says I'm a domestic abuser but I feel betrayed by him for driving a wedge between me and them. Whatever anger he felt towards me, why would he hurt their feelings to get at me?

We have had furious rows before and I have suggested counselling but OH says I cause his anger. Involving the children feels as if boundaries have been crossed and the genie is out of the bottle. I apologised to OH but he doesn't think he's got anything to apologise to me for. I feel as if I am now gagged because I can't trust him. Am I seeing it from one perpective to say I feel disgusted by him?

Thanks for any advice.

Freddie - both domestic violence AND emotional abuse are present here. They're not mutually exclusive.

Seek counselling for yourself, regardless of what your dh does.

I was able to control my words but not my actions is a crock of bullshit. In my opinion.

And you only slapped him to shock him?

Yeah right.

Freddie - you're the only one so far who has lost your rag and effectively slammed the door on this. Ironic.

I haven't lost my rag.

And unlike you I recognise the sense of removing myself from a situation and not following someone around to slap them.

And passive aggressive sniping is ok from you but not him?

From the brief description you've given of your situation, it sounds incredibly unhealthy for all concerned and like the best possible solution would be for you to be as far away from each other as possible, on a permanent basis.

If you both refuse to recognise this, however, and decide that counselling is what you both want, perhaps you should consider a temporary separation while it's ongoing? It sounds like you're both living in a tinderbox.

Congenial - I don't have double standards. If it had been the other way round I'd have recognised my part in it. I do not take a (female) victim role in any circumstances.

EllaFitz - there isn't an atmosphere hanging over the household other than I know we need to address our relationship issues before we do more damage.

EllaFitz - there isn't an atmosphere hanging over the household other than I know we need to address our relationship issues before we do more damage.

I'd say that's pretty big.
And he'd been moody all week too.

What do you think are your relationship issues?

Milspeth - I'm not talking about an atmosphere (and I wonder whether the children would beg to differ with you).

You've used physical violence and he's used emotional abuse. Irrespective of whether you're currently friends, you've described your relationship as fraught and said you've had furious rows over the relatively short period of time you've lived together. That's not healthy. You've said you feel gagged and that you can't trust him and I'd imagine he's wondering whether you'll slap him again the next time you row. Sounds like a tinderbox to me.

The incident was two weeks ago, and I want to deal with it because I'm not naive enough to think we can just forget about it.

He'd been in a strop all week about a particularly difficult problem at work but he can't compartmentalise things. That and being able to express and resolve our differences without rowing are my issues, as well as what I did. He of course will have issues with me and I want to fix those too.

...I think we're all agreed it's an unhappy mess. Your replies are all food for thought. Thanks

Perhaps it's just down to a misunderstanding through styles of writing but it sounds like you're concentrating on this one argument as being the problem, rather than acknowledging the wider issues.

I'm not suggesting that you're naive, but the issues you have described don't sound healthy, or safe, for either of you.

VERY unhelpful posts from Freddie. Good that she's gone.

PA and EA ARE equally pernicious and personally I feel quite sickened by the concentration on the OP's actions rather than equally on her DP's. My ex told my ds (aged 8 and autistic) that I was going to run off with another man, then move him in and he would hit ds). Don't tell me that's not as bad as a punch.

Rightly or wrongly men are stronger than women. Will do more damage when violent. This is NOT in any way to excuse it, just an explanation as to why some might see it as less serious. It's not at all but I suppose I feel less fear when I hear of a woman hitting a man because she's not as capable of causing serious injury. Let me reiterate though that no-one should be hitting ANYONE. It's inexcusable.

OP, feisty is a shit word IMO. It's really just means argumentative doesn't it? Poor kids. I think you need to leave this man and I'd be interested in what the mother of these children has to say about all this. Out of interest why did they split up?

Are you "feisty" all the time or just with him?

Those poor kids...

18 months is still the 'honeymoon' perid of a relationship. What will you be like when you're fed up with eachother?

Your behaviour is pathetic and immature and your lack of self control in front of his children inexcusable.

How do the rows start?

What happens during the rows?

ps - by that I mean both of you

Very well said, Freddie. It's a shame that you've gone.
OP, if I were your husband I'd have slapped you back. How would you feel about that? What would you have done then?

Geezer, as I said earlier, I don't see gender as relevant. If OH had slapped me back (or even first) I would not have judged him any differently to how I have judged myself.

Lweji - our rows often come about because I want to talk and resolve things and my OH is more comfortable brushing things under the carpet. So he exhales and rolls his eyes and so the cycle begins. That sounds far too simplistic I knowbut even writing and reading this thread had drained me emotionally.

One thing is certain: you can't fix this mismatch in how you handle things on your own.
Have a look at some literature about abuse - plenty around - and also the Respect website. You are only responsible for your actions as he is for his. It's the DCs who don't get to choose.
There are ways of working through differences in approach to problems but you both need to want to do it. At the moment the situation is toxic and dysfunctional and none of your issues should be played out in front of the DCs.
I don't think there's much point in saying who is more abusive than the other - basically a 'who started it argument' - at present it sounds as if you need to spend some real time apart. As the others have said the DCs mother won't be best pleased to hear they have been exposed to this kind of thing.

So this is a man that refused to go to counselling and prefers sweeping things under the carpet, how exactly are you planning to resolve your relationship issues OP.

You are responsible for your behaviour, feisty indeed . The fact that neither of you have taken steps to resolve the toxicity of your relationship (him avoiding counselling and you not leaving) after living together for only 18 months says enough.

In light of his counselling avoiding and sweeping under the carpet ways, you have two choices; accept that his behaviour is who he is and become an eggshell treading mute or get the fuck out of there. Nothing in your Op suggests that your OH is ashamed or remorseful which only leaves the latter.

The shocking behaviour you have both subjected these children to is inexcusable. If you really are remorseful and not just paying lip service then STOP participating in escalating behaviour which leads to violence.

The explosive way that you both fail to resolve disagreements far overshadow the other times when its all calm on the good ship Milspeth. You and your partner are supposedly adults, you have choices, a heck of a lot more than those poor children.

Since when did yelling abuse at your partner in front of your kids and then lying to alienate your kids from said partner a good dad trait, thats a chapter in the "Good Father Handbook" that I must have missed.

Your relationship is TOXIC you have have a choice whether to participate.