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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

DD abusing me - distressed

319 replies

Minifingers · 03/05/2013 12:39

Have posted about dd on parenting teenagers board under a different user name. If you recognise me, please don't out me, as dd sometimes searches mn to see what I've said about her. I don't think she has ever looked at this board though. I lurk on this board a bit. I thought I'd post after realising that what I'm feeling at the moment is not a million miles away from what what I read here from women in abusive partnerships with adults. I really need to off-load.

There's a special kind of sadness and shame attached to being abused by your young teenage child because underneath you are constantly asking yourself the question - are they like this because of the way I've parented them? And fear for them - for their future and their well-being. I strongly believe that behaving in a violent and abusive way doesn't just harm the person who's being abused, but in a spiritual and emotional sense also the person who's behaving abusively. That's really hard when you are a parent on the receiving end of abuse from your child.

A bit of background: dd is going to be 14 in August. Up until the end of primary she was a very easy and happy little girl. Unusually happy, confident and high spirited I'd say. She had a massive sense of fun and loads of energy, to the point that she'd always be the last child standing at any party or sleep-over. She breezed through primary in top sets for everything, despite being one of the youngest in her year. Her teachers LOVED her. She was very, very pretty too, to the point that people would stop me in the street and say what an adorable little girl she was.

Fast forward to year 9 and she's unrecognisable as the happy, lovely little girl we knew before. She's still sociable and has a lot of friends, including a couple she's known since nursery. But that's all that's left of what she was before. On the days she's not actively refusing to go to school (about 2 or 3 out of every 5 days at the moment - she just won't get out of bed), she deliberately makes herself very, very late. She regularly argues with teachers - just point blank refuses to do things she doesn't feel like doing at school, whether it's an assessment for PE, moving desks because she's been talking, whatever. She walks out of detentions if she thinks they've kept her long enough, refuses to do any homework, is MASSIVELY disrespectful to the teachers she doesn't like.

Obviously I've tried to do something about her behaviour. I've moved her school (she asked me to and I was unhappy with her old school), I have kept in regular touch with her tutor and her head of year. We have tried to put sanctions in place for bad behaviour (ie grounding and losing her phone) and made our expectations clear but we aren't the most organised people and her behaviour has been so universally bloody awful that it has got to a point where sanctions become a bit meaningless. And in the meantime she has become so angry, and so resentful of me in particular, and it's got worse and worse to the point where I can't see how we can go on, despite the support we've had from the school and from other agencies (CAMHS) to get to the bottom of her behaviour.

If you've read on to this point you might be thinking - So far, so typical of some teenagers, but I'm posting specifically because of her behaviour towards me and how it's made me feel.

Over the last few months she has become more and more aggressive towards me. She

  • daily tells me I'm pathetic and a failure as a parent because I have an autistic child (her youngest brother who is 7) and a daughter (her) who has been referred to CAMHS and who I can't control
  • tells me I'm old and stupid. Tells me constantly to 'shut up' and if I don't do what she says, says 'Are you stupid? Did you hear me? SHUT UP'
  • tells me I'm a failure because the house is messy and because I buy my clothes in charity shops
  • says that DH should leave me and could do much better than me
  • walks into the bathroom when I'm in the bath, even when I have the door locked and have said not to come in - she sticks a card through the gap in the door and unlatches it, pushes her way in and shoots disgusted looks at my body. Says she needs to wash her hands and won't go downstairs to do it because she can't be bothered
  • walks into my bedroom and pulls things off my shelves when she wants something of mine, without asking me if she can have it. She walks past me into the room, ignores me when I say 'what do you want?', literally physically barges me out of the way and laughs at me, just takes what she wants and walks out.
  • she has locked me out of the house when I've stepped outside to put something in the bin
  • she has trashed my room
  • she body-blocks me in the hallway of the house, sticks her face in mine and shouts at me that I'm pathetic and scared to make eye contact with her.
  • she gas lights me
  • she tells me I should just leave and why don't I give up and move out
  • she constantly points out that DH earns more than me and that therefore he is 'in charge'. I have pointed to her that this is not how finances work in a marriage (at least not in ours thank god). She ignores me.

..... and then yesterday she snatched my mobile after I refused to allow her something she wanted. When I tried to get it back off her she hit me around the face, knocking my glasses to the floor, laughed at me when I cried, and shoved me out the front door of the house.

She weighs 10 and a half stone and is stronger than me. I'm frightened of her.

I found myself sitting crying in the car and too frightened to go back into my own home. I ended up going around to my SIL's house. She came back home with me and persuaded dd to be driven round to my mums, where she stayed last night.

I don't want her to come home. I feel completely traumatised by the last few months - I have this constant feeling of exhaustion and a weird sense of vigilance - like I am living under siege. I suspect a year or two more of this and I'd have a heart attack or something. The atmosphere in the house is often awful and it's affecting my ability to parent my other two children.

And although I'm the one who is the target of most of her spite and anger, DH is also very stressed by it. He's a 45 year old manager and someone who I would have said had 'cast iron' good mental health. Yet she managed to make him cry last week. First time I have seen him cry in the 20 years we've been together. He's a brilliant dad, very patient and caring. He's made loads of time for dd the past year, knowing that she's struggling with growing up, taken her shopping, to the theatre and out to lunch.

I keep asking myself what I've done to make her like this. DH and I have been together for 20 years, and we have always been loving and respectful to each other, in front of the children and at every other time. We NEVER speak to each other in a disrespectful way.

I have not been a perfect parent to dd - I have nagged her too much about her lack of effort at school (and when I say lack of effort I mean lack of ANY effort, not a failure to reach some impossible standard of perfection), I have lost the plot at times and shouted and pleaded with her about her truanting and lateness. On a couple of occasions I attempted to push her into her bedroom when she attacked me. I should have walked away and shut myself in my bedroom instead of engaging with her physically. DH has admitted he's made mistakes with her as well, and has apologised for telling her she was a 'waste of space' (in fairness, this was a comment on her absolute refusal to ever lift a finger to help at home, including refusing to do even such basic things such as remove her plate from the table after eating, put rubbish in a bin instead of just dropping it on the floor wherever in the house she happens to be standing, or flush the toilet after she's done a crap in it). Can her abusiveness be our fault? Is it always learned behaviour?

How do I survive the next few years being abused and disrespected in my own home until she grows up and either leaves or stops doing it? How do I keep myself intact and strong as a mother?

If you've got this far - thanks! I'm going out to walk the dog (stress relief). Will come back and respond later if anyone answers this.

OP posts:
bollockstoit · 03/05/2013 14:12

x post

JugglingFromHereToThere · 03/05/2013 14:15

I'm so sorry Minifingers - this all sounds so tough to live with.

Agree with others who think there must be something at the root of these troubles such as a diagnosis for DD too ? Or something in her life you don't know about ?

From what you've said, not your fault at all.
Can only think for other possibility that she or you could have had some issues with her growing up and entering teenage years/puberty ? Any body confidence issues ?

Hope CAHMS can help you all get back/ move forward to more settled times.

Snuffleupicus · 03/05/2013 14:17

What's her sleep like, does she have her phone at night? Smartphone?

Plomino · 03/05/2013 14:25

OP , in all honesty , getting arrested might not be a bad thing for your DD . Not every arrest ends in a criminal record , many many more don't , and if she starts pinging up on police records often , Social Services HAVE to do something about it . I deal with plenty of these types of calls , and few of them ever involve a criminal record , unless things have gone so far that charging is the only option available , and your DD sounds a long way from that yet . I find a few hours in a cell , in a horrible custody suite does tend to focus their minds somewhat .

FWIW , I currently have a 15 yr old DS who is being a horrible horrible person to live with at the moment . At this rate , he'll be getting a suitcase , ready packed for his 16th birthday .

t875 · 03/05/2013 14:25

I can imagine you have but have you sat down with her and asked her why she is acting like this?? It sounds absolutely awful for you and I couldn't imagine it. Maybe it would also help you to speak to a councillor perhaps so you can build up your strength which is waning by how you are being treated in order to be able to deal with her and to also talk about your feelings about all this. I would if you can have a distance from her right now if she winds you up don't answer, and if she starts going into one just walk away and say we will discuss this later when you are calmer I do this to my 12 year old she knows I won't entertain what she has to say if she's rude to me. I confiscate things she loves too and not for a day, it's been a week a few weeks back!
All the very best hope things get better there x

Minifingers · 03/05/2013 14:27

We've made her hand her phone over at bedtime (10pm) every night in the week for a while (at huge cost in terms of her arguing about it, night after night after fecking night. Standing on the landing outside her sleeping sibling's bedroom shouting at the top of her voice about how unfair it is).

OP posts:
Lemonylemon · 03/05/2013 14:27

Plomino I'm sorry to hear that, but at the same time, thank God I'm not the only one who feels that way about their DS.

t875 · 03/05/2013 14:29

Maybe you and your daughter have some you two time too, I know this works really well with my dd. mines pretty good but when them hormones rage my god it's like she's a different child! And she tried the stand up tall thing in front of me and ok she is tall but I still was taller and tip toed a bit too to show her!! Lol

Minifingers · 03/05/2013 14:29

"I can imagine you have but have you sat down with her and asked her why she is acting like this??"

The family liaison teacher at her school asked her why she was refusing to come to school.

She said it was because she hates me.

The teacher said 'well if you hate her, why do you want to be in the house with her all day then?' Confused

She had no answer to that apparently....

OP posts:
ElectricSheep · 03/05/2013 14:31

I think you've got to forget why she's like this for the moment.

You do sound exhausted and, forgive me, a bit intense, about her to say the least. It does come across that you might love her but you don't like her. And please don't feel guilty about that because who would like a strapping 13 year old girl who is violent and obnoxious?

I think you need to just focus on you at the moment. BUT before that I second that you warn her that if she ever hits you again you will call the police. And do it. And let them take her to the station. And charge her if necessary. Because if you don't do it now she will be seriously assaulting you and her other family by the end of the year. You have to act responsibly here and take action. Ignoring violence is not an option.

That said, I think you need to step back, detach entirely and concentrate on doing good stuff for you as much as possible. Also see a counsellor. When you have recharged your batteries, and only once you have, then think about taking her out or talking, or reading those books, or any of the other things suggested.

PS Might you move this to the other place?

Chubfuddler · 03/05/2013 14:35

What she needs is military school. We don't have those in this country.

That's if there is definitely no abuse and I know I'm harping on about it but ... The lack of personal boundaries/emotional incontinence etc is s rurally the reason I raised it. As for mothers instinct - I know several women who would assert that equally confidently. They'd be wrong.

orangeandemons · 03/05/2013 14:36

Just a thought......my ds was like this from about 14 in some respects. She was violent and aggressive. My mum refused to act on it.

It later turned out after 20 or so years that she had Huntingdons disease.

Snazzynewyear · 03/05/2013 14:42

It does indeed sound exhausting. You have my sympathy.

I'm going to pick something to run with to get more of a sense of this. The saying no to everything - you mention asking her to put her washing in the basket. What happens when she doesn't? Do you still go and get it and do it? Are there consequences to her refusing to do what she's asked with things like this?

I can see how the staying out after school is different. How does this usually pan out? Where does she eat; does she get her own food when she gets back, or do you keep her dinner for her or what?

Don't let your concerns about her future career keep you from calling the police if you really need to (this was what got me really thinking about consequences...) That is her issue to sort out, and tbh she is hardly on a straightforward path to work with children at the moment.

ScarletWomanoftheVillage · 03/05/2013 14:43

This sounds absolutely horrendous, op. Does your dd have times in between these episodes where she behaves and talks normally and decently with you? Just thinking that if she does, then perhaps you could have a conversation with her where you ask her to think of some solutions and you both agree on some boundaries etc. You've probably tried all this and sound at your wits end. I'm sorry I don't know what you should do, and I don't know how you live like this. Sad

Minifingers · 03/05/2013 14:50

"Does your dd have times in between these episodes where she behaves and talks normally and decently with you?"

Oh yes. She'll come up, say sorry. I'll kiss her and hug her.

20 minutes later I'll have to say 'no' to her for something - no you can't eat your dinner in your bedroom, no you can't go out again on a school night, no you can't shunt your brother off the computer when he's doing homework, and within five minutes she's telling me to 'shut up and go away' because she has to have her own way and will not accept 'no' for an answer.

OP posts:
Minifingers · 03/05/2013 14:52

"you mention asking her to put her washing in the basket. What happens when she doesn't?"

She has got a 2 foot pile of washing all over the floor in the hallway outside her bedroom (where she threw it) which has been there for 2 weeks. It will be there in a year's time if she doesn't put it in the washing basket. Or my mother will come around, put it all in a bag and take it round to hers to wash.

OP posts:
Minifingers · 03/05/2013 14:53

"It later turned out after 20 or so years that she had Huntingdons disease".

That is a thought I could do without. Sad

OP posts:
ElectricSheep · 03/05/2013 14:54

My thoughts too Snazzy. Would you really consider that she is on course to work with children OP? I don't think she sounds cut out for it at all atm OP and I don't think you can let that be a barrier to you stopping her violence.

You simply cannot and should not accept her violence. Ring the police and let them charge her if necessary. She should be thoroughly ashamed for treating her own mother in that way. Disgusting.

Machli · 03/05/2013 14:58

She sounds like my dd who is 6!

Dd has high functioning autism and is extremely oppositional. I believe she has PDA actually and we are seeking diagnosis. Perfect at school etc. a lot of how you describe her as a younger child resonates with me.

katrinefonsmark · 03/05/2013 14:58

Is there any where else she can stay temporarily to take some pressure off you?

FreckledLeopard · 03/05/2013 15:00

I don't suppose an American 'brat-camp' Turn About Ranch or something similar might be an option perhaps? I appreciate it's costly but is it something you might be able to fund somehow?

I know there are other, less hard-core Christian camps too - Red Cliff Ascent here

LEMisdisappointed · 03/05/2013 15:09

It would be highly unlikely that your DD has huntington's disease if you have no family history of it.

Have to go to school run now - sending supportive hugs, your DD is lucky to have such a caring and patient mum, you'll get through this xx

StitchAteMySleep · 03/05/2013 15:11

Your mother takes her clothes and washes them when you are making a point?! That is undermining you, not helping.

What is her relationship like with your mother? What is your relationship like with your mother? Could your mother be undermining you in other ways, or is she generally supportive (noted that your dd went there yesterday after what happened).

HeySoulSister · 03/05/2013 15:13

gosh this sounds like my dd and how she used to be. (age 16 now and much easier)

I had her arrested and she spent nights in cells on 3 separate occasions....she got good input from police,and probation got involved. they were,imo,the best agency

she does look back on that time now with horror and humour tho.

what did give my teens a lightbulb moment was filming them or recording them at their worst.....then in a calmer moment,playing it back to them...(and I suggested they may feel embarrassed if their mates saw it lol)

you have my sympathies....

LadyFlumpalot · 03/05/2013 15:42

OP - would it be such a bad thing if she DID see this thread? The way you have described your situation might just trigger her to feel guilty and want to change?