If you live with someone who refuses to thrash things out....

[lowestpriority]

isn't it inevitable that YOU end up being passive agressive?
Trying to talk/argue about stuff with a person who just walks off and goes to bed whilst you are trying to get your point across is bound to lead to PA, surely?

Lowest, take it from one who knows:

start squirrelling. Every time you go shopping, take out cashback and put that cash in a safe place. Buy cheaper brands/recipes, and pocket the difference. You are going to need it.

You will be, I promise, beating your head against this brick wall in 10 years time.

But try going to Relate. With a male counsellor. Who might get him to realise that he is damaging himself with this.

But if you live with a narcissist, which I suspect you do, start saving and thinking about a part time job.

Sorry I meant to say Relate... suspect you do, it will be a waste of breath.

I don't know why narcissists regard the bringing up of problems as a vicious dangerous attack to be defended AT ALL COSTS including to the death...

but they do. And it never, ever changes.

Narcissist?
will have to go and google that, not heard of that term before.
Stonewalling? I assume that's something to do with blocking communication. Will google that too.
Thanks.

Stonewalling is a lethally destructive strategy (mostly men) do in order to stop something that they find very threatening, ie emotions. They get overwhelmed, shut down and then shut you down.

Google John Gottman.

It takes two people to make a relationship work - the OP loved/s this man enough to marry and have three children with, before he's written off completely perhaps it would be worth trying to find out why the situation has deteriorated to the state it is in now? Being bad (as a couple) at managing conflict is not a good enough reason to assume that divorce is the only possible outcome.

My DH was very similar in the sense that he would never engage in rows - he perceived me as being aggressive and irrational and immediately switched off, he didn't see what would be achieved by participating - it used to drive me insane. It's taken time and effort but he has accepted that if i snap at him it's not necessarily a big deal, this was normal behaviour within my family but completely alien to him. Equally, I have had to learn to take a deep breath and approach problems i have with him calmly. If it's something that is really bugging me i do sometimes write it down, it helps me to order my thoughts and figure out what's really bothering me - then i can talk to him about it and we work it out together. We went out on friday night and i offloaded a load of family stuff that was really bothering me, we talked it through and we're both much happier.

We are supposed to be going out for a meal together on Saturday as it's my birthday.
I think he has arranged it as it's what we have normally done in the past and he wants to maintain the status quo. to me though this is just burying his head and trying to pretend that everything is normal.
I suspect that, if I try to "offload" during the evening he will just use his normal response and change the subject. Previous evenings out have either followed this script or we have just spent the evening in silence as I really see no point in attempting to talk about stuff only to get shut down again.
So it should be a fun evening!

Glad you have had some helpful posts since we last spoke.
I think I had run out of suggestions.
Hope you have a nice birthday on Saturday,and good luck to all of you.

It might help to set the scene in advance: tell him you want and need to discuss what's going on between you, that it's making you very unhappy. don't start discussing it then and there, say you want to do it when you're out of the house and both free to concentrate on what the other has to say. That way he knows that you're not just looking for a row and that you're interested in what his perception of the situation is.

It's a pity it's your birthday meal, that adds another layer of expectations to the evening.

Be specific about what it is that is making you unhappy - ie: when you do X, it makes be feel Y. Not sweeping generalisations or 'you always...' He may well have completely different feelings than you are assuming/guessing at.

Knowing how my DH was I really suspect your DH just wants his life to be happy and simple and not complicated by arguments. If he switches off if you get angry or upset, don't do it - stay calm, explain how you feel and ask him what his view is. Then listen to him. Allow the silence to last as long as it takes - if he tries to change the subject do a Jeremy Paxman and repeat the question.

In advance of going out try and remember what your life was like pre-children and what it meant to you to be a couple - remember enjoyable times spent together and remind him too. I really hope you can persuade him to open up.

I really am starting to think that everything I touch turns to shit; lawnmowers, cars, children, relationships, cooking, whatever

For this reason alone, I would tell him on your birthday, that you want a divorce. You have seen the solicitor, he will have to leave the house until the children are old enough and continue to pay (unless the laws have recently changed).

Tell him asap - you could read books and analyse until the cows come home but I doubt this situation will get better. You know this too I think. You have tried everything. Do it now while your children are still young.

A good book is 'The Emotionally Abusive Relationship' which goes into personality disorders, and also deals with the fact that the victim may also have become EA, but more importantly, why she has chosen the EA / NPD partner, ensuring that she doesn't do it again.

The relationship sounds doomed if when you are out for a nice meal on your birthday you feel the only options available are "offloading" (which sounds like moaning at him) or sitting in silence. If you can't just enjoy talking to each other without arguing or battling each other then staying together is pointless. You don't sound as though you enjoy his company and can talk to him without being negative.

Your story must be being played out in hundreds of thousands of homes in the UK. My dad was like this with my mum, thinking that the house was his because he paid the mortgage. He even threatened to burn it down rather than let her have half if they divorced. How ridiculous is that!

Your username sums up the situation. You probably are his lowest priority. He finds football more interesting than you by the sounds of it and from reading your thread probably does find you a disappointment. He therefore really cant be bothered even having the discussions that you crave as you mean so little to him.

This isnt meant as a slur on you as I am sure you are anything but a disappointment but some men seem to want their relationships to stay the same as it was in the 6 months after you met. This never happens of course as children come along and things change but some men just cant seem to get their head around this so they criticise their wives weight, or their appearance or the fact they dont work whilst refusing to acknowledge that looking after children is the hardest job in the world and one which 95% of men would not want to do in a million years.

What they are though is cowards, because if they are so disappointed then why not walk away and start again? They like the fact that someone is around looking after their kids, they like the house being tidy and food on the table, they like the fact that their friends see them as Mr family man but they are not prepared to put any effort into their relationships. They say they cant stop you walking away but if you do then it would be you who broke the family up so your children would be sympathetic to them because "mummy wasnt happy with me".....It keeps them on the pedestal that they always want to be on.

For those that think he wants things to change so everyone can live happy ever after, you are kidding yourselves and believing that men think like women do when it comes to relationships.

In this situation it is clear that he is not fussed either way and isnt going to make any changes so that leaves the ball completely in your court. The only person that can make changes to their life is YOU and you are wasting your time even trying to change him because he wont change.

You need to force the issue with the solicitors and make a new life for you and the children or you could end up very bitter indeed like my long suffering mother is.

Great post maleview

You are right maleview. He is not bothered either way is he?
I think he just wants ME to do the split so he can blame me for the divorce and remain the poor man who never put a foot wrong, making me the bad guy.
Why the fuck he can't just be bloody upfront and honest about this really pisses me off. What a coward. But then ,I don't even know why I'm suprised. Why change the habits of a lifetime? Every previous relationship he had always ended with him as the good guy who had the horrible woman do the dirty on him and be the one to leave. I should have seen this coming.
Am going to tell him to stick his meal up his arse. Why the fuck should I make the effort if he is not fussed either way.
Thanks for all the great advice.
x

Goforit OP - you really have to make yourself your highest priority because he really won't do it. Good luck.

I think that's the right decision LP.

Nothing more depressing and demoralising than trying to 'play out' a happy relationship when you are deeply miserable and worried inside. It's a very lonely feeling.

Tell him to fuck the fuck off and MAKE SURE you do something nice for yourself for your birthday. Then go to a solicitor and get the ball rolling.

It's the beginning of a new, happier life!

How long have you been together? How long have the problems been ongoing for? I'm finding it very hard to understand that you could contemplate life with three children on your own without knowing with 100% certainty what's going on in his head - i can understand that you are making assumptions because he is not telling you, but that doesn't mean what you are assuming is accurate.

Book a session to see relate together, if he refuses to go or refuses to communicate in that environment then you know that you have done everything you possibly could to make the relationship work.