I don't know if I'm a bitch or if he's dragging us down, I need advice please.

[LondonAlone]

I hope this doesn't turn into an essay.

I've name changed as he knows my mn name and I know he looks at it.

I have 2 small dc and been with dh for 16 years, so other than a few teenage bf's he's the only proper relationship i've had.

I have nobody to talk to about our problems as I don't want my friends or family to hate my dh. Sounds terrible I know but it's happened in the past and I don't want to be defending him when he's called me names.

I know I'm not perfect but his determination to keep the business he started has turned him into someone I don't know anymore. To say we are in debt is putting it lightly, we are utterly screwed and owe money to everyone. In the past I've stuck by him as he was so good at his job, but then the market died and he's tried his hardest to make the business work. Everyone has been telling us to get out for years but we've dug in deeper and deeper.

My problems are, he never tells me when he's taking a day off, so I live day to day not able to make plans. I also get up with the kids every morning and he was meant to do one day, but I only find out the night before. There is never any spare money, I don't know week to week how much the budget for food will be, if I'll have to use the change jar to get basic things. I live on very little, nothing is new, all second hand (except when bought by gp's).

So far it just sounds like we're poor and I live round dh's timetable. But the worst thing is way he acts now. He has a food addiction problem, he eats when he's stressed and he's stressed all the time, so he's put on Allot of weight. His black moods make him so hard to talk to, but he expects me to be what he calls affectionate (and I call sex). I also have an illness that makes me sore and after a day of looking after kids and dealing with pain, I almost get angry when he expects me to get into sex. He wants me to enjoy it and gets upset when I say no and that I'm just not that excited. I also find it hard to give him more than a quick peck on the lips as anything more is taken as a sign that I'm up for sex and sometimes I just want a hug.

Anyway we fell out Again this morning, and I asked him to go to Relate and he said no. I told him I was finding our lives really hard to live but I wanted to make an effort to save our marriage but he said it's not worth saving. I guarantee he'll change his mind by this evening and we'll carry on as before.

I don't know if I can carry on like this, I'm so tied into everything though that leaving would be so hard. Plus I still love him, but I can't help him, he needs to help himself.

I don't know what to do and have nobody to ask. Sounds so submissive, but thats been my role in our relationship and I don't know how to be anything else.

Help.

Sounds awful. And you sound so down.

His food addiction? It must be costing a lot. How are you managing that, is he eating everyone's share too? Sounds like he controls the finances

Yes, he eats more than his share. I make healthy meals but he'll eat half a loaf of bread as a snack. He's always eaten allot but he used to do loads of cycling and managed it, but now he does nothing.

He controls all the finances. I used to control the tax credits and child benefit, but only child benefit now. I hate having to ask for money, especially as he makes comments about his staff all hands out waiting for money (that they've earned), and I know he's probably putting me into that group. In fact I've told him, I feel like one of his staff, but he said that was silly and it's just the way things are just now.

I'm also, very worried he's going to have a heart attack or stroke. Weight, stress and no exercise are a perfect mix. Then I'd be left in it as he stopped paying the business insurance ages ago.

That does sound really hard and I certainly don't think it's you being a bitch.
He sounds quite depressed TBH, has he seen the GP at all? He probably feels like he's letting everyone down and has got into a rather self-destructive rut, which as you say doesn't leave any room to see you as a person. Which is why I think you need to start putting your foot down and make him talk to you, the more you acquiesce the more he'll start to despise you. You will get more respect if you can make yourself appear more like a partner than another mouth to feed or someone to shag.
Will he not talk at all about the business with you? Have you (yourself) researched bankruptcy if he's not mentioned it? Looked online for jobs that he might be able to do?
None of this will make your life easier instantly but if you want to break through his wall and help him to help you, you're going to have to get tough.
Try and schedule the time together for a talk, in fact it doesn't have to start as a talk, maybe a list of ideas from your research. If you surprise him with your interest you might be able to squeeze in a few requests for politeness etc.
I know you're entitled to far better treatment but you are most likely dealing with a mental health issue so if you don't want to leave you're going to have to be the bigger man and keep your expectations small and achievable.

He reminds me of some desperate, morose gambler that keeps playing the tables, asking how much they'll give him for his wristwatch, and hoping that the next turn of the card will win him back everything he lost.

I think you need to tell someone IRL what's going on and risk them calling him a few names. It sounds like he needs some kind of intervention whether that's financial, psychiatric or medical... urgently and, frankly, I don't think it's safe to be around someone behaving as you describe. I'm thinking about that man in the mansion who shot dead his wife, daughter & all the animals before setting fire to the place and topping himself.

Talk to your parents perhaps and arrange to go and stay with them for a while. Call the doctor to your husband before you go.

This is what I took away from your post:

• he makes you feel really bad asking for money FOR YOUR CHILDREN;
• he is addicted to food & spends a fortune on it while the rest of you struggle for money;
• he is controlling
• he pressures you for sex despite the fact he knows it can make you site
• he won't go to Relate
• he has completely destroyed your finances
• he didn't bother telling you when he has a day off so you can never make plans
• he is making you utterly miserable and you have to be completely dependent on him

Sounds to me like it is time to really think about whether you'd be better off out of the relationship.

It sounds like him having a heart attack and dropping dead would be the best thing that could happen, actually. Unfortunately, selfish people are rarely obliging enough to die and get out of your hair and this man is a selfish prick. Times are hard but his response is to take everything for himself, the money, the food, the leisure time - and to expect you to service him sexually as well.

First do your research into the practicalities of ending the relationship: whether you can force him out of the home or whether it would be better to take the kids and leave; what benefits would you get, whether he would be able to pay a decent amount of maintenance or whether he will dick you around... Make sure you have all the information you need.
Then sit him down for a chat and tell him that things are going to change, one way or another. Either he starts making an effort to sort out the marriage and the finances (have you tried CCCS or similar debt management charity? THey are very good), and accepts that everyone in the family matters and his needs do not take top priority, or you will end the relationship. You don't need his permission to end the relationship if it is no longer sustainable for you.

Best of luck.

You all sound so strong and I look rather pathetic.

He went through a very dark phase where I made him go to the doctor, he went on A.D's and after a few months admitted he'd wanted to die. That's something I'm aware of and I know he's not going to talk about it, which frightens me.

He is very depressed but refuses to admit this, just saying he's stressed.

I want to close down the business in a way that means we don't have to declare bankruptcy, but he just keeps pushing it and pushing it further. In the heat of an arguement he admitted he didn't want to be a failure and he didn't know what else he would do for a living. So I don't know if that's pride, depression or just plain selfishness.

We own our house and are about to put it on the market. If we can sell it and pay back his parents then we can liquidize the business and maybe not be bankrupt as the business is Ltd. But there is a whole load of personal loans and other bits that might push us over.

Sorry, I don't know if I answered everyone there.

Once the house is sold and the business gone, I could get out as I wouldn't be tied financially. But I still have hope he'll go back to the loving, caring, supportive man he used to be.

Well to be blunt....GET RID OF HIM and fast, he is only going to drag you down to the gutter with him, he treats you badly and it is very unlikely he will ever go back to the man he was, also next time he is pestering you for sex tell him that he has gotten fat and you no longer find him sexually attractive

He needs to go back to the GP and get his ADs upped if necessary, at least talk it over with someone fresh.
What you could do is spell out what will happen. Maybe write a letter if it's easier. Let him know that if he closes the business you won't think any less of him (because it's supposed to be your opinion that counts the most isn't it?) That you will help him find other work, that he can do it (I assume he's not bad at sales to have started his own company?), maybe even try something new. That depression is not something to be ashamed of. That you understand how he's feeling and that he has the power to change things. But also that your life is getting fairly intolerable because of his behaviour not the business (make it clear it's his respect you need, not his money). That the only thing he should feel ashamed of is his behaviour towards you and therefore to his kids, who are learning incredibly bad habits and attitudes from him. He can start to change all this by seeing the GP and really opening up there.

You can change things too, it's in all of us, just some of us are more practised than others. You don't want to be a little girl all your life, you have to be a role model for your DCs.

Sorry, fell asleep putting kids to bed.

He only stayed on his AD's 6 months then came off. He insists he's not depressed, just stressed.

I ran my own business before I had kids. It was fairly successful and I sold it when I was pregnant. So I'm not incapable.

I think I've had enough though, I think he will only give up his business if forced, and he won't listen to me.

If he won't listen to you, what is there to say?

What I also mean is, isn't it time to "do" and take control of your finances and your life?. You were successful and capable in your own business, so should be a challenge you can cope with.

It sounds like you have given him enough in the way of support and offers of help and he is resisting anything that will actually improve the situation, preferring to harm himself and abuse you. Now it's time to prioritize you and the DC: he's an adult and he can sink or swim, the DC need not to be around his selfish, aggressive, worrying behaviour and you need to be free of it as well.

Honey, I think you need to talk to someone in RL about this so that you can get some help. You and H have quite a quite a number of problems and you need a number of solutions in place to help you out. Please reach to family and friends, they will be horrified that you are in this situation.

Most of all it sounds like you need some sort of sound financial advice so that you can sort out your finances in a way that benefits you best. I'm not in the UK, and am assuming you are, so is there a financial advisor or accountant or someone that either you know (or your family or friends know) who you can contact? I would think that once you have a sound financial plan in place you and H will feel a bit more at ease.

As far as I can see, your H is not accepting, owning and dealing with his own personal problems. He does not communicate with you, uses you for sex while not being a complete partner to you, and has a food addiction. He is not taking any responsibility for his health, and expects you to put up with that. That is not right, and yes, some sort of intervention is needed so that he steps up and makes it right (if indeed you decide to stay).

Good luck OP, I fear you have a long hard road ahead. Keep us updated.....

London you have put up with his selfish behaviour, he has had many chances to change. You and the children have no life due to his control of the finances and of the timetable.

As SGB says it is time to prioritize you and the DCs. Where do you want to be in 5 years time? In 10 years time? It is time to make plans and get organised.

Be careful what you say to your DH though as he might turn like a wounded animal. Talk to your family so they are aware and can protect you and the DCs if necessary.

You are not pathetic and its easy to sound strong when you are not the person living that life.

SGB is right, the children need protecting from this so now is when you step up. He has had his chances and didnt take them, and this is where you show your strength, the strength you know you have deep down. You can do it, you know you can.

Funny how we fall into behavioural ruts, isn't it? He obviously wanted something you're not really inside and that's clearly not sustainable.

Ultimatum time then. I would give him the chance to accept your help as the capable, grown up person you really are or to accept that you can't sit back and watch anymore. You have your kids to think about as well as your own self-esteem.

It is not being a failure to close the business if it isn't making any money, what is a failure is to blindly carry on robbing Peter to pay Paul, and then have to go bankrupt.
I work in a Court and you see it all the time people who just won't give in and carry on to the detiment of their families employees and their health.
Can you persuade him to see a business advisor at the bank, who will see things from a different perspective, and might talk some sense into him.

The route cause of all your problems, the stress etc is down to the state of your finances and all other problems you have stem from there.

If he doesn't "do" anything sensible in relation to the business I would leave taking the DC's, he really needs a wake up call, and you going might provide it.

If the antidepressants didn't help then he may not be depressed and it may be more an eating disorder and personality. If he has been like this for several years then waiting for him to change back into the person you fell in love with won't happen.
It doesn't sound as though you love or fancy him any more, or even like him.
I wouldn't stay in this relationship. It isn't a partnership as he doesn't listen to your views on his business.

We are in the middle of a recession. Having your business (and hence your identity and self-esteem) fail is very upsetting, and basically he's not coping. I bet if you looked inside the houses of other families whose businesses and livelihoods are failing, you would see the same picture: stressed angry depressed father and a supportive but upset wife wondering just how much longer she can put up with her man behaving like this and dragging the family down.

You are not alone. And he is not a failure. Businesses are going to the wall all over the place, we are in a double-dip recession similar to the 1930's. I sometimes think most people on MN are insulated from this, as mortgage rates are very very low (artificially) and if they were back in 1990's rates, there would be hundreds of similar posts from people on the verge of losing everything.

However, your husband is not helping. I would be frank with him. Say to him: it is NOT YOUR FAULT that your business is failing, everyone's business is struggling right now. I know you are great at your job (you said he was good at it and it worked well in the past) but that's not where we are right now. YOu are still good, but we need to stop the business dragging down the whole family.

And then talk through the realistic options for stabilising your finances. If you get left with personal debts after the business is closed/house sold, then go for a debt management plan with a charity such as CCC or Payplan. You can stop people harassing you. I would also seriously think about bankrupcy, it does get it over and done with quicker although there are ramificiations in terms of not being able to be a company director and so on.

If you can't get him to listen, you may have to go for the nuclear option. which is that you leave temporarily until he is willing to change, and if he's not, then you can't live in this stress forever, so that's that.

My bet is though that he will change. Basically his life is collapsing around his ears, and he's depressed and angry, but ultimately hopefully, his survival instinct will kick in (perhaps you have to kick him a bit too) and he'll realise that losing you would be even more of a disaster than losing the business.

Oh dear, I know someone who was in this situation.

They poured more and more borrowed money in the business,it failed anyway and now he's bankrupt.

The house is in the bankruptcy peoples hands.

I think cut your losses really. It didnt do my friend any good standing by her man at all.

The worst thing was that he could get a really good job working for someone else but is obsessed with having his own company.

By the way, I don't think what I've said about the recession excuses his behaviour, but it does explain it perhaps.

I think now is the time to draw a very firm boundary: You cannot go on like this.

If your husband is prepared to sacrifice everything, including you and your family's happiness, you owe it to them to protect them and get them out of this situation. But hopefully this will be the jolt he needs to get proper financial and legal advice, and let the business go. Once you do that, and he/you look for a job, refinance othe debts sensibly, and go and rent somewhere, your lives will look a heck of a lot better and you can then start to work out where your relationship goes from here (as of course you don't feel affectionate with the stress you are under, also tell him that in no uncertain terms).

What a lot to contend with OP! I think now is the time not to make any big decisions. Now is the time to set about getting advice for yourself - legal, financial....Soak up as much as you can and then use that information to make an informed decision about what YOU should do. There is help out there for him too from debt counselling services, consumercreditcounsel, national debtline etc. But even if he does not take these - you can approach them. I understand (from personal experience) the full effect of having major debt in the family - the pressures are far from just financial. Maybe he is doing the 'male stubborn' thing where he can't admit that he is struggling - even though it is totally evident from what he says and his efforts to console himself (sex included). You may decide later that you and the kids just cannot live like this and then an ultimatum may be the way forward. Some boundaries at least need to be established. It's not bitchy to be assertive about your needs.

Take care x

I just wanted to give a little update as its been a long day here and you've all been so supportive.

During the night I had to stop Dh storming out saying he hated everything. I threatened to call the police as I thought he needed sectioned. He was acting very aggressively too, but he kept his distance from me and I didn't feel he would turn on me.

So this morning we sat down and he's agreed to go to the doctor, appointment tomorrow. We've worked out what we owe and have a plan to liquidate the business and no doubt declare ourselves bankrupt. Since I'm a partner, I am equally responsible, so I can't just up and leave.

My biggest fear is he changes his mind, but if that happens i'll be first at the lawyers office.

Right now I'm gathering copies of everything I've signed and am looking at a contacting a financial advisor for just me if everything does go wrong.

I know the one last chance thing is so stereotypical, but I do still love him. Plus my kids love him, so I have to see the best side (but have a back up plan just in case).

Thanks for your support and valuable advice.