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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

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Original poster

Am i in the wrong for telling the truth?

35 replies

Imsosorryalan · 07/05/2012 20:56

Hi
My sister and i have always had a volatile relationship with my dad, anyway he was very EA when she was growing up and i left home at 16 because of him. We are now on speaking terms as i am keen to foster a long distance relationship for my dc's, whom he adores.
Anyway, my sister hardly calls him and when she does doesnt really tell him much about her life as he always has an opinion and has a go at her.
She has recently split up with her long term bf who they shared a flat/mortgage with. She hasnt told him. (they split up about 6 months ago). All she said was they were having problems.
Anyway, long and short of it is, i spoke to dad and told him they had split up. (he asked me outright, i didnt want to lie). I am so fed up with her drip feeding him and i cant keep up with what he/ she said or knows.
She basically had a go at me telling me it was none of my business to tell him and i had no right. Shouting and crying etc.
I was so shocked i didnt say anything, but am fuming at her now.
Am i in the wrong? Should i apologise to her or leave her and her 'complicated' life to it?
Thanks for getting this far!

OP posts:

ImperialBlether · 07/05/2012 20:58

You are wrong and should apologise. Her private life is none of his concern.

He was emotionally abusive to the extent you left home at sixteen. That you want to encourage a relationship between him and your children isn't easy to understand. Your sister cannot forgive him - this is easier to understand.

She has a right to a private life. She had a shit childhood due to him. Why should he get the chance to have an impact on her present.

Don't talk about her to him. Tell him it's not his business and if he wants to know why, tell him.

ImperialBlether · 07/05/2012 21:00

And you sound patronising when you say her "complicated" life. She has split up with her boyfriend. Maybe her childhood has given her low self esteem. Are you older? Did she stay at home on her own with him?

Seabright · 07/05/2012 21:02

It is hard when someone asks you something outright; it catches you off-guard.

Explain this to your sister and be ready with an answer "I don't know" "you'd need to talk to her about that" if he asks you stuff like that again.

scarletforya · 07/05/2012 21:03

I don't understand how you could want to allow him contact with your children if he is abusive?

I also don't think you should have given him any information about your sister. Manipulative of him to try to worm it out of you. You would be better off telling him you don't want to discuss her business and leave it at that.

If your sister wants to be no-contact with him, I think you should respect that.

Original poster

Imsosorryalan · 07/05/2012 21:09

Sorry, i should have said that she wants to have a rel. with him as he is her dad, but cannot tell him to keep his nose out. She does ask him for money when she cant pay bills etc and then dad uses that as a reason to offer his opinions. He also gave her a large deposit for her flat.
Sorry. I didnt mean to sound patronising, i am 5 years older, financially independent and dont ask him for anything. i just wish she would stand up to him. She left her bf too so isnt unhappy as such about the split but i do know dad gets her down.

OP posts:

izzyizin · 07/05/2012 21:13

I agree with IB.

It sounds to me that, in the interests of fostering 'a long distance relationship' between your EA f and your dc, you're prepared to sell your dsis down the river.

I would suggest you apologise unreservedly to your dsis and assure her that you'll leave it to her to divulge as little or as much as she chooses to the f who made her young life hell as you won't talk about her to him again.

Btw, of what possible benefit can it be for your dc to have a relationship with a relative that you know to be EA and who allegedly 'adores' them from a distance?

Original poster

Imsosorryalan · 07/05/2012 21:27

He's very complicated. Maybe EA is too harsh, not sure if that was the right term, but he has always been very controlling and strict. Wanting to basically do as he says ALL the time. He played us all off each other esp when him and mum divorced. He can be very praiseworthy one minute and puts you down the next.
He always thinks he is right and although he goes about it all wrong, i do believe he thinks he is doing the right thing. He wouldnt dare try to tell me how to run my life as he knows i would just have no contact at all. Sorry if it sounds worse than it is, (or is this being EA)

OP posts:

AnyFucker · 07/05/2012 21:48

ugh

if my sister dobbed me in like that to my EA father, I would never speak to her again

you sound judgmental about her

I expect you didn't get the worst of his toxicity, did you...you being so "sorted" and she isn't'n'that

did you realise you repeated the behaviour he instilled in you as kids...playing one off against another ?

maybe your sister isn't in quite a good place as you, but you have just demonstrated you would still curry favour with your father over her well being

bad show, OP

izzyizin · 07/05/2012 21:51

Do you really think that your dc will benefit from having this arse in their lives even it is at arm's length?

Sounds to me like he's still jerking your chain. Think about severing the link.

Lueji · 07/05/2012 22:00

That's not really something you want to keep a secret. Not from a parent, unless you are not in speaking terms.
He could easily put 2 and 2 together, as he must have, which is why he asked you.

Regardless of how good the parent is, what's the point in lying? And it's not fair to you that you are made to lie to anyone.

I'd probably have told him anyway, and then tell her that I had.

I hate lies in general.

She needs to "grow a pair" and stop lying. She would have to tell him the truth at some point. In 6 months she could easily have.

If she is going to lie to him, she might as well lie to you too. At least you'd have plausible deniability. :)

DontmindifIdo · 07/05/2012 22:06

He played you off one against each other as children? Can you not see that was happening again now? You 'told' on your sister, you have caused a division between you and her, you have decided your dad has a 'right' to know the details of your DSis's life more than she has a right to keep it from him, you've taken his 'side' against her - you are falling into old patterns.

What you should have said if you didn't want to lie is "If you want to know about DSis's relationship, you should ask her, I'm not going to discuss it." You should have respected her secret, or at least told her you didn't want to keep secrets from your father so told her she should tell him.

If someone asks you a direct question you dont have to answer it. (you'd make a crap POW )

OutfortheCount · 07/05/2012 23:08

OP, it will be hard for you to read and digest, but you've had some good advice/perspective on here. You could use this information and do the really bold thing - break the cycle. Or you can just keep colluding with your Dad. It's up to you.

21YrOldMan · 07/05/2012 23:24

"Regardless of how good the parent is, what's the point in lying? And it's not fair to you that you are made to lie to anyone."

Lueji, I agree completely. There's no point lying. But saying "If you want to know something about my sister, ask her" isn't lying.

OP, I think you're in the wrong. Apologise to your sister, tell your dad that you won't talk about your sister to him any more, tell your sister you told your dad that, then next time he asks a question, you know what to say :)

Lueji · 07/05/2012 23:42

You're right. It didn't occur to me now to tell him to just ask her, as probably didn't the OP.
That's the danger in maintaining lies.
Most people who don't lie (very much) aren't very good at keeping them.

lisaro · 08/05/2012 00:03

You sound astonishingly judgemental about your sister - maybe you should look to yourself if you're allowing your children to have a relationship with someone you have nothing positive to say about. YADBU, and I can't believe you don't know that. You owe her an apology and to stay out of her business - that includes judging her.

nailak · 08/05/2012 00:10

you were wrong, you should have just told him, that if he wanted to find out about your sister to ask her, and it is not your position to say anything.

differentnameforthis · 08/05/2012 06:18

She obviously keeps the information she gives to your father at a minimum for a reason. I say this as someone who has no relationship with my mother (haven't for 20yrs) and so tries hard to give my sister just enough info about me/my life as I know she tells her (my mother) everything about me. So I keep it to a minimum and about stuff that it doesn't bother me about her knowing!

It was a massive breach of her trust for you to tell him especially as you know this & why she does it (in terms of him criticising her)

To me it sounds like you did it to score points with your father. You certainly have no right what so ever to be fuming at her, it should be the other way around.

MardyArsedMidlander · 08/05/2012 07:48

As for her getting money off your father- frankly, having also grown up in a rather EA family, I don't blame her. If your dad is controlling and critical- she might at least get some form of support off him.
You appear to have inherited your father's critical attitude towards your sister- and appear keen to appear the 'Good Child'.

differentnameforthis · 08/05/2012 07:53

And on further reading, about the paying you against each other...he is still doing it & it worked to a tee for him, didn't it.

He is creating a divide between you, a divide that I think he wants there, thus is playing you still.

AmberLeaf · 08/05/2012 07:54

I can understand why she was annoyed at you and why people are saying you were wrong but she was also wrong to expect you to be complicit in her lies.

People that hide the truth make it very hard for others around them.

I would have felt awkward in your position especially when its obvious that something was up.

Pagwatch · 08/05/2012 08:36

I think the OP is in a difficult position. I am in a similar one with no contact with a sibling who has contact with my mother and siblings.

It isn't about lying. It is about boundaries.
The OP is wrong to have disclosed something she was not meant to but I think she knows that. It would be better IMO to just apologise to her sister rather than trying to avoid that by blaming her sister because of her lifestyle and her debts and all that film flam. Not least because the father is doing what hhe did in their childhood and pitching one sister against the other.

The situation could be resolved by the OP apologising and by then explaining very clearly to her father "I will not discuss my sister with you. Don't ask me questions. Stop using me because it is damaging my relationship with her. If you ask me questions I will not answer and will be upset and annoyed with you"

Shit situation. But yes, the father is pushing the op and ger sister into the roles that divided them as children. Horrible manipulative behaviour.

Can I say - I am not sure why I wrote all of this so oddly 'the op blah blah'. Sorry op. I don't have time to re-write in a less formal way. _

Pagwatch · 08/05/2012 08:39

Lueji
I am not sure that is true. I can't lie but I find it very easy to say 'i am sorry, I am not prepared to discuss this with you'
In fact, being unprepared to lie means this response is probably quite an easy phrase for me to reach for.

upahill · 08/05/2012 08:44

You are not very wise OP.

There have been numerous times in my life in different circumstances when people have asked me directly for information when they know dam well they wouldn't get the answer from the people concerned.
The stock answer in this situaton is 'God knows what's going on, ask her?'
That way you stay neutral and don't lie - lets face it, generally nobody knows all the facts about things, just the side people want you to know.

LadyWidmerpool · 08/05/2012 08:46

What's it to either of you whether she splits up with her BF? Why shouldn't she lie about it? It's her business, she doesn't answer to either of you. Don't demand info you're not entitled to, and I'll tell you no lies.

Herrena · 08/05/2012 08:51

Op, I think you realise that you shouldn't have said anything to your dad.

I'm an older sister myself and my sister and dad have always had a difficult relationship (he tries to control, she retreats massively). I now know that if I ever say anything about her life to him, even if only in response to his questions, then she will be furious. She likes to have complete control over what people know about her and it sounds like your sister is similar - surely you know that about her by now?

I do have some sympathy because it is hard to dodge around a subject when you're put on the spot, especially when simply refusing to answer is not something you ever usually do (my knee-jerk response is to answer people when they ask me a question). However, the responses suggested above seem good for this purpose.

By the way, from the OP's original post it sounds like the dad asked a question about his younger daughter. In my family everybody asks about everyone else all the time - when does normal family interest become snooping and manipulative behaviour? Does it depend on the subject's previous relationship with the person asking?

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