When a guy....

[JazzyButtons]

Doesn't read between the lines about how you feel about him is it more likely to e an avoiding the issue because he doesn't feel the same, or a wanting it spelled out so that he doesn't get the wrong end of the stick???

How much initiative would a guy use in a situation like this? I'm pretty sure ive been subtly obvious IYKWIM, but he's refusing to 'get' it.

He says snuggling is for relationships, I said where does that leave us, he says r doesn't know, I said that I can see now why it's best left to relationships, he makes a joke about me finally understanding something, I said maybe too late though.... And he's playing dumb now. Arrerggggghhhhhhhh!

Would that be an obvious convo starter about relationship to you??

Hi OP, sorry but you're going to have to make things a bit clearer?

Do you mean you've met a guy and you're both sending out mixed signals?

I'd suggest he's making it clear that he doesn't think it's a relationship - sorry...

Hard to say. That's why affairs of the heart are so weighted. If you get it right then great - proceed with happiness...but if you've got it wrong this way pain and embarrasment lies.

Here's what i think fwiw - I say spell it out, the sooner the better. The longer you hold back the more significance it will take on.
In the interests of knowing one way or the other, you may as well tell him how you feel.
If it's a no goer, then the sooner you can go through the shitness, and come out the other side ready to move on.
If it's a yay - then great!

The worst thing is to dangle though. Waste of time.

Good luck x

How long have you known this guy and how often do you see him?

It sounds fairly clear that he doesn't want a relationship with you. Is he a FWB or just someone that you know and would like to have a relationship with?

Thing is, most people actually don't want to come right out and say 'I do not want to have a relationship with you.' They are worried that they will be percieved as unkind for doing so, or that you (hypothetical general 'you') will get angry or even violent. So someone who likes you ie enjoys your company well enough and means you no harm, but doesn't want a relationship with you will try to avoid having the discussion at all.

And generally, it's best to take the hint, if you've tried a few times and got avoidance in response. You;re not entitled to a relationship with any specific individual, even if you 'love' someone, that person is not obliged in any way to love you in return.

i can't make head nor tail of that so i dont fancy his chances much either. why wouldn't you spell it out. relationships are such an important part of your life why would you leave it up to chanvce that he gets what you mean. tell him straight what you want, if it's what he wants, then good. if not then you know sooner rather than later and can move on, save alot of heartache and second guessing.

Been having 'sleepovers' for the last 2-3 months, see him about 2-3 times a week.

Decided I've reached the point where I need to find out where I stand so I can walk away if I need to.

He's just texted back asking if we can discuss it a bit more, but that it was by no means a no, just need to talk about stuff. Probably not the best conversation to have over text...

But yeah I need to know one way or another.

He's just not that into you.

Sorry, but that little exchange sounds like him telling you he doesn't want a relationship.

The avoidance thing is shitty. I know lots of people do it, but it is a way of telling someone something without having to say it for themselves.

I think you have to accept it's a FWB situation or move on.

Don't have the conversation by text, have it face to face and listen to what he is saying. While it's unlikely that what he wants to tell you is that he loves you and wants to move immediately to a committed and totally monogamous relationship, don't act as though any other offer makes him a total bastard. Commitment is not compulsory, and monogamy is not automatically part of seeing someone when it hasn't been discussed.

Do you want a monogamous relationship? Is that the issue? It's fine to want one, but if it's not going to be on offer, it's best to walk away: what is not fine is to agree to a casual relationship when you know you want more, in the hope that the other person will 'realise' that you are The One. S/he won't if s/he is not into monogamy, or not that into you and it is both a waste of time and actually very selfish to try to force someone into committing, or pretending you don't mind and then weeping and clinging and stalking and having tantrums.
If he's not offering what you want, part gracefully and move on happily.

I'm going to wait till the next time I see him, and see if he brings it up. If he doesn't mention it, then I'll know he's trying to let me down gently and distance myself from him.

See the thing is there would be stuff to talk through before we decided anything, I'm recently out of a 4 year relationship which I know he was very aware of when we first got together, and he has a young daughter. So there are practicalities that we'd need to discuss before jumping into anything.

I'm not expecting a full blown relationship right now, all I suggested was that we could start going on dates rather than just round to mine or his.

From how he is with me I really don't think this is one sided on my part, but as I say, things are complicated so even if he did like me, it doesn't mean he wants a relationship just now.

I'm hopeful, but on my guard just in case.

why are you shying away from taking control? it almost sounds as if you feel relationships are out of your control and something that just happens to you. go and see him. he has already said that he wants to talk so go and talk. think first of what exactly it is you want out of a relationship. do you want exclusivity? commitment? long term relationship? just sex? FWB? ask yourself and answer truthfull then when you see him you will know whether what he is saying matches what you want. dont wait to see if he brings it up and guess from that what he means. you bring it up and tell him what you want, then he can tell you if that is what he wants too. dont shy away from it. it is your relationship, you are entitled to have the type of relationship you want, and if that isn't what he wants then dont hang about being convenient for him.

Good luck OP. You need to work out what you are happy with and I hope he wants the same thing.

I have recently walked away from a man who didn't want commitment or monogamy aswell. Whilst it hurts and I miss him, I know I have done the right thing as keeping it going on his terms would have hurt me in the long run. I liked him too much. I would have been OK if I hadn't.

You again

Come on Jazzy, how old are you FFS? If you're old enough to be having sex with a man, you're old enough to be direct about what you want. Doesn't mean he has to agree, but stop playing games! I hope you don't think it's always a man's prerogative to set the terms and conditions of a relationship, do you?

Like I said on your last thread, I don't think you're cut out for FWB relationships. They only ever work when both parties are honest and direct with one another.

Hatty yes me again, although Ive sort of made done progress since last thread?

In terms of meeting up to talk, we will at some point this week, but it's tricky finding a time, he has his daughter most weekends and we both work late night jobs, but normally on different nights... Nothing has been arranged yet but it will happen.

I've realised now that im not cut out for FWB, had never tried it before this guy, and wouldn't get into that sort of arrangement again.

good for you. recognising what you dont want is a step closer to realising what you do want. if FWB is what he wants, and you will know by what he is saying and they way he is engaging with you, then that is your cue to say "hey, i've had a great time but i'm just not into this." you know it isn't what you want so dont let him make it sound appealing to you. you know your own feelings and you know in your gut what you want so dont be afraid to wait for the right person to find that with. if he isn't offering what you want then you will be doing him a favour by letting him know. dont waste your own enrgy and emotions on something you dont want.

The 'snuggles are for relationships' thing....do you and him 'snuggle'? or not?

If not then clearly he is telling you that he sees what you have as casual and not 'relationship' ground.

At the start we didn't, but now we do. The last time I was at his we were both tired so didn't have sex and fell asleep snuggling. And it's him that will pull me into his arms, I'm not forcing it on him or anything because I'm very conscious of the fact that he was against it at first.

For the last couple of weeks, snuggles and spooning etc are all a given. so I sort of took this as him showing that he's open to a relationship as well?

Remember there is nothing wrong with not going along with this FWB farce. You have been seeing him 2-3 times a week. It is a relationship imo and you have every right to feel miffed if he refuses to define it as such. I personally think FWB is a haven for some men. Regular sex without fidelity or commitment, who wouldn't love it .

no, take this as him using your body for comfort. dont read this as him taking things to the next stage. it is pure comfort. sorry but it is.

Adam that's what I think. I think what we have already is a relationship, but he doesn't want to admit it. Because I know he's a decent guy I'm giving him the benefi of the doubt as to his reasons for this, messed up past relationships etc, I think hes telling himself it's easier if he doesn't commit, but in reality he kinda already has?

I dunno maybe I'm clutching at straws here but I really do feel like he cares for me. We meet up often, its not secret that were are hooking up, we text all the time etc. and he's mentioned stuf in passing before that could be taken as signs e wants more? Eg mentioning about how he has an agreement with his ex that before new partners can meet their daughter, they would have to be introduced to the other parent. Why would he tell me this otherwise? I sidestepped away from this comment though because even thou gh I want a relationship, it's still far too early to be meeting his daughter.

"it's easier if he doesn't commit, but in reality he kinda already has? "

honestly? i yhink this is wishful thinking on your part. i think this is what you want to believe. you cannot second guess what is going on in his head. you need him to say it out loud what he thinks the relationship is.

Well all I can say is that at the grand old age of 36, I know if I were to find myself single again, I wouldn't waste a spare moment of my time mooning around after a fuck buddy, waiting for him to decide whether or not I make the grade.
I would only be bothered to stir for a guy that made me feel wonderful!

I have a few paramours on the go and, although there's no way I'll commit to a full-on relationship with any of them, there's no bar to snuggling, spooning and generally being tactile.

The problem is that your meetings with him has been confined to your respective homes. Next time you're both free to 'meet up' tell him you'll see him at x y or z bar and start engaging in another environment where he may begin to view you as more than a convenient late night shag.

I seem to recall I advised you to play it cool before and you reported some success with this strategy.

It seems to me that all you need to do is stop being an acquiescent leg and start moving yourself into pole position as a girlfriend by getting him to meet you in neutral venues before you hit the sack together - and if you're too exhausted for sex, make your excuses and go home alone when the evening's at an end.

In short, make him work for it, honey!

Jazzybuttons: you don't have a Relationship. That doesn't happen without the consent of both people involved.

FFS stop telling yourself that he's really The One and just won't admit it. He likes you, sure. He enjoys your company and presumably enjoys having sex with you as well, but he doesn't want a committed relationship with YOU.
Really you should walk away gracefully, but before you do so, have a think about why you are so desperate for commitment from him. If you are gagging for a partner-to-share-your-life-with, you're actually not in a good state to be dating or having sex at all, because desperation sees off the nice guys and is a magnet for predators. If you don't feel desperate, ask yourself if you've absorbed the crappy unhelpful binary myth that sex is either part of truelove and soulmatery or casual unfeeling PIV with no friendliness or even common courtesy. There's a very long sliding scale in relationships, partly affected by time: anyone declaring undying love and serious commitment after a fortnight is likely to be a nutter, a con artist or an abusier.

IAmBooyhoo, but if it was that simple, why wouldn't he have been snuggling from the start? why clearly define what we had, put up rules and barriers, and then remove them, just because he's using my body as comfort? the total U-turn he's done implies that something has changed rather than just using my body.

I'm not saying that it means relationship, I could be reading that wrong, but its definitely something that has changed from his point of view since we starting hooking up, rather than him using my body for comfort