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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

How long would you wait for him?

81 replies

jenrose29 · 06/04/2012 15:53

Hi, I've posted here once before about DP but will give a quick overview. We've been together for 2.5 years, he seperated from his wife a few months before we met as she left him for another man and took their two children (aged 1 and 2 at the time) with her. I was seperated from my daughters father, who was 2 at the time. Even though his wife had multiple affairs and left him, she made his life very difficult after seperation - racking up debts and expecting him to pay, stopping him seeing the kids, causing problems in our relationship etc. We stuck together and after just over a year together my daughter and I moved 30 miles to be closer to him (though we didn't move in together.) She continued to make life as difficult as possible for him and he continued to do whatever she told him (i.e. not knowing until the morning he was due to collect kids whether he'd see them or not, her giving him one days notice that she had moved out of their house and hadn't paid the mortgage so he'd have to, she had a baby and gave her his surname and told everyone she was his and so on) and he said that he was waiting until they'd been seperated for 2 years and then he was going to divorce her.

We discussed trying for a baby of our own as, aside from her interference, our relationship is absolutely fantastic. My daughter adores him and his children, when we get to see them, fit in well and get on well with my daughter. We started trying in July last year and I fell pregnant in October. He was over the moon, as was my daughter and I was really excited about the future. However, his wife continued to cause problems for him regarding debts and stopping him seeing his kids yet he continued to do nothing about making formal arrangements for contact with the kids or getting divorced. It got to the end of Feb and finally I could keep quiet no longer and told him that it was ridiculous that I was so far pregnant and that he hadn't made any attempt at starting to get divorced, and that while he is still so embroiled with his wife we can't even move in together. He apologised and said he would get it sorted immediately.

He saw a solicitor the following week. His solicitor wrote a draft letter she proposed to send to the wife, which admittedly was quite harsh - i.e. if you do not consent to divorce we will have no option but to file for unreasonable behaviour on grounds of your affairs, if you do not make contact arrangements with our client we will seek a contact order etc. He called his solicitor and had it changed to pretty much kissing his wifes backside to get her to consent to the divorce and had his solicitor agree to the contact arrangements his wife wants him to have, which he actually can't fulfill. It was only after the letter was sent that he told me what it contained, whereby I advised him that he is silly to make contact agreements he cannot keep as she will then say he is letting the kids down - and she'd be right. He called her to tell her he couldn't actually do what he'd promised and low and behold, she stopped him seeing the kids again! She had a solicitors appointment the following day and told him not to contact her again. That was a month ago. His solicitor has chased hers up but they have heard nothing, and he has done as he was told and not contacted his wife. I'm now 32 weeks pregnant with no prospect of anything being sorted. His shifts mean that as we aren't living together and can't until his issues are resolved, he'll see our baby a couple of times per week at most so I'll pretty much be a single mum. I love him very much, but I just want to have a normal family life. Is that too much to ask? For 2.5 years now my daughter and I have fitted in around his work and his wifes whims about whether he can see the kids or not and I don't want this baby to have to do the same. Though he promised, yet again, a month ago to get it sorted it's been several weeks and he hasn't done anything. How long would you wait?

OP posts:
Doha · 07/04/2012 11:59

Sorry OP if he really wanted to sort stuff out with his ex, he would have done it long before now.

I switch between thinking either he is lazy or he is quite happy the way things are.

But he is a mouse not a man either way. He needs to grow a pair.

namechangernumber9 · 07/04/2012 12:09

DH had a difficult divorce with issues re finances and contact too.

Due to our age and exw making life difficult and dragging divorce out, we moved in together and carried on with our lives, she had been involved elsewhere for a number of years as well.

It wasnt pleasant but it was better than the alternative.

Eventually he went against his solicitors advice and filed for divorce before the finances were sorted and also while the contact issues were still being resolved.

If we had waited for everything to be amicable, we would still be waiting, and its been 7 plus years.

If he wanted to be with you, he would be, concentrate on you DD and the new baby, either accept the status quo or tell him to get stuffed.

I accepted that DHs situation wasnt of his making, but I wouldnt have accepted putting our lives on hold while it got resolved.

jenrose29 · 07/04/2012 12:14

namechangernumber9 We don't have the option of moving in together and carrying on with our lives unfortunately. At any time she could put more debts onto him/claim for spousal maintenance etc and the extra cost would mean he would have to give up his house and go and live in work-related accomodation where the children and I could not join him, thus we would be homeless.

OP posts:
namechangernumber9 · 07/04/2012 12:19

in this country she would be unlikely to get spousal maint, and why cant he come and live in your house????

ameliagrey · 07/04/2012 12:27

Jenrose you have asked for advice and opinions- are you taking any notice of anything people say?

Because to me it looks as if you are constantly defending this man.

You have a very odd set of values and moral compass.

When you wrote this I have made clear to him that I would never ever get engaged to him for many years as I suspected (and was told) he was going to propose you seem to be saying oh, it's fine to have his child, bring a child into all of this with a father they may never know, who cannot provide for them financially, blah balh, but it's not okay for me to commit to him.

In my book, having a child with a man is THE biggest commitment anyone could ever have. Forget engagements and marriage- it's a lifelong bond. Or it ought to be if you have the child's interests at heart.

In all of this, yoou have never mentioned the fact that in the midst of all this mess is a child who is going to grow up.

I doubt too whether the wife- or even ex-wife- could impose financial demands that would mean any current partner he has (you) and their own child would be homeless. Either he has pulled the wool over your eyes, or you are pulling it over your own.

I don't know what you want anyone to say. You have got yourself into amess by having a baby with a man who doesn't want to get out of his marriage, for whatever reason.

What exactly are you asking?

ameliagrey · 07/04/2012 12:36

Also Jenrose having now just read the other back posts about him and the gender of this baby- wow- what a man you have chosen!

You don't seem to see the situation in the way that it really is.

You refer to him as the "stepfather" to your DD. he isn't. He is a boyfriend of yours who is currently still married to another woman.

The term stepfather is used when a man is married to and takes on the financial responsibility and care of his wife's child. You are not even living together.

You appear to be constantly crediting this man with qualities he doesn't have yet utterly unwilling to see him as he appears to us.

jenrose29 · 07/04/2012 12:48

namechangernumber9 His solicitor has advised that she would be likely to get spousal maintenance if she applied as she is a single parent with 3 children aged 4 and under. He can't come and live in my house because he has to live within a certain distance from work, which my house isn't, plus he wouldn't be able to afford to contribute because he is paying off several debts she incurred and now only pays £1 per month towards.

ameliagrey I'm not defending him, I wouldn't have posted if I didn't have a problem with how things are. I just don't see the point in people assuming that he stays married because he wants to be with her etc when realistically he hates her and hasn't had a civil conversation with her in 3 years. There is no case of having a child that may never know it's father, even if things did go wrong between us I would make sure that he was involved. But choosing to have a child was looking at our long-term future rather than short-term problems. If everything else is perfect except for outside problems caused by someone else, then that's a pretty good base for having a child I think. The financial concerns are real and again it is me that has pointed them out, not him so he is not pulling the wool over my eyes. If anything, he pulls it over his own. At the moment he is paying £350 p/m in maintenance, £400 in debts, plus his own rent and living costs. At any time she could pass on more debts, claim spousal maintenance or indeed maintenance for the child she has had by someone else since they split as she has his surname and has been born within the marriage.

He has got a solicitors letter this morning which says she will agree to the divorce, though she has lied and said he hasn't seen the children by his own choice. So there's progress of sorts.

OP posts:
namechangernumber9 · 07/04/2012 12:54

Seriously, Id get a second opinion, spousal maint is now an outmoded concept except for the super rich.

If she has debts she can pass onto him they must be in joint names??? I wouldnt live with that over my head.

QuintessentialShadows · 07/04/2012 12:54

OP, you are a fool.

It does not matter one jot what he sats he wants. Look at his actions. They speak a lot louder than words.

QuintessentialShadows · 07/04/2012 12:54

says not sats.

ameliagrey · 07/04/2012 13:00

Having a child was looking at our long-term future rather than short-term problems. If everything else is perfect except for outside problems caused by someone else, then that's a pretty good base for having a child I think.

Jen I'm sorry but you are a fantasist.

Most people with an ounce of sense wait to have a child until everything is sorted. I suspect you encouraged him to give you a baby( and now it's not the gender he wanted) to tie him to you- and it hasn't worked, has it?

Everything else is not perfect. No way.

You are both utterly irresponsible.

This man cannot afford to support you, his own children and another child.

Why on earth did you and cannot see that?

You are constantly coming up with excuses which make him seem as if he is hard done by , whereas what he needs is to go to court, get the money sorted out, and make a new life.

namechangernumber9 · 07/04/2012 13:00

re the last child, a £60 DNA test would resolve that issue.

namechangernumber9 · 07/04/2012 13:02

actually, we had a child while trying to sort everything, because of age pressures re waiting - I dont see the problem there as such, its the not living together etc thats an issue for me.

jenrose29 · 07/04/2012 13:13

ameliagrey Not everyone has the choice to wait to have a child. No I didn't encourage him to give me a baby to tie him to me, that is a ridulous suggestion. I am not trying to 'keep' him or trap him and it's a pretty pathetic assumption to make. Please tell me, how is everything else not perfect? His finances and his wife and his divorce are all linked. Once he is divorced then these issues cannot worsen and can be resolved. We are not in the dark ages, a man doesn't have to financially support his woman - a woman can support herself you know. I am capable of supporting myself and the children, I am just not willing to support him while he continues to let things get worse for himself financially. He can and does financially support his other children.

OP posts:
QuintessentialShadows · 07/04/2012 13:18

But, in spite of you saying everything is perfect between you, he has still not managed to sort his divorce? Hmm

Methinks you are a windup merchant.
Either a fool or a windup merchant.

jenrose29 · 07/04/2012 13:24

Because his divorce really has had no bearing on our relationship. Just because we are going well doesn't mean he should be rushing to get divorced so we can get married.

OP posts:
namechangernumber9 · 07/04/2012 13:24

jen you do know he can get divorced without having sorted out the finances, my DH did as it was taking so long, I was heavily pregnant and the idea of him still being married was unsettling because of the legal implications.

Ie if he was incapacitated, I could have been banned from hospital, not able to make decisions, etc, those were not things that were acceptable to me.

The financial rows went on and on and on after divorce, but he was no longer married.

He did go against legal advice to do this, but it was important to both of us that his legal ties to his ex were cut.

namechangernumber9 · 07/04/2012 13:25

PS I wouldnt get married until financial issues were resolved, but that didnt mean he had to stay married!

jenrose29 · 07/04/2012 13:26

namechangernumber9 It is not the financial matters that are waiting to be resolved as much. Yes, there are debts but fortunately the marital home was sold and so there are not too many financial issues. It is more the children and contact that need to be arranged before the divorce can progress.

OP posts:
tribpot · 07/04/2012 13:29

On your earlier thread you noted "He said if I can give him a boy next time then I'm definitely his perfect woman...!". Could he be hedging his bets until you present him with a son? I had thought Henry VIII was approximately the last husband who went in for that kind of behaviour but you never know.

namechangernumber9 · 07/04/2012 13:32

jenrose, contact will never, ever , ever be resolved, if the mother wants to play games with it, if thats whats holding the divorce, then tell him to push it through. DHs children are adults now, and contact is still an issue!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Regardless of what goes into the divorce papers/is legally agreed, there will be grief afterwards.

I have ever sympathy as to why you would have a baby in this situation, but not that he is still married.

jenrose29 · 07/04/2012 13:35

But the divorce will not go through if the statement of arrangements for children are not agreed, which at the moment they are not going to be.

OP posts:
MickyDodger · 07/04/2012 13:35

You purposefully planned a baby with a married man, whom you don't live with, who can't sort out his own divorce or stick to contact arrangements for the children he already has. And you're surprised at the mess you find yourself in?
You need to grow up and put your children before your man-child.

ameliagrey · 07/04/2012 13:39

jenrose29 Sat 07-Apr-12 13:13:59

ameliagrey Not everyone has the choice to wait to have a child.

I'm sorry but they do.

What an utterly stupid thing to say.
Are you trying to say that somone else made you have a child- or that you are late 40s and had to get a move on somehow?

You chose to have this baby. You did it to try to create a bond. He is now disappointed that it is not a son. he already has a son but because he is too weak and bone idle to sort out his marriage/divorce, he only sees his son every 6 weeks.

You are being a fool.

namechangernumber9 · 07/04/2012 13:42

yes it will, I cant remember what DH put on his, but the contact arrangements were not resolved and the divorce went through, I dont want to go into too much detail, but I promise you, there were hotly contested contact arranements for years post divorce.