are 22 year old daughter's expectations realistic/fair?

[PollySE12]

I have a 22 year old daughter. I'm 39 years old. She is a recent graduate and lives in a flatshare with friends. She visits me about once every 6 weeks and she has recently complained to her father (who I'm no longer in a relationship with) that I don't give her "spending money" when she comes to visit. Apparently she expects me to give her £20 or £30 at the end of our time together and she is angry that I am not doing this.

When she visits I always take her out for dinner, lunch etc.

Is it the norm to give a person of that age spending money each time?

Secondly, my daughter frequently complains that she finds my appearance and my social life "inappropriate". She is referring to the fact that I still make an effort with my appearance, wear lipstick etc and also that I go to the gym, enjoy a social life with my friends etc. The look on her face the other day and the comments she made, when she saw me re-applying my lipstick was quite astounding. She constantly has little digs at me.

Is it really so unusual for a 39 year old woman to still keep up her appearance? Could this have anything to do with the fact that my daughter has chosen not to take care of her appearance and doesn't attend to personal hygiene, is obese etc? (Yes I have tried to gently coax her into taking more care of herself but she gets very defensive about it.)

I am 26 - its not the done thing for grown up children to be demanding "pocket money". She should pay her way at meals as well me and my mum will take turns to pay for a meal out (when I was 21 I couldnt really afford this but I at least offered to pay). Sometimes my Mum would give me money / buy me a present(e.g. a new top) as a recent (poor) grad I was v greatful but never expected it.

She is also well out of order to make nasty comments about your appearance. Wouldnt dream of saying this to my Mum.

Sorry cant give you any advice OP - just know she is not living in the real world with her demands.

Fucking hell. Your dd sounds like a spoiled brat. Who does she think she is to be making comments about your appearance? How rude is that! And as for the money, well perhaps she will grow up and realise not everyone gets a free ride? I had a job when i was 15, my mum never gave us pocket money so if i wanted something i had to pay for it myself, why shouldn't she?

Are you being nasty to her about her weight? Are you harping on all the time.
You've mentioned it here in your posts so maybe she is just pissed off with you.

No, it's not even an option to mention her weight at all. A few years ago her Dad broached the subject with her and she then threatened suicide. Her Dad tends to be gentle with her so I'm sure he wouldn't have said anything mean. So I avoid bringing the weight issue up with her. The gym subject came up simply because she was saying all her friends go to the gym.

I have to admit I thought a little of what GreenEyedMunster said - but not nearly as harsh . It is possible that she thinks you are criticising her, I know it's hard to get feeling across in posts but it does come across that you are a little cold/numb about her and her behaviour.

Has she always been like this growing up, or has she suddenly turned against you since she went to flatshare?

My cousin is 22 and has been doing bar work evenings and weekends while at uni so she can send money back to her mum who is struggling.

She certainly wouldn't be criticising her mother or expecting a handout.

Your DD sounds very immature and grasping I am afraid. Has she always been like this?

But you do 'gently coax' her about her appearance, according to your first post. One persons 'gentle coaxing' is another persons 'constantly banging on about it'.

Teanosugar - our daughters sound so similar!

The trouble is, there are a lot of parents who fund their twenty-something children and it must be hard for of those who don't have that financial cushion to see their friends having so much support.

Like you, OP we gave our oldest daughter 'treats' rather than sums of money but her housemates had parents who were contributing huge sums, bought them new cars and provided the money to run them and, in one case, supported the feckless boyfriend as well, so he wouldn't have to move away.

DD did get quite resentful and stroppy in her early twenties when she had to earn her own money but now she is excellent at budgeting and has the satisfaction of knowing that her achievements are all her own success.

What's strange is that she was in exactly the same position as most undergraduates- they fund their own gap years, get part time work in the summer or through the semester, live with other people to reduce costs. It's not an unusual situation by any means, so I don't see why she should have such a bad attitude after everything you've done for her. None of mine are at university but my two nieces and another nephew is and when they go back home they find free food and clean bathrooms to be heaven in comparison to shared houses and independent living with other young adults.

It's desperately sad to see someone doing this to themselves. She is sabotaging her relationship with you, her body, her future- if she expects things like money to just be handed over to her then that will limit her. A sense of entitlement can be very damaging to her prospects. The worst thing you could do would be to hand over more money to her.

I don't know what you can do for your DD, really. If she wants things to be different then she has to change and work at herself. But it sounds as if she is engulfed in being unhappy and wallowing in that. Sympathies

'spending money' is for kids and, although she's behaving like a kid, she isn't one. If I were you I'd give her lunch/dinner at your place the next time you see her actually I'd probably not bother seeing her much at all; her behaviour sounds appalling and if/when she complains, explain that eating out all the time is 'completely out of your budget'.

And how you dress/use make-up etc is none of her business and she is old enough to be roundly told so. I agree that maybe you could ease off on the comments about her appearance though; I'm not accusing you of nagging or anything but it's a good way to demonstrate that uninvited personal comments about appearance are not particularly good manners.

My mum is 60 and still wears make-up, does lots of exercise (tennis) and has a considerably more active social life than me. I'm not embarrased, I'm happy for her.

It sounds like it might be rooted in jealousy though, if she struggles with her weight and appearance she might resent that you seem to have it easy? Not your fault, but might be where it is coming from?

She needs to grow up, frankly.

She sounds ungrateful but you're allowing it. She'll change maybe when you behave differently, eg don't Take her out for meals, do free nice things together.

ChrisFenton,

She is actually treated with kid gloves somply because if we were to say anything perceived as even mild criticism she would go off the deep end. You know that feeling when you have to 'walk on eggshells' around someone?

So none of the stuff I've said in these posts are things I can actually say to her. The most I do is ocassionally say things like "I bet that skirt would look lovely on you". Once she put her hair up in a sort of bun and I said "ooh that looks great". She immediately shouted "so you hate my hhair when I wear it down then?!" And later she started crying and saying she is ugly.

She's been rather like this ever since she gained the weight at around 13

You brought her up OP...you sound surprised at her manners and also like you have a not very nice sneery attitude about her. I can't imagine talking about my DD like this.

I should also add that the idea of being supported by my parents post-uni would never have occurred to me (they kindly supplemented my income while I was a student; I also had part-time jobs and huge overdrafts and lots of loans throughout my student years.

Since I left uni, I've thought of anything bought for me by my parents, from a coffee to dinner or an item of clothing, as a present, and received it as such e.g. gratefully and with a thank-you.

I may be totally barking up the wrong tree here, but are there any health conditions that could partially account for your daughter's weight and/or seeming issues about appearance? I only ask because the "so you hate my hhair when I wear it down then?!" and crying sound very much like pubescent/teen behaviour and if she had some sort of health condition (hormonal ...?) that might be a reason.

It sounds like she has some terrible insecurities then. Has she ever talked to anyone about it? The suicide threat concerns me, that's an extreme reaction to something someone who cares for her has said.

Sorry OP, I know she is being a hurtful brat to you but perhaps she needs help with something else

I agree with LauraShigihara - I think my dad is still subsidising my sister at the age of 31, never mind 22! (This never happened when I was in my twenties although he did help me to buy my first car). So there is a sense of entitlement among some people of her age but that's no reason for you to give into it.

I would brush off her comments about your appearance (lipstick FGS) but I would be careful not to make her feel criticised about her weight. This is something I have always had from my mum and it hasn't helped me.

Not being able to have a gap year - oh dear, my heart breaks. Nothing to stop her from saving up and going travelling now, is there? I would definitely call her on her comments about you not understanding how hard it is to pay rent. Why shouldn't she understand that, much as you love her, being a mum at such a young age was very tough?

Sorry OP, I know she is being a hurtful brat to you but perhaps she needs help with something else

I got therapy for her in her teens for a bit. The doctor said she had symptoms of Bipolar but that it couldnt be formally diagnosed until adulthood. After a short while DD said she wanted to quit therapy.

Prior to age 13 we had a wonderful relationship.

Agree with Fenton - she sounds as if she's quite unhappy and has been for some time, and that she is blaming you for it, or at least taking it out on you. Given how defensive she obviously is I'm not sure at all how you'd tackle this, but it does sound as though it's about more than just the 'spending money' or the fact that she has unrealistic expectations of how a 'mum' should act/dress.

She is behaving like a child - did anything else (apart from puberty) happen around the time she gained the weight? She does sound a little as though she's got 'stuck' in her teens somehow.

Ah, x-posts, Polly. Do you think she might consider therapy again? Any way you could approach it differently? How would she react, do you think, if you just told her that you love her and are really concerned that she doesn't seem happy? That you miss how your relationship used to be. (If you haven't already said it in so many words, that is.)

How old was she when you and her Dad split up? Could she still have unresolved problems with that, the split loyalties/blame/confusion?

OP Is this the same daughter or another one?

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/lone_parents/1304833-Desperately-need-some-guidance

She won't have therapy unfortunately. She did share with me that her GP has suggested she see a psychiatrist. She is currently on some medication: anti-depressants and, I think, anti-psychotics. I asked how she's getting on with the meds, and she just shrugged.

She is clearly not at all happy. And it feels impossible now to "reach" her and truly help her.