Very sad about a friendship going sour and its all MY FAULT

[veryworried29]

Namechanging long-termer here. I post under this name when its something sensitive or embarrassing or secret.

Basically I am a shit person with a shit attitude and I hate myself but I cannot do anything about this attitude. Or perhaps I can ... but how?

My oldest best friend (known her for 30 years) has done something I don't approve of, nothing illegal, and she has done it for (almost) understandable reasons ... but I can't get over it!!

I don't want to go into the specifics. It involves education (a v v v sensitive area I know) but it has made this subject undiscussable afaic, whereas she just wants to talk about it all the time.

I have been avoiding her for weeks ... feeling guilty ... want to get over myself.

Any ideas on how I can just let it go?

P.S. I know I will be judged on this but can we please take note of the fact that this is not an aibu? and I want to be nice, I really do, so please help me rather than flame me. Tia.

Op- if you value your friend then you wouldn't care how she educates her children. you really wouldn't give a monkey's arse unlessyou were a tinsy bit jealous.

Sorry I've come back so late to this and thanks all for your thoughts.

Dozer - I know I am being judgemental and I don't like myself for it, as you will hopefully see from what I have said in my op.

I am asking for ideas on how not to be so judgemental because I do value her friendship and I would feel absolutely rubbish if I lost contact with her. HOWEVER she has been talking "at" me on this subject re. her child's education for a couple of years now (and bless her, she can go on and on and on and on). And now that my child is at the same stage of school life, df wants to know all the ins and outs of the application process, the waiting lists, how I feel about the school my child is going to.

But although we have a lot in common and have known each other such a long time, the schools our dc will be going to are just about polar opposites of each other. I feel that we will have less in common because our dc will have less in common. I feel really surprised and almost shocked (but, nb, not jealous I did have a little giggle at that suggestion, was waiting for it to come along), because she has gone down a route I would never go down. So I find it very hard to be "in tune" with her, iykwim.

Am going to have to say something, I think, but can't begin to see how to say it.

If you love your friend and what she's done is just something that badly 'jars' with your belief system/way of thinking or whatever, I think I'd be inclined to just put it down to human weakness and that she must have her reasons for doing what she's doing, and just waiting for it to die down and trying as hard as you can to forgive/forget. Old/good friends are not an easily replaceable commodity and I think it would be hard to know someone for 30 years and for them not to do something you don't really condone over such a long period of time.

Have just read your last message very worried and I'd really not want to lose/upset a friendship over this. It's just not worth it. Tbh I wouldn't have it out with her either. What school her kids go to won't change your friendship or your dc's if you don't want it to. DD and some of her friends were/are chalk and cheese - wildly different personalities, interests, backgrounds, nationalities, religions etc yet that 'x' factor was there and they just clicked. I don't have many things in common with some of my closest friends either. You're friend just wants the best for her dc's. I wouldn't let it come between you.

is she home schooling?

My minds boggling at what this crime could be?

Home schooling V boarding school perhaps?

I bet she's lied about where she lives /rented a flat for 6 months to get a school place at the best local school instead of sending her child to a lower-achieving one

I thought Blu's post was very wise and agree that your friend's choices are about her and not a criticism of your choices. Do you have any reason to believe your friend will be less than supportive of the choices you're making about your own child's education? Or is she genuinely oblivious of the knots you are tying yourself into about this matter?

forty doing that is common around where I live, renting properties, pretending to be catholic, I live near a city in the west country and the fight for secondary schools there is a mean game, some schools are shit beyond belief where as others are held in such high esteem that parents will do anything to get their dc in, I find it hard to believe someone would fall out over it, it is done so regularly around here,

tbh, if your friendship hinges on making the same choices in life, and being close relies on your children being close - then it really isn't a true friendship. It's more a friendship of convenience, dependent on you both being in broadly the same circumstances. A true friendship between people happens even if their lives are different in every way and they still feel close, because it isn't dependent on any outside circumstance, iyswim.

Look, if she's banging on about something - you have the right to say you're sick of hearing about it!

That's the thing about a real, good, true friend. You can let out a scream and go oh GOD I am so sick of hearing about this, you daft bat.

And they'll still love you and you them.

It is what fortyplus says, isn't it?
I find it utterly repugnant but also endemic. If I cut off everyone who does it, I'd have hardly any friends! Some have the decency to keep quiet about it but some just go on and on, I think bragging about how clever they are to have beaten the system. People get obsessed. I always try to change the subject.

I really think that you would get far more constructive advice if you gave details of the issue and what your friend has done.

For example, I would guess that she has lied to get her child into a school that both you and she would have loved to get a place in but knew it was unlikely/impossible. Her actions therefore show that not only is she prepared to act immorally, but also to do so and put herself ahead of you - there's an element of you feeling that she's sold YOU out as well as her morals, placed your interaction on a different footing. Like pushing ahead of you, her friend, to grab the last fantastic dress in the sale

If that's the kind of situation it is, I can see why you are so conflicted, and why it's more to you than a case of 'live and let live - don't judge' - you're feeling that a comment has been made by her on how she views her solidarity with you. But you know that isn't logically true (you could have pulled a fast one too if you'd wanted to) so you are all at sea.

I'm sure lots of others have been in the same boat there and could advise more specifically on how to not gauge your friendship by this, and on how to manage her now, how not to extrapolate from this event until you get to 'she'd sell me out for a penny' etc.

But I could be totally off beam there!

So. It sounds to me that it's the circumstances of the actual events which have made this something you can't get to grips with (because as you say, it's not as simple as 'being jealous' - you genuinely wouldn't have wanted to take the path she has). For whatever reason, the specifics of her actions have hit you where it hurts, it's that that you need to unpick.

I thought it might be that, but the OP said it was nothing illegal and I interpreted that to mean nothing that broke any laws, rules or regulations - which would rule out lying to get a place you are not entitled to.

So that left making a different choice and one she is entitled to make. iyswim.

Oh sorry I missed that bit then.

Hmm, the bit of what I said that I think might hold something for you then:

you feel that what she has done says something about how she views your friendship/you. You feel she's sold you out in some way as well as her morals. That you now think that she'd do the dirty on you if she needed to. The question is - is this a fair feeling, or is it just that school admissions etc. are so emotive - hits right at the heart of you trying to do the best for your dc and worrying that you haven't - that you are reading more into this than you should.

Eeek that probably doesn't help at all.

I have had a similar situation. Close friend from school days did something that I felt was unacceptable. Basically she ended up working with someone she had a previous issue with and went off with stress for 6 months (to the day - went back the moment half pay was about to kick in (public sector)). In the time she was off she spent her days shopping, dating, exercising etc and was quite open about the fact that it was all a bit of a scam. I work in the public sector and it really got to me. It was the dishonesty and the fact that my taxes were going to fund her full pay whilst she was off. I did say something. There was no contact for ages afterwards. We have met a few times since but it was awkward and i haven't heard from her in years.

It is a shame but ultimately the friendship couldn't have continued normally anyway. You need to think carefully I guess about the potential consequences before you say anything.

lovely I work in public sector and that happens quite alot sadly !

It seems to me that the issue is not so what the difference is, and more the fact that the OP has had to listen to her bang on about it for two years.

Can you not tell her to stfu somehow, OP?

Can't you be honest, to a degree and say you are surprised by her decision and ask what has made her decide to do that? Then listen and then understand her choice is just tgat and it's actually none of your business.

It is hard when it seems a very good friend isn't who you thought they were.

Oh for god's sake just say what it is. You have name changed and it's an anon forum. I think it absolutely matters what she's 'done' in order for people to understand and advise you.

One of my closest friends drives me mad sometimes with her obsessive views on issues I find completely inconsequential and we will be snappy and irritable with each other, without actually confronting it (though sometimes we will). I just back off from her a bit for a few weeks and then it always blows over.

It doesn't matter what this friend has 'done'. We'll all have opinions about whether it was OK, but why should the OP give a shit what we think? She's asking for advice on managing feelings and not screwing up a friendship.

[judgy pants] le flying fuck does a parents choice for their childs education have to do with friendship?

My dear friends have made a tonne of life choices i would never agree on but thats fine because its their life, not yours. [/judgy pants]

I think the issue at hand is with you rather than the education thing. I'd maybe go get some therepy and figure out why your being like this. People will make different choices in life its something you need to accept and learn to deal with.

This is ridiculous. And so disrespectful of anybody's time trying to advice you.

What on earth is the point of coming up with a whole range of of scenarios that could or could not be relevant to you op?

If the friend in question is reading the thread, she will already guess it is about her, so you might as well say what the issue is and get responses that might actually be helpful to you.

But I agree with the sentiment that if your friendship is based around you and her being in the same circumstances, it is not really a friendship.

Sorry to have annoyed some of you by not logging on to Mumsnet so far today! I have been out enjoying the sunshine, getting the garden furniture spruced up and being with the kids.

Last night I posted that I'd concluded that I would say something to her just about the general subject, not specifically about what she has done. Just say "oh I'm really fed up to the back teeth with thinking about schools, talking about schools, I honestly don't think I've got anything else to say on the subject" or something like that.

I didn't really expect any more replies tbh, but thank you anyway.

The whole sorry tale involves bursaries, extremely expensive independent schools and cheating the bursary system. I expect some of you would wish her good luck, but I can't bring myself to do that just yet.

I shan't be coming back to the thread. Thanks for your input.

So - basically - she's stealing.

Well, tbh, I wouldn't like to be friends with a thief.