Things plummeted to new depths with h

[feelokaboutit]

After latest argument with h, he is now totally stonewalling me. He is prone to doing this but will normally communicate about logistics to do with kids etc... He has now blasted me into kingdom come (metaphorically!) and is behaving as if I am not there. I asked him two questions today and it was as if I had not spoken.

Am worried what I might have to go through now emotionally .

It is never misbehaving to have an opinion on your children!

You know, you say if it was just you you would leave. Think about that for a second. YOU would leave if you did not have the children to think of. They dont have this choice. But do you think the answer is to stay and force them to live in this atmosphere?

You say he is a lovely father. No, he isnt. Lovely fathers dont call their children stupid. Lovely fathers dont pick fights with their childrens mother, abuse their own bodies and financial security with alcohol. Lovely fathers dont let their children grow up in an atmosphere where their mother is stonewalled, and he does not even communicate basic logistics. Lovely fathers dont make the mother of their children feel fear, and dis-empowerment. Lovely fathers are usually also lovely husbands, and lovely men in general. He is neither.

What do you think you are going to do?

"if I were seriously ill, h would still be on his computer, hardly noticing anything or talking."

This happened to me too! I had just got off the phone to GP who had said to go to A&E. I told Exh and he lifted his head from the computer, and said ok see you later!

Thankfully is now Ex H........

It was my aunt who suggested asking him one more time to come to counselling and if he said no, that I would know to start separation proceedings (ie. to tell him this).
I should clarify that h is not an alcoholic, but his father was. He does have addictive personality traits though as evidenced by his use of the computer.
We are married so I know I wouldn't get "nothing" as it were. I just cannot imagine the fight along the way though.
I really don't know what I am going to do quintessential as I have been in this stuck going round in circles position for so long. I am doing a course which finishes in May which I really want to finish (though am very behind on as my head is frazzled with all of this and I cannot concentrate, plus I am kind over dependent on h, and he never ever asks about it). I want to sort out all stuff in the house which I could not bear to lose if we separate. This probably sounds strange, but I have this feeling I have to have all of that rounded up and somewhere else before initiating any kind of separation. As this seems like a big task - sorting through 10 years of memorabilia (we've been together for 16 years but have had kids for 10), I never get started. Anyway, once course is over and stuff is sorted then I kind of have a clean slate to think more clearly from if that makes any sense.
feelingpositive, glad your ex is your ex!
No I know the atmposphere is not great for kids . I suppose I don't know how much worse being divorced might be.

I apologize that this is backtracking from where the post has gone but I think I need to explain that that autistic spectrum comment was not an excuse for bad behaviour. It is also not a suggestion of dysfunction at all, never. It was just meant to add any possible insight into why some people (males usually) can seem so emotionally cut off. And also to say again, that this is not an excuse at all, but it just might contribute to why there is sometimes a total lack of empathy in some relationships. I'm sorry if my comment was misunderstood.

Sorry again for imposing my experience on you, but my dad is one of my closest friends. An amazing father. And my dm. is a good mum. They treated each other like shit on a shoe. Nasty jibes, silences and other emotional abuse- aimed at each other never us.

I left home at 15. I love my parents and couldn't stand to live with them because whilst they love me they resnted / hated each other. I can tell you that your children are living in a horrid environment, even if you and dh are both 'great' with them.

So financially you'd be worse off? Is a trade off of money for happiness what you want? For your dc? Money isn't that important imo.

Good luck

If he doesn't talk to you for days he's not that "good with the kids". If you are adults you put them first and don't make the kids suffer an "atmosphere" in the house.

Shadowland

I don't think you need to have 'empathy' in order to behave decently in a relationship.

"Not talking for days " is not being emotionally distant, it's being sullen and childish.
My ds lacks empathy but I'd be disappointed (to say the least) if he treated any future dp in the way the OP described.

Is he talking yet?

Shadowland

Spectacular mis-reading of SBC's book there (have you actually read it BTW?)

According to Baren-Cohen, people with ASD CAN do empathy. Affective Empathy (correct emotional response to another's emotional state) is unimpaired. It's the Cognitive Empathy (understanding and analysing another's emotional state/being able to put themselves in the other's shoes) they have trouble with.

I am getting fucking sick and tired of armchair psychiatrists excusing all sorts of egregious behaviour as "a bit autistic'. It's intensely demeaning and disablist. If you neurotypicals really do have all the Empathy Smarts then why do you so spectacularly fail to understand our situation?

It's not the loss of money I am scared of so much as the fight divorce would involve.

I know the atmosphere is not good. I am not the one doing the ostracising though, he is (sorry, feeling slightly defensive). To the point that he has been answering nothing that I say.
Surprisingly though, after a morning like this, he has rung me and suggested we go and talk to someone. I had to finish his sentence and say counsellor? and he said yes. I cannot get across how much of a big thing it is that he has said this because in the past he has been totally condemning of counselling.
So now my task is to find someone (which I told him I would do) but don't really know where to go from here as Relate seems such a mixed bag - some good, some not so much.
I can't get involved in the empathy / autistic spectrum debate as don't feel I know enough about it.
I have no idea how h and I are supposed to be with each other as this is totally unchartered territory. I suppose that going to a counsellor, if we stick with it, will enable us either to be happier together, or to separate kindly. Some of the things about him which I find difficult are so deeply rooted in him I wonder whether he will want to or be able to change them.
I may start a new thread asking for counselling recommendations.
Thank you all so much for your messages and advice. At times when I feel really alone, talking to people on this site makes me feel more human.

Wow thats a breakthrough!

Personally I would suggest that you leave. Stop waiting for him to change - because while you are still there you are still an easy target/place to focus the blame.

In the unlikely event that he makes the connection between his behaviour and your departure then you might have a chance at a happy life together.

If not - you have a chance at a happy life apart from him.

If you don´t leave - you will almost certainly remain unhappy.

It´s really harsh and blunt but theres that old saying - the definition of insanity is to keep doing the same thing and expect the result to be different.

Good Luck - I know how hard it is. x

feelokaboutit i am so sorry but you have described how my husband is almost exactly so i know how you feel. he is also a nasty name caller like fat lazy etc when stressed and can be so awful. also gets stressed about house clutter just the same resentments and that feeling of just being hated cant talk about anyhing other than superficial stuff.

i wish i had some advice but i clearly dont klnow what to do as am stuck in same poosition just wanted to say you are not alone and it helps me to know that i am not as well.

feeliing so upset today as was dd's first birthday and i had made a cake with ds and said when daddy comes we will do candle and singing etc. well he came home in a foul mood and shouted at ds then said crappy birthdays why do u waste so much time making cakes instead of doing anything useful shouted bit more stormed off and is now sitting on comoputer. i am so upset but cant talk about it or show it as will get more abuse. so gutted just wanted a tiny bit of effort for dd even though i know she is too little to know but still

sorry for thread hijack but you are not alone and maybe someone will be able to help?

yummytummy, that's awful, I am so sorry about the cake incident and the other stuff . Making a cake is a lovely thing to do so please don't take on board his abuse, and even though your daughter is little, of course singing to her etc... is part of loving family behaviour. Have you got anyone you can talk to who could help, is your h ever reasonable about anything? Please don't accept the status quo. Maybe start your own thread to get advice and support?
As regards me, I am so gobsmacked that we are actually going to go and see a counsellor that for the moment I am just waiting for that to happen. Don't know if h will commit to seeing one regularly, but at least we are going to the first appointment, and then we can take it from there. My list of things to talk about is kilometres long, don't think he realises . I wonder what kind of home truths I am going to hear as well, but anything is better than living like a dead person.

Caramelised, I will definitely bring up leaving as a possibility when we go to the counselling. Either things become a lot more open and loving between us (in the long term, not overnight), or I think we would be better apart. If that's the case, counselling might help us separate in a civilised manner.

Yummy. that's awful! Ruining your daughters birthday like that. It doesn't matter how stressed someone is there is no excuse for it. All he had to do was put his stress to one side for a moment and sing happy birthday. Instead he ruins her first birthday which you'll never get back and insults you. Totally uncalled for. What a fucking arsehole. And now you can't even say anything as he'll abuse you even more . . .

I mean Jesus! What's going on in HIS life to make him THAT stressed. Fuck all i would imagine. Its just an excuse. He insults you to make him self feel better. What a fucking catch.

Don't let your child grow up around that.