Something a friend said has really upset me

[iusedtohaveanickname]

Not entirely sure I'm posting this in the right place, or even why I'm posting - just to get it off my chest I think. I've name changed.

A couple of weeks ago a very, very close friend made a comment to me that I just can't get over. I think I might be hugely over thinking this and making a huge deal of nothing.

We both have 2 children of similar sort of ages. She had 2 lovely straightforward waterbirths. I had a really awful birth with DS, I won't bore you with the details but it ended in a crash section and 10 days in hospital. Ultimately we were fine, but DS needed a spell in SCBU and I was fairly traumatised. When I had DD I opted for an ELCS, with the full support of my consultant (although he would have supported VBAC too, we went through the options and it was my choice).

My friend is a GP. She was talking to me (in general terms, no names) about one of her patients who is having a real fight on her hands to get an ELCS. Her obstetrician seems to have refused one. My friend was relaying all of this to me, and I was sympathising with this patient's position. And then my friend said "It does seem really unfair. I think she's got a much better case than you had for a section. If I'd been your obstetrician I would have made you try the proper way".

I was just shocked. I didn't really respond. I kind of stuttered through another 10 minutes of stilted conversation, then made my excuses, got the children together and left. I've seen her a couple of times in groups since then, but have avoided any personal conversations.

The thing is that she doesn't even fully know my obstetric history. We've always kind of had an agreement that I don't ask her medical questions as it puts her in an awkward position. So while it has been discussed in general terms (i.e. she knows the gist of what happened with DS's birth, and she certainly knows how upset I was), she doesn't really know the detail (I sat with my consultant and went through my first labour notes, DS's trace, the notes that the team had written up afterwards etc in great detail - it was complicated and there was a lot in there, and I've never felt the need to tell her any of it, or even that I had the option to tell her any of it, as I wouldn't have wanted her to think that I was seeking a medical opinion from her).

I just feel really upset. The decision to have an ELCS was quite a big one for me as really I'm quite a "natural childbirth" fan, in theory - I'd have loved to have had her births. But I made that decision, and it went well, and it was a year ago and not something I'd really given any thought since. And now I feel that it's all been stirred up again, and I just feel judged. IAnd very, very annoyed with her. And that years of friendship might just have been completely ruined by this one comment. I'm totally overreacting, aren't I?

Well she must have realised she made a huge gaffe. I would tell her that she really hurt you with her comment and why.

She will either apologise and you can move on
or she will make excuses and you can reassess the friendship

i'm sure she will be sorry though and probably realises you have been avoiding her because of this

YANBU - her unkind and thoughtless comment is made worse by the fact that she is a doctor and should know better. Wish I had a solution, as I know how painful a friend's criticism can be, but just wanted to cheer you up. (A friend of mine of 30 years said something so hurtful to me a couple of years ago that I am still avoiding her where possible. I wish I had the courage to tell her how I felt and am not sure she knows how upset I was but I am not good at that kind of conversation and so just ran away to lick my wounds)

She must have a mistaken idea of what happened during your DS's birth. So she may not even realise what you're upset about and why.
You don't have to tell her the details, but if you want to salvage the friendship you need to tell her that you're upset and what it's about. If she's a decent person she'll then feel terrible about her throwaway remark and apologise for it.

I think you were unlucky but you can't expect other people to be entirely understanding of exactly what happened to you.

People who have not been in that situation just don't really understand but if you dwell on their insensitivities, then only you are going to suffer in the long run.

How about trying to think positively, ie. that the vast majority of mums will never have to go through what you went through?

I wouldn't assume that she is aware how much she's upset you.

Some people can be spectacularly ignorant about things they haven't experienced themselves and doctors particularly are pretty brusque about health issues sometimes! She may well be totally oblivious about how hurtful her comment was & you may be much better at concealing your reactions than you think.

The longer you leave it the worse it will be. I think you really need to tell her how you feel, and give her a chance to understand and apologise. Call her up, make sure it's a good time to talk and tell her how you felt when she said that.

I would also bd upset. Like you i also had an elective c section following a traumatic first birth in which my precious dd nearly died. I think you made the right decision for you and your birth as only you are qualified to do. I am constantly shocked at the number of people who will make nasty comments about other's choice with no knowledge of the reasons behind this decision, especially not having had first had experience of a birth such as your first. Ultimately we all make the right birth decision for ourselves guvrn our own particular set of circumstances and history, I wish the know-it-all judgy pants of thus would could respect this and just butt out! I would calmly explain how you feel to your friend, especially as medic she should not be imposing her views or judging especially without the facts. Im sure she has now realised how innapropiate she was and will apologise

Your friend was completely out of line - as a friend and as a doctor. She was not in any position to make that comment. As a friend she should support you not judge you for doing what you thought was best. as a doctor not involved in your care she had no right to make such a pronouncement, that was deeply unprofessional.

I think you need to talk to her about how you feel. Or if that's too tricky write to her. Only by doing that and hearing her response will you be able to assess whether you can stay friends.

I think it's a combination of lots of things. That you feel a bit 'guilty' (maybe) that you didn't do it the 'proper' way, a bit jealous of her easy births plus her comment - which was bang out of order. I would definitely bring it up. Well, I say I would. I mean YOU should. I would find it very hard to do. But she needs to know that she hurt you, and if the relationship founders on that then you know it wasn't what you thought it was. Whilst it was a thoughtless comment, it sounds like it came from a judgment that she has already made, so I don't think it was unthinking, (which makes it worse). Sadly, most doctors are very uncompassionate (maybe it's the only way to deal with the day to day pain of others). It's not acceptable though.

Perhaps you are reacting with feelings from your experiences (and why would you not, from what you've hinted, anyone would) rather than what was actually said? You were shocked, you relate that you feel it's all been stirred up again, and indeed it would be - but perhaps it's not really about your friendship with her, and this (which is something that possibly you can feel now, a year on, maybe it's time/you have the space/distance to feel it now?) does need attention, but maybe isn't really about this particular interchange? In brusque shorthand, and I think in your post you have intimations about it, it's not about her, it's about your feelings. You are upset! Of course you are.

definately speak to your friend and tell her that her comment did upset you, if she is a worthy friend she will be devastated and apologise for upsetting you.
xx

Ah, good advice! To be honest, I think she knew the minute she'd said it that she'd upset me. There was a quick subject change and she did try to be very nice to me about unrelated things.

She does know roughly what happened during DS's birth. She knows the medical names terms for what happened, and being a doctor herself I assume that she broadly understands. But bibbty is right that she has not been in that situation and so there is no point dwelling on her insensitivities. She is a decent person, a really nice one normally. I'll find a way to move past it, I'm not good at difficult conversations but maybe I do need to speak to her about it or it will just fester away.

I don't think you're overreacting. Her comment was ill-informed and unnecessary and inconsiderate. And she knew it was ill-informed - she must realise she doesn't know all the details and your history. If I were you I'd be bloody cross.

I don't know how you move on, though. Confront her and tell her how she's made you feel, or just grit your teeth, mentally "demote" her in your list of meaningful friends and remain polite.

It'll be good for her to see that her judgmental attitude (even if it's rare) can be extremely hurtful.

What a bitch.

I would assume that she went to great pains to discuss another patients dilemma with you especially in order to deal you the blow: In her professional and medical opinion she would not have granted you a c section had you been her patient.

I am not surprised you are hurt. And feel judged. But at the end of the day, she has made a real fool of herself. She has discredited herself as a doctor, and as a friend in your eyes. She has acted extremely unprofessionally, both with regards to her own patients, but also regards to judging your medical situation without the knowledge to do so.

If I were you, I would consider reporting her to some sort of authority.

It would be a real shame to let the friendship go. Do you think you would be able to tell her how it upset you? I woody that sometimes I say thoughtless things that really upset people and I don't realise. I would be both grateful and mortified if I was your friend and you spoke to me about it, as well as doing everything to salvage the friendship.

Woody?!!! Worry. Too much toy story obsession from the dc's it's managed to infiltrate my auto correct!

Posting this and reading all of your comments has really helped me to calm down. I really don't think that she said this deliberately. I think it just came out, and she probably regretted it the minute she said it (although clearly still thought it).

I'm sitting here making a mental list of all of the nice things that she has ever done for me. There are so many (one or two of your comments have actually made me feel really protective of her - inside I'm now thinking "No! Don't say that about my lovely friend!" I haven't been thinking of her like that lately, so in a roundabout sort of way, thank you!). It would be a huge shame to throw away a great friendship over this, and at this point it is really my issue. Although I don't think it was an acceptable thing to say, having not been in that position herself she couldn't reasonably be expected to think that her off the cuff remark would make me feel quite so rubbish.

Now I just need to work out how to say something to her - gently, and in a mature and controlled way, but so that we can have the conversation and move on. Preferably without children present.

Mission accomplished!

I knew as soon as I started reading your friend would be a doctor. Sometimes, I've found my doctor friends are quite blunt about these type of topics, or tell you what they would have done (wouldn't have given antibiotics for that type of thing, wouldn't have got X treatment). Sometimes this is massively helpful to me, and I have sought their considered advice, but other times they are just a bit blunt. It's not one friend, I have two like this and have come to the conclusion that they are used to speaking frankly about medical topics to their patients and they sometimes forget that's not appropriate for friends.

I wouldn't personally say anything, but that's just me. I have found this type of rather awkward convo has come up quite a few times since me and my friends have had children, I've made remarks to friends about, say, sleeping and they've taken it personally (I once sent a friend a book which I though was helpful, she took offence). Equally, I have been on the receiving end of casual remarks which have made me wince. I think friendships work best when both friends keep in mind the intentions of the other person, in this instance your friend really really wouldn't have meant anything against you, and probably saw at the time, she'd said the wrong thing. Not worth losing a great friend over, IMO.

Just a thought: if you are dreading having a confrontation, you could always email her a link to this thread saying you've been agonising about how to raise this but reading the messages might be easiest?

Would be better to speak in person but I know how hard that will be. Good luck, however you do it - sounds like it's a good friendship and worth salvaging, but you've got to clear the air first. It was a stupid, thoughtless thing to say, and I agree with an earlier poster about how it's particularly hurtful because it sounds like a view she had formed earlier and it just slipped out this time.
X

I was going to say from your op that it sounded like a slip of the toungue and she must feel rotten. My mum is a bit like that, speaks without engaging but totally without malice.

So Glad you are not going to let it ruin the friendship.

I have friends who are doctors and tbh their attitude towards women and childbirth is shocking.

I go to dinner parties and they sit arund bitching abou people who are too posh to push while talking about how they themselves or their wives are booked in for cs so none of those nasty injuries happen to their vagina. Gosh, that would ruin their sex lives!

Don't even get me started on their thoughts on breastfeeding. The last time I actually got shouted at by my bf for asking if she was planning on doing it. Yes. Shouted at.

They also love suggesting that others doctors are crap and they are great and do this by going on about how they would have taken a non-interventionist approach blah blah blah.

I think i will have to avoid them for a good 9 months when I am preggers!

Me and my sister were talking about birth one day and she came out with the line "Well you didn't have proper children really, did you?" (I had c-sections,first classed emergency but not traumatic - failed induction, and second elective). Our relationship has never recovered fully from that comment, as I'm not one for talking about emotions either.

I don't think you will know if she meant it, how she meant it etc until you speak to her about how it made you feel. If she is a decent person she will apologise for hurting you, even if inadvertently. If she doesn't apologise or at least show recognition of your feelings , then you have your answer, and if that is the case tbh you are probably better off without that kind of person as a friend anyway x