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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

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Original poster

How do I deal with this one? Long and delicate!

31 replies

confusedatbestoftimes · 23/01/2006 17:36

Dp and I have gorgeous 11 week old dd who I would love to take to visit my parents. Unfortunately when I was younger my father was not the most appropriate in his behaviour with me and my sister and both of us can remember times when we were uncomfortable with they way he touched us in areas where he shouldn't have. It affected both of us growing up in the form of eating disorders and I had 8 years of therapy which I was coming to the end of when I met dp. I thought we had sorted out how things would be before TTC with long and open discussions. I also talked to mum about how dp felt. There is no way I would ever put my dd at risk and leave her unattended with my father but I have decided to maintain a relationship with him for sake of family. Dp now very uncomfortable with idea of me taking dd to visit my family (in France). I know this is really complex and would welcome other peoples views. Sorry to ramble on...

OP posts:

jstbcs · 23/01/2006 18:22

any chance you could just get your mum to visit you?

Or go, but don't stay in the house. never leave dd alone. etc...

Am surprised you would want to go at all... unless it was to poison the sick bastard....

(sorry, anger issues)

WigWamBam · 23/01/2006 18:30

I'm surprised you want to go, too and can understand your dh's concerns. I was sexually abused by my grandfather from the age of 6 and I chose not to maintain a relationship with him when I was older. He died a number of years ago, but there is no way I would have gone anywhere near him with my daughter. For me, maintaining a relationship with that man would have sent out a message that what he did to me, and the effect it had on me, was OK.

If you choose to go, you have to make sure that someone is with your dd at all times, day and night.

You are a stronger and a braver person than I am if you can truly put what he did to you behind you, but please don't let your strength put your dd at risk.

wannaBe1974 · 23/01/2006 18:32

I can understand how your DP feels ? the feeling of unease is that much greater when it?s not a member of your own immediate family I think. Can I ask, did you and your father ever talk about what happened when you and your sister were children? And how does your mum feel about it all? Also, how do you feel about your own DD developing a relationship with her grandfather? While she is still a baby it?s easy to maintain the distance, easy to not allow him to hold her or be alone with her etc, but as she grows older her curiosity will grow and she will want to get to know other members of her family better when she is taken to visit them and that is likely to include her grandfather. Is your DD the first grandchild? Or does your sister have children as well? And if so how does she deal with family visits?

Sorry for all the questions but some of these are questions I think you need to have answers to before you take the matter any further.

I would sit down and have a long talk with your DP and see if there is a way you could compromise, maybe get your mum to come over and visit instead of taking your DD over to visit your parents and have to feel uncomfortable about telling him he can?t hold her etc, because if it was my child there?s no way someone who had touched me inappropriately would ever be allowed to even hold my baby, not even once, and I would feel even more strongly about it if it was a member of DH?s family, so I imagine your DP would feel even more strongly about it than you do.

I think you also should have a chat with your mum and tell her how you feel, tell her that you don?t want to go over because of your father, and I would also make it clear from the start that you would never let your DD spend any time without you at her grandparents.

I know this is difficult, but I think you should resolve this before you even make one visit, because once you?ve visited once the pressure will be there to visit again and it will become increasingly difficult to say no.

Good luck

twirlaround · 23/01/2006 18:34

If you will not leave dd alone with your father there is no danger to her. Why does dp still object?

jstbcs · 23/01/2006 18:37

even if her dd isnt left alone with this man, that isn't gonna stop whatever is going through his head...

jstbcs · 23/01/2006 18:40

and quite frankly, i am sure her dh will have to restrain himself from kicking the living daylights out of him...

wannaBe1974 · 23/01/2006 18:45

I agree with JST, these thoughts will be going through his head whether he's left alone with her or not, and it goes deeper than that, it's not just about not leaving her alone, it's about not changing nappies in front of him, not getting her dressed/undressed in front of him, not breastfeeding in front of him, all things which are perfectly innocent things which have been turned into something horrible.

Mercy · 23/01/2006 18:46

Confused, you say you have spoken to your mum re how dp feels. I assume your mum therefore knows what happened to you and your sister. What was her response? (to you/your sister's experience - adn to dp's objections)

elastamum · 23/01/2006 18:47

You might want to think about this long term. It is easy to monitor what is happening to a baby but how will you want things to be when they are 4, 5 ,6 7? Whatever you do now will set a pattern for the future

WigWamBam · 23/01/2006 18:56

Agree with elastamum - it won't always be as easy as it is now to keep him away from your dd. It's not just this visit you need to be thinking about, it's not even about where you want your relationship with him to be - you must seriously think about what your dd's relationship with him to going be.

My mother never knowingly left me alone with my grandfather but he always managed to get at me somehow - I would be left with both grandparents, but he always found a way.

NomDePlume · 23/01/2006 19:00

I have to say that I was abused by my father for a number of years and there is no way on this earth that I would let him near any of my children. No way. I haven't seen him for over 12 years, I have no desire to ever have a person like that in my life again.

I'm with WWB.

WigWamBam · 23/01/2006 19:06

Re-reading your post and the bit that's sticking in my head at the moment is that you have decided to maintain a relationship with him "for the sake of family".

For me, "family" would come a long, long way behind my need to keep my dd safe. Sorry, but I really think that you need to make your child and her safety a much bigger priority in all of this.

Mercy · 23/01/2006 19:17

Just read this thread again - NDP and WWB so sorry (and wannabe too - or have I got it wrong)

just to say think;ing of you all

NotQuiteCockney · 23/01/2006 19:18

I'm with the crowd on this one. Would you be comfortable sitting in your parents' house, with your DD sitting on your dad's lap? Ok, at 11 weeks, you might not be too stressed, but as she gets to the ages where you remember your dad abusing you, aren't you going to be incredibly uncomfortable when he's around?

Aloha · 23/01/2006 19:22

if one of my dh's relatives was a disgusting child abuser they would get to see my children literally over my dead body. Can't believe you are even thinking of it and agree with your dp 100%

dejags · 23/01/2006 19:30

You are amazingly forgiving CABOT.

Your DD is your priority and you don't need to have her early weeks ruined by worrying about this. Can you put the visit off until you feel ready to make the decision - perhaps your mum could visit you on her own?

Caligula · 23/01/2006 19:35

I can totally see why your DP doesn't want his child to be around someone like that. I can understand you want to maintain a relationship (well actually, no I can't, but I can respect the fact that you want to), but if it were the other way round and your DP had a relative who you knew had been abusive to children, wouldn't you think he was bonkers and unreasonable to want to take your precious little girl to visit?

What's in it for your family unit? I can only see that it will cause an awful lot of conflict and discomfort in your family at what should be a joyful, bonding time, and wonder if it's worth it?

Original poster

confusedatbestoftimes · 23/01/2006 19:36

Thank you for responses. I do resent implications that dd is not my priority - I have lived with this all my life and there is no way it will ever be a part of her life. She will never ever be unsupervised in my parents home and comes first in every part of our family life. Wannabe - your post thoughtful and helpful. The way things are set now will have implications for the rest of her life and those of any subsequent siblings. She is not the first grandchild and my sister has worked out her own pattern for things as she lives nearer. I would not go along with her way... Have spoken to Mum about it and she has been great. Calling my father a 'disgusting child abuser' based on limited info I posted was difficult to take but I see your point and make no excuses for his behaviour. Have never spoken to him about it and dp understands and accepts my reasons for this.... Just not a cut and dried issue which makes it even harder.

OP posts:

NomDePlume · 24/01/2006 10:02

confusedatbestoftimes, are your parents still together, then ?

saadia · 24/01/2006 10:47

Obviously we don't know the whole story but from what you have said I think it would be a terrible idea to let your daughter have any kind of relationship with her grandfather.

Even if she is never left with him, for me, and probably for your dh it is, as others have said, the possibility of what could be going through your dad's mind that is so impossible to tolerate. Also, echoing another poster, it kind of sends out the message that his behaviour to you was acceptable.

Kathlean · 24/01/2006 11:29

OK very crude response here but

How do you know if your beautiful little girl sitting on your dad's knee isn't giving him a massive erection as he sits and imagines all her little bits underneath her clothing.

You have suffered years of damage from what was done to you. How could you even contemplate having this man near your child?? If you allow this man any where near your daughter then IF anythings happens YOU are as guilty as him. You cannot guarentee 100% that there would not be a problem and that your daughter may not be alone for a few minutes with this man.

I was raped and abused by my step-father as a child and my son would not be in the same house as this man let alone the same room. If I found that any other member of my family had had him there at the same time then I would no longer have contact with that person either.

Sorry to come across as harsh but your innocent little girl is something you cannot take any chances with.

Pfer · 24/01/2006 12:12

Confused - so, tell us again why on earth you'd want you beautiful DD near a man who is capable of this sort of behaviour? Any do you even want to maintain a relationship with him?

Blu · 24/01/2006 12:26

Confused - I didn't post at first, because I have no experience of this, or the continuing confusion and disruption it causes, but I think that although you were very careful in the way you described your father's inappropriate behaviour, people feel very protective of the fact that it had such a profound and long-lasting effec on you and your sister. So, even an inappropriate lapse could effect your own little dd in the same way. And as many, many survivors have said, men do find a way, and it doesn't even take being alone. A game, the way children naturally affectionately sidle up to you when you are sitting on a chair and lean on you, a trip to the park and holding steady on the see-saw...

Of course your dd is a priority, and because of that, you feel that you will protect her with your life against anything. But should you have to feel like that?

I do believe, very strongly, in forgiveness and not causing separations where none need be, but I thin if I was your DH, I would be resolved beyond negotiation in my determination that my dd should not be with your father.

Is it possible for you to invite your Mum to stay with you?

Do you have a feeing that you want your dad to see and be proud of your dd, and as a consequence that he be ashamed of what he did, and that it will all be ok?

catsmother · 24/01/2006 16:02

To me - as a parent - it's simple.

When deciding to leave my children in anyone's company, the question I ask myself, based on what I know about them, is "Is there any risk?"

If the answer is NOT 101% "no" (for whatever reason), then they will simply never be put in that position.

I'd hope that all other responsible and loving parents would take the same attitude.

If you are so sure what you are doing is right (and people here don't know the full details, only you do), then WHY are you here asking for "other people's views" ???

Passionflower · 24/01/2006 16:46

Sorry but I have to agree with everyone on this. Just the thought that he could be having innapropriate thoughts would be enough to make me ensure my DD's were never in any sort of contact with him.

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