Please advise, marriage break up, it's like a soap opera and I don't know what to do next - sorry this is really long

[BeattieBow]

If you realise who I am please don't out me.

My life has become like an episode of eastenders and I am really struggling with what to do next.

Sorry this is long

I have been with dh since I was 18. married now for 12 years (I'm 41). we have 5 children. Marriage was ok I would say. We would have always said we were soul mates, but there were issues for a long time. These revolved around dh being obsessed with work, although he was the one that said I had the problems with it not him. He has always been a workaholic and it did cause problems - him not phoning to say when he was coming back, working late, never being home to pick up the children, getting very stressed about it. He didn't take paternity leave with any of the children (too busy), wouldn't take all of his holidays, and would be tied to the blackberry all the time.

His other problem was/is his severe lack of organisation. He would frequently forget to pay bills. This caused me huge stress as it meant we would get bailliffs turning up, he has a bad credit record, and most recently nearly got made bankrupt over failing to pay his tax. It was very stressful. This also showed itself in the fact he got or nearly got the sack from work several times over the last 20 years by being so bad with admin. In his line of work (lawyer) it was critical that he didn't miss deadlines, but he often did. After the first sacking he promised he would get help over this, but didn't.

He was always a lovely guy though. I knew he loved me, would always put the children first. He was caring, funny and loving. He loved being a father and was extremely hands on. This has changed dramatically over the last few months.

I can't put all of our history in here, but the last few months have been tough: In feb 2010 I had a very traumatic miscarriage. I was bluelighted to hospital, had the foetus wrenched out of me with forceps. Lost loads of blood and became very anaemic. it was awful and I struggled for a long time afterwards. He was little support, going back to work on day 2, being on the phone in the hospital etc. I found the next few months very difficult, was probably depressed, and probably got a bit obssessed with ttc. We had a very difficult time and I would say we were both depressed - he was unsupportive of me and looking back there were incidents where he was extremely horrible to me. I thought we both thought that it was a horrible time but that we would get through it.

This year in April, we were thinking about moving back to London as I was working there. dh then was sacked from his job and could only find another job in London. We speeded up the move to London as we could see little choice. I began to have severe misgivings about it, but he assured me that it was the best thing, and we could give it a go for a year or so. I have left friends, family and a house in the town we lived in.

Due to the nightmare of applying for schools etc, we ended up moving at different times. I moved up first, him and the children a few weeks later. Over the summer I suffered another mc (early this time) and he didn't even visit me. I was very hurt and things began to fall apart. I told him to stay at his mum's so he did. He said he had to start work early in his new job and couldn't come on holiday with me and the children (he was obssessed with losing clients). I went on my own. I discovered I was pg again while I was there (from a stupid one off shag).

Since earlier this year his behaviour has changed dramatically, although it has been 100 times worst for the last few months. He thinks nothing of sitting saying the vilest things to me while I sob in front of the children. If he is stressed/tired/fed up he will attack me verbally for hours. I remember going to a dinner party with friends and dh just put me down constantly in front of them all. I felt completely humiliated. He said later it was because he was angry with me. I didn't know why at the time.

He is very weird after such events, I will cry for ages (I do not cry easily), and usually go to bed. He behaves the next day as though everything is fine. kissing me, and talking normally. I am left baffled as to what he is thinking. If challenged, he will say he was annoyed/angry (about something, often unconnected to me, but which becomes my fault in some way), and I will not be able to see what happened to cause the incident. I am left on perpetual tenterhooks that I will do/say something (or something else will happen) to trigger an abusive episode.

I have suffered hyperemisis and am on medication - extremely ill. (I was so desperate I considered termination, I just didn't know what to do). He will call me the most awful names, fat, lazy, dirty. He has frequently over the past few months told me that I am a nightmare and that no one else will ever have me. that his friends think he has been mad to stick with me. etc etc

He moved out again a couple of weeks ago, but has told everyone that I have thrown him out. technically I have, but the only choice is for me to be a nervous wreck while he verbally abuses me. Most recently he went into my email account and saw an email I had sent to my sister in desperation asking her for help. He went absolutely mad. Started on about what a bad mother I am, how I'm neglecting the children.

I honestly don't know what I have done to deserve being abused so regularly - he says such vile things that I am left in no doubt that he absolutely hates me. He now says that I deserve this treatment for 20 years of crap that he has gone through.

I don't know whether to move back to my old town. I have a house, family, friends there. The children know it, although there won't be places at their schools yet. I am meanwhile stuck in London with no one. I have no friends here, no family, and I won't be able to afford to buy/rent anywhere. I don't want to rent forever anyway. I am worried about how I will cope on my own with a newborn and 5 children. I am getting scared every time I see dh as I think he just hates me so much. I honestly don't know what I have done to deserve such vitriol. I am just so alone I don't know what to do.

Sorry this is so long. My life has completely spiralled out of control recently and I don't know what to do.

My god. This is awful. You poor woman, I'm impressed that you can still string sentences together!

Apart from physically thumping you, which you haven't mentioned, he's gone right through the abuser's handbook and added embellishments - never an opportunity missed to grind you down, never an injury suffered without piling on insults. He is a horrible, horrible man and I'm pretty damn sure his 'friends' don't like him either.

I am so sorry for you.

As other people have said, the only sane attitude is to ignore everything he says - just make "mmh" noises and non-commital replies like "Really." (The famed 'yes dear' approach.) You do not have to explain or justify yourself. You're an adult and, despite what he wants you to think, a highly capable and competent one.

Get back to your old town asap, if that's where your support is. Do you know anyone with enough spare room, or a caravan or an unlet flat you could set up home in temporarily? Anybody going on holiday, who'd lend you their place while they're away?

Please tell as many people as possible you're leaving, and go. Most workplaces will give you time off for a marital breakdown. You have been terribly wronged, and other people will see that too.

Eat food! Stay safe. x

I have only read the OP but my first thought is that this is a classic case of domestic abuse. Everything was hunkydory when everything was going his way in terms of your relationship i.e. he focussed on work and you got on with the rest of it and were supportive to him when the shit hit the fan (re his sackings etc).

Now that he actually has to man up because you need support, the children are older and there are repurcussions from his behaviour (i.e. having to move etc etc) etc etc he is, basically, abusing you.

He is putting you down, calling you names, critising you and blaming you for everything that has gone wrong rather than face his own failings as a husband, lawyer, father and man.

Him being nice to you the day after he has made you feel so shit you have gone to bed crying is a simple case of the 'honeymoon period' where he will sweet talk you round, apologise etc etc before the cycle starts all over again.

You have to face this. It will not get any better. He will continue to treat you like this as long as you permit him to.

Personally, I just woke up one day and realised that I could not allow my STBXH to continue to be such a negatic influence in my childrens lives. The reason I asked him to leave was not so much for me (at the time) but was for them. I did not want my DD to think that this was how women are treated and for my DSs to think this is an acceptable way to treat women. On a positive note, we have been separated a year and I could not be happier. Don't get me wrong, it is hard at times BUT I don't live in fear of what mood he will be in when he comes home and I don't have to pretend anymore.

I know if I were you and had the wake up and smell the coffee moment that I did, then I would go back to the town, to your house where you have support and then take one day at a time. I really wish you the best of luck!

Oh, I'm sorry, I missed that you still have your old house. Yes, go!
Doubtless he'll try another 'hoovering' cycle and, doubtless, it will still be all about him. Don't hang around for the amateur dramatics, just pack up some essentials and bugger off. The breathing space will help to gt your thoughts straight :)

thanks everyone. saggyhairyarse I also had the wake up and smell the coffee moment, when he was laying into me in the car, I was sobbing, and all the children sat there in absolute silence. For 45 minutes. I will never forget that time ever. It astonished me. I made him move out the next morning.

I feel all right now, but that's because I'm a couple of days since the last outburst. I'm just being breezy with him when he phones and keeping him at a distance.

Beattie also if you had been such a vile person for the last 20 years why has he not said a word about before? If it was so bad that your'deserve' such a treatment and you'made' (??) him so angry why was he not able to say so at the time? I mean he doesn't seem to have any problem talking and saying things when he wants.
It's just an excuse nothing else.

You haven't been living in London for that long. Go back home and get some support in RL.

I really feel for you Beattie, I really do. You might be in two minds as to what to do because of the children but honest to God this will be the best thing you can ever do for them.

It took me a while to gather the information that I needed re. finances, practical issues and access etc etc but once I actually realised what was going and that not everyones marriage was 'like that', the decision was made.

I cannot explain to you how much my life has turned around. There are the obvious changes; I have gone back to college and am doing bloody well at something I have always wanted to do but was told I couldn't by him, I actually have a social life now because he has the children etc etc. It is the simple things like not having to clear up like a demented woman before he comes home for fear of what he will say, having money in the bank because he hasn't spent it all on drink.

I actually didn't realise how low I was until he moved out and now life is pretty good.

Start making plans for you and the children, I really doubt you will regret it!

xx

PS. It is going to be hard with 6 kids, I have 3 so I can't really imagine but it sounds like you have been doing the Lions share for all this time so don't let that put you off.

Just wanted to say that it is part off the protocol to make you feel like it is your fault and that you deserve it. Also , that you are mentally unwell and no one will believe you or side with you. Take a look at the support for emotional abuse thread, I think we have all experienced that tactic. You know really that its not your fault and you don't deserve it. Trust your instincts.

IMO you shouldn't be neutral about him to the DCs- its important that you make them understand that he is not normal and that behaviour is not acceptable from anyone least of all from someone who is supposées to love and take care of you. You need to tell them that.

quick post - sorry! - this is domestic abuse and the children shouldn't be exposed to it. would it be acceptable if he was hitting you in front of them? no: neither is this acceptable, in exactly the same way. how old is dd1? You say you have discussed with her if her dad is abusive - please don't! I'm so glad you have a place to go to - please go asap, the schooling will sort itself out but your children shouldn't be exposed to this for a minute longer.

I'm sorry to be focusing on your children when you are going through such hell. You have my total, heartfelt sympathy. i am focusing on the children because you are probably at 6s and 7s and may not realise the devastating effect this will be having on them (I am not saying you are negligent, just probably in immense shock). People generally don't realise that emotiona;/verbal etc (ie non violent - physical violence that is) is less damaging than physical violence - it isn't! For your children to be witnessing it makes them a victim of it too.

I am so sorry you are going through this pure nightmare. Please call womens aid 0808 2000 247 who will support you on every level. You need support and protection. bless you xx

If you have ruined his life for 20 years (which I doubt absolutely) then he will be OK with you moving. You cannot go on like this. For the sake of yourself and the children go where you have a support network. He will then have to work out when and how he can see his children. He is a lawyer, though, so would consult your own lawyer first and do it all by the book. Windsor may be right about the affair but concentrate on getting you and your children to a calmer, happier environment. You are having a truly awful time - I really hope things improve for you. xx

Beattie have read all your posts, but scan read replies, so i hope i am not repeating something already said.

Make no mistake, you are being Gaslighted.

I have a similar story on another thread. My ph hates me becuase, in his own words, I caught him online dating, and cyber-stalking me. Not me to hate him you understand but the other way round.

He too can give no rational explanation for this, like your stbh. He says he started it recently after something I did had irritated him. This was so significant he cannot remember what it was, despite being so recent.

Ringing any bells for you?

My mil is a controlling bitch of a woman, but even after being faced with tales of domestic violence, emotional abuse of her only grandchild etc, she is still being an apologist for him, yet controlling of him at the same time.

What is/was his relationship with his mother like? Any clues for his misogyny there? Cos that't what is sorry. So sad that its so common its got a name all of its own. I don't think there is a similar word for the opposite condition.

Hi Beattie, just from your posts on this thread I think it looks like your OH has had a nervous breakdown, possibly from the stress of his work problems (been sacked and previously nearly sacked) and also from the miscarriage and worry about possibly having another child to provide for. He needs to get help - whether it's counselling or life coaching or whatever, but if he isn't going to get himself sorted out, you and the children should not be near him on a daily basis, so his moving out is a good idea. I won't worry about what he says to other people. You can tell them your own version of the story, but I think friends and family generally know that there are two sides to everything.

He could well have depression or a tendency to depression, which at an older age can manifest as irritability rather than sadness. Don't forget in society men are aren't encouraged to cry about problems, they are encouraged to laugh them off or rage about them, or bottle them up. And bottling them up can result in them being unleashed as rage when it gets too much. Either way, it isn't your job to sit there to be his punching bag, or for your kids to be reluctant witnesses, so you are right to have him out of the home (not sure from your post whether he is or whether that was just temporary) until he has sorted himself out.

It doesn't sound like he was always bad, but I think from your description he never learnt how to handle pressure or organise himself better. He may well have done well academically enough to do law, but I suspect not to juggle pressures and the reality of life, which is a bit different from school and university. He's actually the one unravelling at present - just try not to let you and your DCs get caught in the crossfire. Your crying is quite normal - why shouldn't you? A previously nice guy has turned monstrous in his behaviour towards you, anyone would be devastated to be going through what you're going through.

The fact that he tries to act as though nothing has happened the day after tearing you down suggests that he doesn't know how to handle conflict and problems, or he would be acknowledge that he was in the wrong and apologise. But lots of men have problems with this - it doesn't make it right, but that's what a lot of men do. That said, I am guessing you'd rather he behave normally on a daily basis rather than to abuse you verbally everyday and apologise nicely afterwards.

If your children are settled in their schools, you could stay in London. But if it is really isolating there and the children are okay about moving back, then move back to your old town - provided you can still find accommodation. Did you say you were working or planing to go back to work when your baby is older? Would you be able to work in your old town? You would have tax credits and childcare vouchers that would help with nursery costs if that's what you're planning to do.

Just to say that when it comes to separation and divorce - if or when it should get that far - the status quo matters....if you move out into a rental and leave the family home you (hopefully) part own, just make sure you don't put yourself in a position where you have insufficient income to pay rent/mortgage, as well as looking after all your children, if your OH tries to wriggle out of paying maintenance for his children. You may not be thinking of separation - or even divorce yet - but with so many children, you can't afford not to plan for the worst.

You haven't done anything to deserve this. Unfortunately, in life, sh*t happens, and it's just happened to you big time - but things can get better. Get him out of your life - certainly for now. See him as little as possible apart from sorting out essentials like bills, finance and any personal property he's left at home. Be cool, civilised but don't let your guard down with him. If the children ask - and I suspect they know - you could always say he's away to sort out some problems and to continue work. If he can be good tempered with the kids, let the kids talk to him on the phone or webchat/skype if they wish to. It will do them and him good to remain in contact as long as he is in a good mood with them (that includes not blaming or badmouthing you to the kids).

And finally, can you change your email account so that he has no access to it? OR just open a new one and give that address only to your friends and close relations. Best of luck and hugs.

You sound like you know exactly what to do, actually. Move back home with the kids, and divorce your abusive husband. You make enough money, you have family support, the kids won't have to witness this anymore.

And by the way - your friends and family will have noticed his abuse, and odds are they already think he's a bastard.

thanks everyone. alot to think about. Springydaffs, no I didn't tell dd1 that he was abusive. DH told her (in a mocking, laughing way) that I thought that. He truly has been awful during this.

anyway, he brought the children back yesterday and I didn't see him - he sent them in and they came up to our flat on their own. it was ok.

I've kept things cool with him and told him he can see them on sundays. I feel much calmer and more together when I haven't seen him for a few days and he hasn't been horrible.

interesting about the affair. I sort of hope he has found someone actually. It will make it easier for me to extricate myself.

My mum who isn't his fan, thinks he's having a breakdown as the abusiveness is relatively new.

Someone asked about his mum. She is a truly awful woman. He grew up with a dad and 2 brothers, and they all treated his mum as though she was this weak creature who didn't know anything. In fact, she is the strongest person in his family. did all the housework, cooking etc - they were all waited on. even now when she visits she does his ironing (not mine for the children's though!). She was hateful to me for the first 10 years of the relationship and no one would stand up to her. the brothers have all had marriage breakdowns and mental issues. (as did his dad). He's his mum's golden boy.

dramatrauma, no whether to move back is the only thing I'm not clear on actually. The kids are settled here, my job is here (and my hatred of the commute was one reason to move back), and I would be happy bringing the children up here. But I don't have any friends or family or a house here. And in lots of ways it will just be easier for me in a small town - everything is convenient, close and non-threatening (iysim). It just seems that it would be nicer there! I couldn't move back there straightaway as there aren't any school places, and I can't home educate because of my job.

it's shit being alone at the weekends though, that's for sure

You won't be alone at weekends once you get home.... You will be able to build the kind of life you should be having... With friends and family and nice normal people. Your children will get to see how it ought to be.

The diary is an excellent thing to be doing, keep at it.

I agree with the poster that said you can be clear to your children about the fact that his behaviour is wrong. They do need to know this and they will see you standing up to an abusive bully. You can do this in such a way so they know he still loves them I am sure.

Again as said above, if you were so awful, why on earth did he conceive six children with you? Did you drug him? Are you so enormous and powerful you sat on him until it worked six times? If he is so clever then I think he could have worked out why it kept happening...... If hr didn't like it then he could have said so. Spineless.

Make a cup of tea and a list of what to pack....

He is working on the children every time he sees them. He tells me I will ruin their lives if I take them back to the other city. he says they will all hate me for ever and that none of them want to go back. (it's true they say they don't).

He tells me that he has been in touch with our friends (and family?) and they all think that I have made him leave, that he is innocent. But I really had no choice. He was just so vile to me, but he is spinning it his way. He is making them think that I am the mad, deranged one and that I made him leave. In the meantime he is refusing to rent a flat (saying he can't afford it) and is staying free at a friends empty flat. Having a wonderful time, just taking the dcs out for fun at the weekend while I have all the dross to do. while I have the early mornings, the school runs, the homework. He is right they do think he's wonderful and I'm the boring shouty one.

He told me again today that I drove him to breaking point, that he has put up with so much over the last 20 years that I have made him say all these things. he can't come up with much though (apart from the fact it was the pressure I put him under that caused him to lose all of the jobs ). I think that I am well shot of him. But why is it important to me to win the propaganda work with my friends and family? Maybe I just need to be dignified and let him spout whatever crap he wants.

sorry a bit of a rant. You can tell I've just seen him (came to drop off the dcs and pick up his dinner jacket).

OP I really think he is having an affair. This trying to turn everyone else against you, rewriting history and blaming you for ending the relationship, together with the extraordinary behaviour that seemed to coincide with his new job, is typical of the way that many people behave when they've got something to hide. I'm glad that you wouldn't be bothered if he was doing this, but I'd suggest you find out because you will then be able to tell everyone what he has really been up to - and what he has put you through as a result, plus you do need to know if there is some other claim on his finances, as that could affect yours.

I asked him today and he denied it. I don't know how else to find out really - All I can do is wait for someone to pop up - I wouldn't be surprised if he's got his eye on someone, but he is denying it so far. He's certainly enjoying life in London at the moment! no responsibility, a fair about of money, no rent, bills, nappies, nit combing or early mornings. Can't be bad. (I wouldn't swap my life with the dcs for his for a moment, but he does seem to have landed on his feet!).

Of course he would deny it - there was no point asking him.

If his post still comes to your address e.g. phone bills, credit cards, bank statements etc., could you investigate that way? Or get into any online accounts? Specifically, how does he receive phone bills currently?

no, I knew that really WT. I just wanted him to know that I have my suspicions.

He has a payg phone, and I can see the bank account details online because I haven't extricated myself yet (although we agreed to today) - he just withdraws cash from what I can see, but always does have meals etc which he puts down to entertaining clients. It would be hard to get evidence from that. He would need a character transplant to start buying flowers etc online. Not sure he would do something as blatent as going away to a hotel (and doesn't need to, he is staying in a lovely flat in Maida Vale).

Has he always had a payg phone? Seems a bit odd, given his income and his occupation....

Is his phone password protected and could you gain access to it at all during one of his visits to see the children?

Is there any way of turning up at the flat or getting someone else to make a few discreet enquiries on your behalf?

The problem with telling him your suspicions is that he'll start covering his tracks now.

If you can't find out, you could always fight fire with fire and start telling everyone he is having an affair, especially if you believe as I do, that he most certainly is.

OP I would stop talking to him except for the absolute necessities like times for picking up the kids. Really I would. Don't engage with any of his shit stuff of his. Don't even ask or wonder about what he is doing or who he is seeing. The less contact he has with you now, even in your head, the better off you will be.

The kids will survive just fine in your old town where you have a house. They did before. Most of all, they will be away from this poor excuse for a father.

I can't help thinking, like others have said, that in fact this has been going on for much longer than you have fully realised and you've squashed it down in your (understandable) desire for a happy family life. You said he 'would always put the kids first' in your OP, but in my view, a man who never took paterntiy leave, was never home to pick up the children' (also in your OP) is not putting his kids first. I think he has fooled you into believing this. Don't go along with it any longer. You will do just fine without him, in fact much, much better.

One thing though: please don't ask your DD1 or any of the others if they think he's abusive/normal etc in what he does anymore. It's not their job to decide that and also, it's pretty clear that he is NOT normal and IS being abusive. They've already been exposed to enough of his antics. Close it down and take all of you away from him. Do not get embroiled in a battle of logic, asking for explanations, or recriminations. Just go.

I would suggest moving this separation/divorce forward ASAP, from a practical point of view.

Is he a partner in his firm? If so, he'll be personally liable (with the other partners for any losses/failures/claims, and that might mean all his assets (including jointly owned ones, if he's given personal guarantees to the firms bank) being seized.

And if he's a crap and disorganised lawyer, getting a big claim is a matter of when, not if.

My DP is a partner and I'm a lawyer too, so if you need any info on how law firms and their finances work, please do ask.

thanks. I don't say those things to dd1 (it was him discussing the abusiveness etc with her which I never agreed with), I have just told them that he makes me very unhappy and sad and that we both love them but won't be living together etc. I don't engage in any discussions when dh raises them - he is trying to get them on his side. I think I am rising above it, but it is difficult when they seem to be believing him. I hope in the long term they don't think I've ruined their lives though.

I agree, I do try to stop talking to him, and then get drawn in while he is here. Anyway, won't see him until next weekend now.

I've been with him since I was 18. Although I know logically that he is abusive, shit and weak etc etc, it is still so difficult to be on my own, with severe morning sickness, in a strange city with 5 sad children. I know that I will do better without him, but first I've got to get through this horrible horrible time. And it's really tough. and lonely.