Is it OK to stop someone else from being a parent?

[tigermoll]

(first time poster, please be gentle :) )

I have been with my OH for 2.5 years, living together for 1, no children or pets. We are very happy, love each other very much, and I hope that we can stay together for the rest of our lives.

So far, so peachy. The issue is, I have never been very interested in marriage and babies, and throughout my twenties, this ambivalence has hardened into definite dislike. I am now 30, and find it hard to imagine ever getting married or having children. My partner, on the other hand, has always wanted very much to get married and have children. He loves kids, has always assumed he would have a wedding and a wife, and goes all gooey when he sees babies in prams.

We have had several talks where I have been very clear about the marriage/babies thing, and he says he is happy for the r/ship to proceed, knowing that it will mean he misses out on these things.

BUT: the thing is, I know he's not really happy. It breaks my heart to see him holding friends' children, as I can see he is thinking: 'I'll never have one of these'. We have had several 'chats' that have somehow developed an edge over my views on marriage (how 'not everyone thinks like me, and most people see marriage as a good thing', ostensibly in an abstract discussion, but I started to feel like I was somehow being got at)

So my question (which has turned out pretty long, sorry!) is this:

Is it fair of me to proceed with the r/ship, knowing that it will cause my lovely, lovely partner to miss out on a huge part of life, stopping him from being a father (and I'm pretty sure he would be an excellent one) and possibly causing him to resent me? What if, (god forbid) we split up, and then he gave up kids for a r/ship that ended anyway? It seems disingenuous to say 'well, he says he's fine, so even though I know he isn't, I'll just carry on'. Should I wait to see if I change my mind (which is possible) and if so, how long should I wait?

Thanks for listening to me ramble xx

I think you have been perfectly clear on your views on children. I have a friend in the same position. Her fella thought she would "feel the need to have kids" the older she got - but she didn't. She has a very nice dog instead!

I can understand the desperation that would drive someone to it. It must be very frustrating to have all the equipment to make a baby, and be lacking the final piece of the puzzle. But it's pretty underhand, - you force someone to have a child they didn't want, and it rarely ends well.

BUT (and I accept I may get flamed for this :)) if woman wants a baby, I think she should go ahead and have one. If she does it without the father being onboard (one night stand, donor sperm, etc) then it's wrong to expect any imput (financial or emotional) from anyone else, since it's a decision she took on her own. And she probably shouldn't tell the father about the baby if at all practical, - otherwise you're trapping someone into an emotional committment against their will.

Tiger, I see what you're saying but I think every one has the right to know if they have a child... There are channels that women can use to have a baby as a line parent without resorting to hiding it from the dad.

I got into my 30's and still didn't want children. I didn't like them and felt that they were an inconvenience.

I fell pregnant 6 weeks after meeting DS's Dad. My thought processes did a complete about-face when I found out I was pregnant. I fell completely and utterly in love with my baby-to-be (which was totally at odds with everything I'd ever said) and morphed into some earth mother figure. DS is now 14. I had DD nearly 4 years ago and have surprised myself with how much I do enjoy being a mum after being so adamant that it was the last thing I wanted. But, that's just my point of view.

I am concerned I may lose him over this, certainly. But (and I am being honest here, not trying to be a martyr) the absolute worst thing would be for us to stay together and in thirty years time, he turns around and says 'I never had children because of you, and I really regret that and now its too late'.

OP, there is nothing whatsoever 'wrong' with not wanting marriage or babies - I'm firmly in that camp myself Yes, you may change your mind, you may not - who the heck knows! From reading MN, it seems like some people who were adamantly anti-parenthood did go on to change their minds and others didn't - either way, most people seem to feel very happy with their decision.
You have been perfectly clear with your DP about what you want out of life and out of this relationship. It is not your responsibility to make him happy, that's 100% down to him. You have been open and fair with him, if he's still with you, then it hopefully means he has decided that his life is not going to turn out the way he planned it, but you are wonderful enough that it doesn't much matter. So lucky you! Enjoy it!

Also, - I know you're right, Maryz re stealing someone's gametes. I suppose I do put a lot of weight onto the nine months of pregnancy, and see it as giving the woman's rights 'an edge' over the man's. Which is wrong.

I suppose I have also absorbed the prevailing ideas of my society, which always shows a woman's life as utterly altered by the arrival of children, whereas men's seem to go on fairly unruffled. Also, there seem to be a fair whack of men out there who don't give much of a stuff about the children they have. If they don't like the idea of being a parent, they seem capable of just walking away. It adds up to a picture of children as being a bigger deal for women than men, so it seems that women ought to get more of a say over it.

Please tell me i'm not the only one snorted their tea out at 'can this person be the one if you don't want their ring'?

Sorry OP do ignore me. I do think you're being entirely decent and honest. He has decided he loves you so much he would rather have you than babies. I think that's rather lovely!

Tee hee - I was actually thinking of the Bowie song, Young Americans: 'she took his ring, took his babies'.

Which, now I think about it, is probably rude.....

he turns around and says 'I never had children because of you, and I really regret that and now its too late'.

I know what you are saying but it won't be because of you... It will have been his choice. I think you're worrying about something that is our of your control. He's an adult, his life and ultimately his choice. Realistically, are you suggesting ending it with him now, just in case the scenario you detailed should happen? That would be silly, enjoy the present time.....

Also, thanks to every one who's been so nice

And to think you guys have such a fierce reputation online....

you aren't stopping anyone becoming a parent. You're stopping them becoming a parent with you.

I left someone for exactly this reason and am now a happy and fulfilled single mother of one.

It may be a tough choice but tis still his choice to make - you or children.

I had a colleage who was a year or two older than me and adamant that she didn't want a child. Her 'maternal' clock suddenly went off when she was almost 40 - and she now has a much loved little boy.

I have to say that my maternal clock NEVER went off. Perhaps the batteries fell out. In fact, as I've got older I'm glad that this is becoming a less of a bone of contention in relationships.

I work with kids- always have done- find them totally fascinating, love some of them to bits. But I am ALWAYS glad to go home at the end of the day . I think I actually started working with children too young - so I always knew the reality of them.

You really don't have to feel guilty, as others have said you've been honest with him and he's made his choice. I have a friend whose husband would also have loved to be a Dad, but he's very happy with his decision to be with her and not have them. Actually, I've just remembered another friend that I always though would make a great Dad, who dotes on his nieces, whose now very happy in a solid relationship with a lovely woman who doesn't want children (and who, at 48, should have heard her biological clock by now if she was going to).

But will you feel guilty? I've recently come out of a relationship at 41 without children (we'd been trying, miscarriage in March), which my exP ended because he knew that for him to be happy we couldn't have them, but he couldn't live with the guilt of asking me to give them up. Ultimately, if he'd given me the choice of our relationship or a baby, I would have chosen him, but he couldn't be responsible for that. It could be very different when it's a man saying he'd be happy to give it up though.

It seems like a very black and white issue, but when it comes down to it, it isn't at all.

I left a relationship because I wanted kids and he didn't. I loved him so much and it hurt so much but I knew I would resent him if I stayed and never got the chance to be a mother. Your partner has that choice and is choosing you.

My situation was slightly different in that he had a 5yr old (unplanned - he had never wanted kids - but much loved) with ex wife. I saw what a good and loving dad he was and clung on to hope that he would change his mind and that because he hadn't had the snip he wasn't 100% against more kids so if I 'accidentally' gave him another child it would all be ok. I wondered if being part of his daughter's life would be enough to satisfy my mothering urge but actually it made it harder being so close to having/being a family and knowing I would always in a way be the outsider and never have that for myself. From day one he was clear on not wanting children and in the end it came down to a choice for me and I chose to leave him to become a mother. He accepted me leaving for this reason. I still don't really see it as wholly ''my" decision - he also chose to see our relationship end rather than have a child with me.

Anyway, I am now a mother and love my son more than anything in the world so know my decision was the right one. The relationship I'm in now isn't all that great and I do still miss my ex sometimes but for me being a parent was more important. Only your partner can say if the desire to be a dad is a greater need than being in a relationship with you, but it certainly sounds like he is aware of your position and still wants to be with you. I think so long as you don't give him any false hope and let him go without a fight if he says fatherhood is too important to him to ignore then you can't 'blame' yourself at all. Just be happy you've got a great partner who obviously loves you very much.

Devil's advocate here - I think you should leave him. Honestly. Having a child is such an all-encompassing, life enhancing, wonderful experience that it really is the meaning of life for those of us who want a child and I don't think any of us should deny that experience to anyone who wants it. I don't think any relationship will ultimately be worth missing out on parenthood if you are a child-wanter.

Tigermoll, I totally respect your decision not to procreate - you sound thoughtful, honest and very caring the makings of a good mum? but you would be giving your dp the greatest gift in the world if you let him go and gave him the chance to experience being a dad with someone who wants to be a parent.

He may not agree now but take him in a time machine 50 years hence and look back on his 2 possible lives - which life would he choose?

Think I agree with Slambang

But respect to you tigermoll for knowing what you want and being so honest with him.

i think that if you have made it perfectly clear that he will never change your opinion,(as so many people think they can), then its his choice to stay with you knowing he will never have these things.
The only worry would be that when he's older he may (unfairly) resent you abit for missing his chance.
I personally dont want anymore children, have told my partner that and very explicitly (maybe harshly) told him that if he wants anymore, it wont be with me. Ive done it so i know that i can be guilt free if he wakes up one day and wonders why he didnt have another

Slambang, - harsh but fair! That is exactly the problem, - even though he says he's fine with not having kids, I just can't quite believe that he is. It just seems like a terrible thing to do to someone, - especially someone who would be such an amazing dad.

I'd be a rubbish mum however, - I drink, smoke, and loathe playing with duplo. I'd almost certainly leave the baby on the bus or something. Plus I've always said that, should I ever be unfortunate enough to breed, I'd give the child a really awful name, like Gaylord or Lob-On, so it left home early :)

Pretty sure that he thinks that you are more likely to change your mind than not! he has all the reason to, as most women do have children/do change their mind...so I understand it's a dilemma. I think the best solution is to wait a couple of years - you can then see how you feel, and whether he's not growing resentful. It's not too late then for him to become still a youngish Dad with a new partner.
Women who don't want children do sometimes change their mind last minute. My friend didn't want children for financial reasons (h doesn't earn much at all) and was generally ambivalent, but then kind of logically decided that they should have a child as she might regret it later if she didn't, then they discovered that they need IVF as he had problems, and THEN she became quite desperate after being told she can't have them easily! a lot rests on psychology it would appear. She was lucky with IVF though, at once! I think there is also fate in these things.
But you can't really wait till late 30s - let him go in a coule of years if he becomes even slightly sad about lack of kids.
Children DO give meaning to life to lots of women - it depends what your life is about. If you have a talent and passionate about your career then you might be fine (or some other source of happiness, like a real soulmate partner maybe), but children is the 'guaranteed' source of fulfilment for many, especially as they age a bit.

P.S. Heard from quite a few women who disliked other children, that with your own it's completely different. But you still will have to get a feeling of longing, not a logical decision.

My SIL is childless by choice, she and her DP have been together 22 years. He wanted them, she didn't, but he wanted her. They're ambivalent as aunt and uncle but my DCs adore them!

You are giving him the choice.