self pleasure rather than me?

[paranoidandroidwreckmyownlife]

It might just be me being overly sensitive, and don't get me wrong it's not every night, but is it normal for a man to want self pleasure rather than a bit of fun with the wife every now and again?
I was feeling a bit needy as he'd been doing family business stuff till nearly 1am the night before, so I was asleep and didn't even get a cuddle, then next morning our 2 youngest DC's were up at crack of dawn so i took then downstairs, no chance of even a snuggle up then.
I have issues of rejection from childhood and past, I'm the first to admit it, we are having counselling to help him understand and me to try and get over it, but I feel so fucking ugly and disgusting that he wasn't interested in me, just went up for a shower and to please himself.
When we got into bed he wasn't very cuddly but being the idiot that I am tried to initiate sex, he tried but was able to really finish as he wasn't feeling well and was obviously already done.
I know i have issues, big ones, but feel so shit over this and just need to know if this is what men are like from time to time.

Ok, the fleshlight thing for some reason is a bit freaky. Strange because I guess it's the male equivalent of a vibrator yet somehow the latter is more socially acceptable.

OP, how long have you been married and how often on average would you say you have sex? Because say you are having sex twice a week and this is/was something he also does then you could argue things are ok...bit strange with the fleshlight but if you take that away I don't think anyone would suggest sex twice a week and a quick wank is strange.

But of course if he's not having sex with you and instead prefers this toy then that's a whole different kettle of fish.

So that's the first thing I'd suggest is addressed. Is he replacing sex with masturbation? Or is he just like all blokes and sometimes just prefers the simplicity of a wank?

Secondly you have mentioned he found this after browsing a premature ejaculation site and that you love him despite his thinning hair etc. Presumably then he has PE sometimes? I mean I have never googled such a site so I assume it's not something you surf onto for the sake of it. In that context, could it be that HE feels inadequate because he doesn't feel man enough to pleasure you for long enough? We all know how fragile the male ego is? Masturbation is a purely selfish act so he's no need to worry about his performance. My point is that just as you say you have issues around rejection, perhaps he has issues too.

Thirdly, you've said several times that you feel ugly and rejected. Other than counselling, are you doing anything else? Is there anything you can do to give yourself a boost in confidence? I mean it could be as simple as going out and buying yourself some gorgeous new underwear. Or perhaps hitting the gym and getting into shape. The latter does wonders for your self confidence. It's alright going to talk about it with a counsellor. But if you are feeling ugly because you are for example, overweight then no amount of talking will change that. Does that make sense?

Lastly, @Anyfucker. Is there any thread you ever post on which doesn't end with a variation of 'dump the bastard'?

niceguy...where did I type "dump the bastard" or even a "variation" of it ?

do you have a problem with women who tell other women that they are not being treated fairly ?

and why have you focussed on him, when OP is telling us he is neglecting her emotionally ? You have completely ignored that part of it and focussed on the physical problem

since you have have generalised about "men and their fragile egos" how about I generalise and say that most women, if they feel valued emotionally in their relationship don't have a problem with their "confidence" within it

and joint sexual problems, which is what this is, would not have the impact they are clearly having here

AF, generally when I post about these types of things I try to look from the other persons point of view. That's perhaps why you see this as me only looking at his point of view. It doesn't necessarily always mean I personally agree. I am trying to offer food for thought. There are always two sides to every story and on here we almost always only hear one.

Sometimes there is no excuse for the others behaviour. Often there could be other reasons we're not privy to. Hence why its important to look at both sides.

As for my comment to you, perhaps I am mistaken. But in almost every thread I see your posts pretty much say "It's all his fault, dump him". See your comment above about packing his bags and enjoying mrs fleshlight. So let's assume for a moment he has an issue with PE and has been too embarassed to discuss it with even his partner. Is that still a dumpable offence?

Like I say, personally I don't get the whole Fleshlight thing. But I'd rather look at reasons why and examine things from his point of view as well as OP's before jumping to any hasty conclusions.

this other POV you seek to represent on all threads you post on...does it always involve ignoring the OP's distress and focussing on "the other side" ?

of course there is always another side, but I prefer to address how the OP is feeling, or else it just starts to look like you are yet another person who is ignoring the OP's justifiable feelings

The best cure for PE is lots and lots of great, confidence building sex, not using a toy for your own pleasure and ignoring the emotional and physical needs of your partner. Nothing can replicate sex with a live human being in any case so all he's learning is how to wank for longer.

There is a difference between a woman using a vibrator and a man using a fake vagina, quite a significant minority of women have trouble with orgasms and very often a vibrator is the only thing that is guaranteed to work, the overwhelming majority of men have no trouble with orgasms and only need their hand or a partner.

Niceguy, give it a rest with this "all" men crap, it's really not helpful and it's really not true.

What all men crap?

Tbh he's not had it long and hasn't used it often. I just felt replaced as i made it obvious i needed intimacy that night.
He feels he has a problem, I've never ridiculed him or even made a fuss and say and do love him and what he does just as he is. Sometimes he's wonderful, othertimes, usually when things are less than perfect it's like he just switches off. If I'm upset or we've argued about something he can never just hold me and say don't worry. He seems to go the opposite way.
Sex is fairly frequent ATM, much mote than it used to be as to honest with long term pnd and feeling emotionally detached from him I wasn't very interested. That wasn't very fair on him either. But now I feel like it's actually the best way to feel close to him and things have dramatically improved in that area over the last 6m or so. There are many issues here it seems, relate will hopefully help both of us but I just wish he would be more thoughtful and emotionally mature.

Windor, no I don't think porn is an issue. Was working on family business, yet another pull on our time and emotional space!

"Or is he just like all blokes and sometimes just prefers the simplicity of a wank?" There's your "all men" crap.

"As I often say, you show me a man who doesn't masturbate and I will show you a liar. (cue lots of ladies saying oh my man never would......)"
That's not helpful, not true and hugely condescending to women who know their husbands far better than you do.

Oh get a grip Mali, if it helps I'll use the words "the vast majority" or "99.9%" instead then ok? Sheesh. Didn't realise I was writing a contract and needed to be so legally accurate.

Anyway OP. So does your DH initiate the sex sometimes or is it generally all you making the first move?

If its pretty equal or he does most of the running then I think overall things are ok and not as bleak as some of the other posters are making out.

Like I said, 99.9% of men will occasionally want to have a quick wank and sometimes just can't be hassled with full on sex. It's really no reflection on his love or lack of with you.

Look at it this way. If a woman posted on here that last night she decided to use her vibrator rather than have sex with her husband but in general their sexlife was fine then i suspect posters would not be calling her selfish, immature and suggesting her husband packs her bags in favour of Mr Rabbit.

As for the holding after arguing, have you told him this either during relate or in private? I can sort of understand why he wouldn't. Generally after an argument you'd expect the other person to be as angry as you are/were. So the idea that the best way to diffuse it is to have a hug is counter-intuitive given you'd probably expect a punch in the head than hug. (Please note mali, i am being sarcastic and don't take that sentence literally).

Used to always be him nagging about lack of and instigating. Now I seem to be the instigator. Not sure what he really wants from me anymore, like I say things are good for a while then he just seems to switch off. Leaving me feeling confused and rejected. I think the night with the shower was the start of one of these periods, things still very stilted and hesitant in my mind.

can never understand how one can prefer porn to the real ting

Tdada, you're on the wrong track, this isn't about porn (for once)

the real ting

yeah, mon

< sorry >

The point here is that OP feels rejected since DH decided to masturbate. The exact manner of how he did it (and with what accessories) seems IMHO pretty irrelevant.

From the overall tone of the posts, it seems pretty damn clear to me that this is a symptom of a wider issue, which is that OP and DH are not in synch. They have taken turns to be pursuing/rejecting intimacy, both emotional and physical. I am pretty sure there are other communication issues we haven't heard about yet.

paranoid does any of this seem right to you? Am I right to think that the real issue is that you don't feel emotionally connected because you don't have solid communication with DH? Hence the masturbation just seems to reinforce the feeling of a wall between you because you were already feeling rejected?

I was soooooo pleased you turned up to kill the thread, instead of it being my inanity

Uh Oh! The pro-masturbation and pro-porn person is here again! He does not understand how soul-destroying this is for women striving to have a happy, loving, laughing and caring relationship!

Mrman, that sounds to me like a pretty rational summing up of the situation!

I often hear women complaining about mens DIY sexual activities in a manner which suggests they believe that,once in a relationship any sexual pleasure must come only from the partner and masturbation is viewed almost as a kind of infidelity.

Is it as common for men to complain about womens DIY?

AF Rocks I

Sorry, AF, didn't send message properly; it was for you, not someone called AF Rocks! Go girl! Always support you and your comments!

I'm not against masturbation from time to time, it's just on this occasion it was chosen instead of his own wife who obviously needed to reconnect and that hurt. Yes it did seem to reinforce the wall.
He was more affectionate last night, even thought sex might be on the cards till he fell asleep on me mid snuggles! He must have been v tired, but it is hard not to take it personally.

blimey, carantala, one too many sherries last night ?

Cecily, nobody is saying that people shouldn't masturbate once in a relationship, in fact I've only ever seen one person on MN with that opinion in many years. It's lovely, whether done alone or as a part of sex but the OP's H has gone about things the wrong way and hurt his wife deeply by being selfish and inconsiderate to her needs. His toy could be used to enhance their sex life, not destroy it.

Malificence, i think you are voicing what i was trying to say much better than I can. I'm the erratic emotional OP, you seem very succinct.
But then our relationship has always been like this, think it's why we're hitting problems many years down the line. He's a wonderful father and provider, but emotionally is still stuck in his late teens I think. He cannot emotionally support me, in facts gets dismissive and sometimes quite verbally cruel instead because he can't deal with it. He cannot talk about intimate issues well at all, just wants to bury his head in the sand and ignore things, I thought i could deal with this, but after 11 years of marriage it's all come to a head. Add in some annoyance from a crazy with a crush working associate of his, and it's all too much for me to deal with.