Do partners who don't want sex have the 'right' to object to their partners having sex elsewhere?

[ImperialBlether]

There are so many threads where the OP has a low sex drive or where the OP's partner has a low sex drive.

Leaving aside those where the OP has had a young baby or where there has been illness or unusual stress, does anyone have the moral right to say "I don't want sex and I don't want you to have it, either"?

I'm not talking about where a partner is flirting with someone else or is using porn and the partner objects.

I'm talking about reasonable situations, eg the kids are aged 10 upwards and the OP or their partner just doesn't want sex.

Look, some people just don't like sex very much. And some of those people are unpleasant individuals who see sex as a way of manipulating other people's behaviour. It is not, of course, unreasonable to lose all sexual interest in someone who is being unkind to you or ignoring your requests for more effort in other areas of the relationsip (or indeed for them to stop doing a particular sexual thing that you hate). Some people kill a partner's libido by being selfish and unreasonable and only wanting their own sexual needs met: many of the threads on here from people who have lost all desire for their partners mention trying in a variety of ways to get the high-libido partner to listen and make an effort, only to be ignored apart from when the partner lunges at the poster's genitals. But people who refuse to have sex with their partners and refuse to discuss it, explain it or offer to compromise are people who are behaving selfishly.

Do people really withhold sex as a means to control? Fucking hell I am naive.....

People people use the threat of making their parnters have sex then is stands to reason people can use the withdrawal of sex as a means of contol

Plenty of women not all give a sex ban if they don't get their own way or use the promise of sex for good behaviour.

Posie just because its not you dose nt mean it dose not happen

And I am sorry but plent of women who are really not at all interested in sex seem pretty darn keen it's time for a baby

ThePosieParker I'm sure you're not naïve, just haven't experienced the sort of shit I did.

It got quite explicit. "If you think you're getting anything this weekend, you'd better spend the whole day gardening".

I spent the whole day gardening, got a shower got changed... got the smirk "Oh, looking forward to it then?" Looked puzzled, and said, "No, I'm nipping down the pub for a beer. Fancy a takeaway?"

Another week with no sex.

Another weekend. I'd done some stuff round at her parents, for the third weekend in row. That night it looked like sex was on the cards, and she said, "You've been really good today, you can have a BJ", I said no thanks, I'd rather have a cup of tea, got out of bed and made one.

I was never to initiate sex; if I did "that's all you ever want".
She only did as a tip.

She worked FT; I did too, and all household jobs - yes, toilets, ironing, washing, hoovering and dusting were shared. We also spent 4 out of 5 weekends at her parents; the very rare one at my mothers.

The only thing we didn't share was her money and my hours.[Some of which were paying me less than the cleaner she'd got the kids not to tell me about].

Oh yes. Sex is sometimes used to try and control people.
This might be why she is XW and single.

In contrast, I'm married to DW and still in contact with both my children despite XW's best efforts after 14 years have passed.

matthew2002smum

Yes, it's wrong to make someone have sex if they don't want to. It is unreasonable to expect that your partner's needs aren't going to be considered. How long's a drought? How long would you think is reasonable to go without sex. Over a year? I did. More than once. Oh, and masturbation? "If you have to do that, do it in the toilet."

Withholding sex? Apparently, from another thread it can be seen as unreasonable behaviour.

I left my XW; not just about sex, but about bullying, lying over money, taking the kids to her parents every weekend, bizarrely refusing to see relatives (no, hers, not mine) after estate issues.

I was very reasonable and allowed XW to divorce me on whatever grounds she chose. She went for adultery and unreasonable behaviour.

mathew2002smum Of course it is wrong to make someone have sex. It is also wrong to make someone go without sex, just because you decide that is what you want.

I think most people have a fair idea of what they will/wont tolerate in a relationship before it actually happens and I am virtually certain that I wouldn't agree to stay with my DH if I knew I wouldn't have sex for the rest of my life with him.

More than anything else I would find his hugely selfish act of dictating my sex life even more of a problem that no sex.

I don't think anyone has the right to refuse their partner sex for no good reason (just because they don't feel like it) and then refuse to let their partner seek sex elsewhere.

This is an interesting discussion. I found out the other day (long story) that when a friend's mother went off/couldn't have sex due to illness, she asked her husband to use prostitutes to take the pressure off her, which he did.

Their relationship continued for many, many years on that basis and he was her carer to the end and obviously loved her dearly, so I guess marriage can take many forms.

On the flipside if I decided that I no longer wanted a sexual relationship with my DH I don't think I could expect him to never have sex again and therefore we would have to discuss where our relationship was going to go, but it would be utterly unfair in my mind of me to say "I don't want sex again and because you are my DH you have to accept that you to can never have sex again".

What matters I suppose is that the issue is discussed. I have a male friend who has been married for 15 years and repeatedly has long term affairs behind his wife's back. I think part of it is that he is the "cheating type" but he also says that at 40 years old he is not willing to give up on sex and that his wife would be happy if they never had sex again. He's an old friend and it is not for me to get involved but it is actually sad for them both.

Hi. Im not a mum but i felt i had to join to contribute to this discussion. I too am in a sexless marriage but its such a long story i will do it by timeline to make typing this quicker. I apologise if this comes across as cold.
1992 I met my husband and moved in with him after 3 months. He was 42.I was 19.
1996. The sex dwindled and then stopped altogether. I was 23.
1998. We married although it has never been consumated. I still loved him and fancied him at this point.
2001.I started work at (ironically) a sex chatline office.
Feb 2002.I started at Slimming World and lost ten stone in eighteen months.
June 2003. My confidence soared but unfortunately so did my sex drive. I started a new job and met someone through work. My lover was also older than me by seventeen years. The affair lasted for 4 and a half years and was the most passionate exciting and loving time of my life.
March 2006. My husband had a massive heart attack which has led to disabilities and loss of some lung function. I did run the affair alongside caring for hubby until Jan 2008 when i ended the affair. At this point i will say it probably would have come to an end anyway. My lover did have emotionally abusive tendencies which i have actually discussed on another forum.
However since the affair ended all that while ago i have been overeating and put a lot of weight back on. I have started back at SW and am trying to lose it but i have been feeling depressed. My husband didnt just stop the sex 15 years ago. There have been no hugs no touching of ANY description.I feel so lonely and am sort of scared of being slim again. I think part of me thinks that if i am overweight no one will fancy me and i wont be tempted into another affair.But i long to be kissed and touched and stoked and held much more than i long for the actual sex act. Before the affair i asked my husband to go for counselling for seven years but he refused. He has never liked kissing much. He stopped affections TEN years before his heart attack.But partners of ill people need some comfort in life too. We are carers not saints hence my username. Great site by the way xx

Wow 10 stone in eighteen months!! I have to ask, was that diet and exercise alone?

Also curious as to why you married him after 2 years of him withdrawing sex/affection etc.

I guess because i didnt have much confidence and i still loved him at that point and hoped it could be sorted out. I was also 19 stone in 1998 and knew damn well that no one would want me anyway.
And i think we learn by example. The day after i moved out of the parental home,my mum moved into my bedroom. I have recently discovered that she has been withholding affections from my dad for many many many years.
Three months ago she found a receipt from a jewellers for an expensive bracelet. My dad had been seeing someone but he told her it hadnt progressed to the physical stage yet.My parents are both 75. i only know all this because mum has been confiding in me because she has no one else to talk to. My dad was involved with someone thirty years ago when i was 8 years old. i remember the arguments and the fighting and my mum opening the door of our moving car when we were all driving back from my grandparents and threatening to jump out.
Though my mum has been confiding in me it has been really fucking hard to bite my toungue and not say "Well if you withhold yourself from him what on earth do you expect.
Ive just realised my dad and me have a lot in common but i still could never discuss this with him. Its just too personal.

Sorry Fairienuff i should have said, Yes it was the sw plan but i didnt really do any excercise as i was working nights back then. I think it was partly the stress from that job where i was when i started at SW in 2002.
You would NOT believe the office politics that go on in a sex chatline office lol.
I am back at SW now fighting to reverse the damage of comfort eating. Unfortunately i am over 16 stone at the moment but the first time i started at 21 stone so at least ive stopped before getting up that high again.

That's bloody fantastic weight loss carer and I am sure with that kind of determination you can get back to where you want to be again. Well done. I know you have not asked for my opinion on this, so if it's out of line I apologise, but have you considered separating from your DH. If he is witholding affection and refusing to consider counselling it seems that he is exhibiting cruel and controlling behaviour which you should not have to put up with. Good luck with sw, you go girl!

Thankyou Fairienuff and there is no need to apologise. I appreciate your advice. In fact in the last couple of years or so i have took a deep breath and broached this subject with my DH and in my case he has given me permission to go elsewhere. Well his exact words were "You do whatever you need to do" he also said to be safe and to be discreet about it.
I made the decision to tell my mum about the affair back in 2003 when it started. Blimey what a mistake. She is Italian and Catholic and all she could go on about at the time was the shame and what other people would think.
However DH does have good qualities and it wasnt cos of Mums crying and hand waving over it that i have stayed.
My DH is responsible and i dont have to worry about him being irresponsible and spending money on xbox games booze whatever etc instead of paying the bills. I have seen some shocking threads on message boards about domestic and financial abuse by partners. I have been with him since i was 19 and he has taught me a lot about life not just money management. We have a close bond its just not a sexual one. its more like brother and sister. I know it probably makes no sense but its like our relationship has evolved into something else. I dont think he feels any sexual jealousy anymore or perhaps he has realised that he has no right to. God ive just realised how weird this must sound but in the past week ive been crying a lot and all i have wanted is for someone to hold me in bed at night and stroke my hair.
Think ive just realised i might need some counselling as im welling up now and can barely see the screen. My God i sound really selfish and self indulgent. There are so many people much worse off than i am. Im sorry.

Very interesting discussion.
How about where a partner just doesn't fancy their dp any more?
My dh doesn't seem to find me that attractive although I'm neither old, nor ugly, nor particularly overweight.

It's very difficult at times but I still don't think I have a right to look elsewhere. If it got to that point, then I should leave the relationship rather than go behind his back and I hope he would do the same if there is someone out there who can actually tempt him into it.

We have no physical intimacy of any sort really.

Carer: Well your first husband was a complete prick and a borderline pedophile (A 42 year old wanting to marry a 19 year old and then abuse her and not have sex with her? Complete shitbag who can only be happy when he's asserting power over someone he percieves as weaker or lesser than him). It sounds to me as though you have been surrounded by abusive dysfunctional people all your life, which unfortunately makes it very hard to break out and build a life of your own. WHICH YOU ARE TOTALLY ENTITLED TO.
Seriously, have a think about getting some counselling for yourself. You can get the rough basics of a newer, better, healthier way of thinking on MN, especially on the feminist boards - YOu do NOT have to spend the rest of your life looking after a man who has been taking advantage of you for years.

It's an unreasonable demand and talking in terms of vows it's a breach of those too.

You do have a right to sex in a Christian marriage. Its what marriage is all about - breeding. Any Vicar or Priest or any other cleric will say so. But of course in a loving way.
The most difficult situation is impotence. I think that is then classed as illness and comes under 'in sickness and in health'
But try talking to an impotent man about it!!! No bleedin way!!!!

carer you were very young when you entered this relationship and maybe your self-esteem was a little low. Have you considered starting a thread about how you feel now, to get some advice? I am sure you do not want to stay in a relationship like this for another twenty years? I am sorry if this upsets you, that's really not my intention. I think you could have a really good think about what you want and get lots of help and advice from others who have been in similar situations. An unhappy marriage (for whatever reason) is not uncommon on these boards. Whatever you decide, it might be worth seeking counselling just for yourself.

I would like to thank everyone who replied to me on this thread.You have all been so helpful and kind. I have decided to ask my GP to refer me for counselling as i think it could help. Lately i have been fantasising about the odd TV actor as a form of sexual fantasy i think. I went to a friends 40th birthday recently (we had our nails done in a salon and then went for a meal) I went to the bar to get my mate a birthday drink and this young bloke started talking to me and then pushed a tequila shot towards me which i politely declined. He was only 23 lol. It made me feel a little bit better but then also reminded me what i could be missing out on. Nothing would have happened though. 23 is too young for me.
I know now though that i cannot go on like this. I cannot go through life never having any intimacy ever again. I think the enormity of it hit me like a tidal wave recently. Maybe because my best friend just turned 40 and so will i in two years time.
So what i am going to do is ,knuckle down and lose the weight while getting some counselling and then maybe in a years time i might feel more confident and see where i go from there.It is just the beginning of me making my life better.
On a different note i have an appointment for my smear test soon but as i am not sexually active i tend to find it quite painful. I take it that its still best that i have it done though. Thanks again everyone for being so kind.

Made an appointment with a GP for 12 Sept to ask for referral to a counsellor. That and SW are my first steps to making some much needed changes and hopefully sorting out the depression and the emotional pain. Thankyou everyone for helping me see that my feelings and needs are important too.

That's good hear. Good luck and hope all goes well with SW. See if you can factor in some exercise to get those 'feel good' endorphins too.