What do you do when you are one of those people who need solid proof...

[coproxamol]

but can't get it?

DH constantly on his phone. He is so obviously messaging someone.
Have tried once to access his phone, but when I took it out of it's cover, it started counting, so I think he's got it on some kind of alarm system that lets him know when someone else (me) has opened it.

I am very, very suspiscious, but I am also one of those people who cannot break up a marriage on this alone. I need some sort of proof, even just one message that looks dodgy will be enough.
But how do I get this proof?

Anyone else been through this?

Grab it off him while he's messaging.

Umm ... you have asked him, I assume?

Nice name OP. Ask him what he is doing all the time on the phone??!!

Does he take it into bathroom with him or does the alarm thing protect it enough do you think? Anything else happening that arouses your suspicions?

Just to check, are there other things making you suspicious? Sending a lot of text messages in itself does not make me automatically think of the worst possible explanation (in my humble male opinion).

There are apps available that keep specified numbers completey secret,so you can't access certain message and number logs without using a password.

God, I did that once, grabbed it off him and it was an innocent email...that time.

Yes I have asked him, but he just says it's emails from people trying to sell him stuff for his business, but he spends a lot of time texting too, so he's not replying to those emails.
Anything else suspisious? That's a tricky one. In the past he has been caught out by me regarding texts and messages on Facebook. Also, he works for himself, so he could very easily spend a hour or so with someone else whilst 'at work' and I would not know about it.

As I have had 'talks' with him before about my not fully trusting him, he has always told me I am being paranoid....but I don't think I am.
But I do feel that some kind of proof would be necessary in order for me to kick him out.
Atm I just feel that he is revelling in the fact that he knows I have suspicions but no proof.

Of course the acid test is if he's still shagging you on a regular basis.

Well, I don't think that test really works actually.
If he is shagging someone else, he could be shagging me just the same. People always say that the more sex you have, the more you want it. So he could easily be servicing both of us.
Also, he could be keeping up the shags to put me off the scent (it's not working).

The crux of thing, I think, is that you've told him you don't trust him (you feel insecure in your relationship) and he turns it round to make that your fault. A partner who cares about your feelings will do whatever they reasonably can to help you feel better. That would certainly include letting you have a good trawl through his phone.

I wish I'd understood this simple fact!! Still, better late than never ... When you 'caught' him before, was that about inappropriate messaging? I'd say, give him a decent chance by explaining how the previous episode made you feel and ask him to work with you on it - by handing his phone over.

If he still plays his face, you've got definite evidence of one thing: he cares more about his phone messages than he does about you.

garlicnutter speaks great sense.

There's no way he would hand over his phone without clearing any incriminating stuff off it first, so it would be pointless really.
It's like men who delete certain bits of their internet history....they just leave the innocent stuff on don't they?
Let's face it, once they've been caught out they just up their game, get more savvy about hiding stuff, then carry on in the knowledge that the wifey has no way of accumulating any real evidence.
My DH has the ability to act like butter wouldn't melt, as "how can you possibly suspect ME of doing anything like that, I'm just so innocent".

If you don't believe him when he answers your questions then let's face it surely the relationship is over?

Once they work out you're suspicious, they just get better at hiding stuff. You're right, there is no way he'll hand over the phone without deleting whatever you want to find from it first. But I suppose the test there is, ask him out of the blue to look through the phone. ANY excuses not to give you it there and then and you have your answer.

Look, I know I am a guy. But I spend a lot of time emailing and texting from my phone for work and it is not because I am having an affair. If DW demanded to see my phone with no cause for suspicion I would be (IMO justifiably) upset and annoyed at her for not trusting me when she has no reason not to. Being married to someone does mean you need to trust them unless you are given a reason not to, and sending texts is not grounds for suspicion. TBH it sounds like even if he is not got someone else, you should not be in the relationship because you don't have enough trust to make it work.

A general question: would you be happy with your DPs inspecting all your letters, emails and texts to make sure you are faithful? Would you be ok if he started listening in on your phone calls? Some very strange ideas of acceptable things to demand of your OH on this thread.

Yes, MrMan, I would and did. XH thought he was proving a point by going through my stuff - but the real point was, he'd always had open access to it. Until I met him, I'd assumed you would allow your partner full access to your stuff, but that you wouldn't use it because you wouldn't feel the need to.

He couldn't believe I didn't read postcards addressed only to him - which should have told me which of us was the untrustworthy one!

It took somebody on a forum, eventually, to point out what I've tried to pass along here: IF YOUR PARTNER FEELS INSECURE, YOU CARE ABOUT THAT. You don't go all defensive and try to make them feel like shit.

too many 'points' in that post But I hope you got the point

garlic, am a bit confused by your last post.
Are you saying that you agree with MrMan, or not?

GN, I understand what you are saying. But here is my view: I would never want or ask for access unless I had a really good specific reason, and I wouldn't expect her to either. If she insisted of course I would let her look at whatever she wanted, but I would feel hurt and upset that she felt the need to. In other words: trust should not need to be maintained by random spot checks, iyswim?

Also, MrMan, I think, from past experience with DH, that I do have reason to be suspisious of his texting and extreme phone use. I have caught him previously sending innaproprite messages to another woman before. What made it worse was that she was a customer of his. This also leads me to wonder about what he is doing when he out 'at work'....chatting up female customers again?
And it is definitely not for work purposes whatever he is doing on it.

WTF is this alarm thing about? Is he a spy or something, it really sounds like he's hiding something.

But I agree if you're struggling to trust him anyway, is it really worth trying to find out? Maybe it's over anyway, really :(

I agree, Fuzz, but, like I stated at the beginning, I need some sort of proof, no matter how small, in order to be able to walk away from this marriage.
I cannot leave and remove 3 DCs from their home without something concrete, not just my instinct.

any other strange things you are aware of that dont add up other than the phone? does he use the pc at all? ever thought of a keylogger?

Basically, I think, as garlicnutter was trying to point out, if your partner feels insecure, you should care and try to assuage those feelings, not ignore or invalidate them, whic is what my DH is doing.

And no he is not a spy, but he obviously knows how I feel and has decided to 'invalidate' my feelings by putting an alarm on his phone.

It's not just the not trusting though, is it? the fact that he's not trying very hard to prove you have nothing to be worried about is an alarm to me.

No trust, no point.

I don't agree with MrMan. He said he would feel angry/defensive if his partner asked to look through his phone. He tried to support this by asking if we'd be happy for our partners to look through our stuff.

I said yes, I would be okay with that, and was okay with it when my X asked the same thing. While I expected him to trust me & respect my privacy, I never hid anything from him.

About reading the postcards: It honestly never crossed my mind to read his, even though it would be easy. XH couldn't believe I hadn't read them! That should have told me his idea of privacy was more like secrecy, not respect.

But those differences could have easily been worked out, if we'd had equal respect and concern for one another. The problem was that I felt insecure and he made it worse by calling me paranoid, intrusive, etc, etc.

If he cared about me, he would have been upset I felt like that, wouldn't he? He would have done whatever he could to help me feel safer in our marriage.

He didn't. He took more care to hide stuff, and told me I was being unreasonable. He was cheating. But I didn't find out until the marriage was already over.

I'm sorry my post was unclear!

Look, if you asked me something and I replied angrily - saying you were bonkers and didn't know your own mind - you wouldn't trust me, would you? You'd probably feel quite upset, annoyed and a bit thrown by it all. I'm just a stranger on the internet, and you know you should expect some consideration from me.

I think you should be able to expect more than that from your partner :(