What do you do when you are one of those people who need solid proof...

[coproxamol]

but can't get it?

DH constantly on his phone. He is so obviously messaging someone.
Have tried once to access his phone, but when I took it out of it's cover, it started counting, so I think he's got it on some kind of alarm system that lets him know when someone else (me) has opened it.

I am very, very suspiscious, but I am also one of those people who cannot break up a marriage on this alone. I need some sort of proof, even just one message that looks dodgy will be enough.
But how do I get this proof?

Anyone else been through this?

massive x-post ...

Can you look at his phone bill? Does he have a contract or PAYG? Does he get paper bills or online ones?

Check his bank account statements. Does he travel for work or stays out late. Is he the sort whom you know his schedule, or has he always been evasive or did he recently become evasive. Do his clothes/car sometimes smell of ladies' perfume. Unexplained hair of different colour/length on his clothes. Does he take phone calls in your presence. Can you open his personal mail and emails.

Can you afford a private detective?

He does get paper bills but I don't think he's messaging with text messages, IYSWIM.

He has a Blackberry and he is on Facebook, which he remarks about constantly. I think he is messaging privately somehow on his phone, which obviously is not showing on the bill.
I have looked up his wall on Facebook too, (which is where his other indescretions started), but if he's messaging privately then there's no way this will show up either.

I think, after I challenged him the last time, laying down the law on what was acceptable and what wasn't, he has just become sneakier and better at covering his tracks.

I have no qualms with finding anything out this time and am perfectly ready to walk, but I fear that just leaving on instinct alone is wrong.
I don't want to explain to DCs in later years that mummy left their father because she 'thought' he was being an arse. That's why I really need something solid to confront him with.

I don't want to upset your further but to me, it doesn't SOUND like your instict is wrong at all. I've had all this with my ex, if nothing to hide, why be so bloody secretive? my ex once (well, many time actually) accussed me of being unfaithful. I laughed and said "why the hell would I leave my phone around all over if I was upto no good on it??" so he said I was trying to use reverse psychology. I offered it to him, told him he could look at it whenever he wanted because I have absolutely nothing to hide and no reason to "Protect" my phone. He had a good root through it and was satisfied - but did he do the same with his phone? no way.

Same with facebook - my ex WAS pratting around on facebook but I only know because I worked out his password and read his private messages. He'd never use it in front of me like I did. FFS he'd even shut down the laptop when I walked in the room!!! talk about going out of your way to make someone think the worst!!

My take on the whole thing is, if you had nothing to hide, you wouldn't protect your phone and keep it glued to you and you wouldn't have facebook and emails under such strict conditions either. There is no room for secrecy in a relationship. Secrecy builds mistrust.

OK, I did not understand that he had given you reason to be suspicious with the Facebook business. Also somehow I missed your post when he had called you paranoid. Based on this I completely agree it sounds very fishy and you have strong reasons to question him, and the burden is on him to show you can trust him.

But back in the beginning, when all we knew was that he was sending text messages and had password protected his phone, I do not think that alone was enough to draw conclusions. Maybe others here are better than me at reading between lines

but why password protect your phone if you have nothing to hide?

I agree...and have been in v v similar position.

In December I 'wrote him a letter' telling him I give up. we had talked tens of times until I was blue in the face and it is only now reading garlics posts that I have had the lightbulb moment to realise that if there was nothing going on I should have only had that discussion once. Then if he cared about me it was his responsibility not to make me suspicious.

Anyway back to the letter. In it I had said something like...

Either you are continually lying to me, and that is wrong, or I am inappropriately questioning everything and that is wrong. Both scenarios ate wrong. There is nowhere to go from here I give up.

Do you know what happened after he read that letter? We met, we talked, he acknowledged I couldn't live like that but as far as his phone behaviour changed he stopped it vibrating so I didn't even hear the rumble (he had already turned ringtone off), but still kept it glued to him. He just checked it every 5 no.s to check if he had a text. He didn't realise I wasn't blind.

Having said that, I stayed with him til feb when I had irrefutable proof, cos like you I couldn't break up family on suspicion. In hindsight I should have kicked him out months/years ago.

My phone is protected with three levels of passwords including a random number you have to enter from a little plastic dohickey to see the emails. The whole phone can be remotely erased if needed. But that is because I work with very sensitive data for my work that would cause major upsets if I lost my phone and someone else saw it.

Yes I understand why you want concrete evidence. WWYD if you don't get it though? Say it goes on 6 more months and he gets sneakier (and by the sound of it enjoying playing you for a fool) - will you still wait?

As I said, I do understand you wanting proof to validate your actions, rather than the fact you think he's being an arse - but to me, there is no "think" about it - it seems like he is being an arse, whether he's cheating or not. That is all the reason you need, if you want it to be. Wait if you want - and I certainly hope you find proof either way - all I'm saying is, you don't absolutely have to. :)

If you are at the point of walking out and just need that final proof, I'd say get your ducks in a row in the meantime, well before you confront him.

Separate bank account for you, all his bank account numbers, his assets, where will you stay ... do you have children with him?

Then once you have the proof, you can just push the button, if that is what you want to do.

I so feel your pain.... Very similar situation.

To be honest what level of proof do you think you'll need? i mean if you do actually get into his phone and there's 'only' flirty messages but nothing concrete, what then?I only ask as someone who accepted the stupid explanation the first time (clearly wearing stupidity goggles).

I reckon that it's not worth pissing away your life feeling suspicious and jealous, to some extent you don't need solid proof, the point is that you are in a relationship where you don't trust your DP and frankly if he continues to act like this you never will.

Is that really what you want? waiting for 'proof' in my case is a handy way to avoid the reality that I need to end the damn thing; children or no children.

I know someone in a similar enough situation. The partner was deleting messages from the person they were having and affair with, as the messages came in. But if you do an internet (e.g. google) earch of "How to retrieve deleted text messages from mobile phone", or similar search, you will see how you can retrieve deleted messages from his phone (maybe you can get your hands on it while he is asleep?).

My friend did this and found proof of the affair. It does sound to me like you gut instincts (and his behaviour) are telling you something is wrong, so as he is being so secretive I think it would be ok to take his phone and have a look when he is not looking, and see if you can retrieve deleted messages if you need to (he may not have deleted everything anyway).

It seems to me that I am not the only person on here to have been taken for a ride by a DP/EXDP.
Trust me, I would love to go through his phone, but it's locked with a password or set to explode if anyone elses looks at it.
I did used to have access to his Facebook, but when we had our aforementioned set to, he changed his password.
Yes, it's very true that I don't actually need real proof in order to leave him, it would just be the push I need. I almost want to find something...and flirty messages alone would be enough this time.
Reverse physcology? Accussing me of being the one having an affair? Yes, we've also had that conversation. But, as I explained to him, with 3 small DCs and no opportunity ( or energy) to shag anyone else, it was so not real.
I have even trhreatened him with divorce with me throwing the wedding ring back at him. He didn't really put up what you would call a good fight.

I just think that he should try to take my feelings into consideration and put my mind at rest. Or at least have the balls to confess instead of leaving me in limbo only to find out in 10 years time that he's had OW all that time.

But then why would he do that when he thinks he can get away with having his cake and eating it?.

But then why would he do that when he thinks he can get away with having his cake and eating it?.

If you feel like this about someone then your relationship is over. Why are you still with him ?

Dump him and find someone you do trust and respect.

Hire someone?
www.privatedetectivescorporation.co.uk/matrimonialinvestigations.html
www.ukprivateinvestigators.com/matrimonial.htm
www.nig.co.uk/

I need some sort of proof, no matter how small, in order to be able to walk away from this marriage.

Um, actually I disagree. If you only require a little evidence to be able to go, then maybe it isn't so relevant what he's doing on the phone or otherwise.

On the other hand, maybe it is a very big deal indeed and the tiniest bit of proof is going to blow your world apart.

There are apps out there which divert all emails, texts etc from one sim card to another . You would get everything he gets, and sends. But do you really want to go down that road? Thing is, the more detective-like you act the more suspiciously he is forced to behave IME.

I don't envy you, I've been there and it didn't turn out well.

wisedup, what happened in your case?

As for private detective...little too weird for me. Do people really do that?

By the time I found out about the phone app it was too late, and I had evidence aplenty. I started out like you actually. Telling myself I just needed a bit of solid evidence to go on.

Thing was each time I uncovered a bit more, I told myself it wasn't quite enough to go on. I was frightened you see, hence the dilemma.

I did go to a private dick in the end, after the second OW, because by then I knew beyond doubt that he had been lying and cheating for a long time. At this point, I'd had an anonymous letter, my DD had been telling me he was fucking about, stbx was being extremely cruel, and then I did manage to get access to his work mobile and there were the texts between them.

The private dick traced him to the OW's home. they can put GPS tracers on cars which show where the driver is going. It's all quite impressive really. I didn't do that though, I'd kicked him out by then. I just needed an address to serve papers to and I got it within the hour. It was an enormous shock to hear the confirmation.

You know your DH better than anyone. Your intuition is telling you that your reality is far different to the one he is presenting you with. If you deny what your instincts are telling you and let him define the truth it's not a promising future is it?

That's what I mean when I say the views expressed here are not unbiased. They are the views of people who feel you are being done a disservice by your DH, and you are, if he is failing to either provide you with proper reassurance of his 'innocence' and commitment to you, or the truth, whatever that may be.

Either way, subterfuge is enormously debilitating to live with, it saps confidence and energy.